Only 2% of people on welfare tested for drugs in florida came up with positive drug tests.

Reopened

reply to post by Virole

Random urinalyses is completely effective. Masking sustains will be detected and they will told come back tomorrow to retest. if the masking substance in still in the urine or the urine is so diluted with water. its considered a positive for drugs. Well this is how it works for DOT personal. Airline Pilots, Trains operators, Truck Drivers. Trust me I know I have been drug tested over 30 time in ten years. Never once positive.

reply to post by conspiracy nut


It's hard to believe Rachel Maddow or anybody from any mainstream media outlet. Their word is not good enough.

Perhaps if there was an actual source for this? I wouldn't be surprised if the only drug they tested for was PCP or something obscure, and this is what kept the numbers down.

I have heard numbers ranging from 8% to 12% to even 36% or more.

Anyway the liberal swine that were whining that this would be totally unfair should be very happy that the number of welfare cases in Florida that use drugs is only at 2%, and I would expect that they will now fully support this program!

Originally posted by HattoriHanzou
reply to post by conspiracy nut

 

It's hard to believe Rachel Maddow or anybody from any mainstream media outlet. Their word is not good enough.

Perhaps if there was an actual source for this? I wouldn't be surprised if the only drug they tested for was PCP or something obscure, and this is what kept the numbers down.

I have heard numbers ranging from 8% to 12% to even 36% or more.

Anyway the liberal swine that were whining that this would be totally unfair should be very happy that the number of welfare cases in Florida that use drugs is only at 2%, and I would expect that they will now fully support this program!

if u follow the link and click on bold underlined phrases u will see more sources.

as for your second opinion how could any rational thinking person accept spending that kind of money to catch 2% of the people. any ways all points are mute when you think that money could have been better used to create jobs and get people off of welfare.

reply to post by conspiracy nut


Here is the thing, if they knew ahead of time about the test, then it is easy to get drugs out of your system before going in.

Also if it is a urinalysis, then people can take for instance their children's clean urine in and use that while in the restroom.

While attempting to help the children of welfare parents who are irresponsible, neglectful is an admirable idea, this type of testing was destined to fail.

Perhaps monthly screenings done onsite by blood prick.

Any way you look at it the criminal mind works in mysterious way and the worst of the worst would still get away with it.

Not to mention people who have family who work for the agencies always have a heads up and can inform others as to the situation in advance.

2% is a complete failure but not on catching welfare recipients who take narcotics ##snipped##

Not sure that was clear on my last post, 2% has to be an incorrect number because in all reality those numbers would be much much higher.

so basically any way you cut it people are not going to believe the stats and will cling to their assumption that people on welfare are drug addicted lazy leeches. bring the work back at fair wages that keep up with inflation and the economy and we wont have the welfare problem.

instead of spending money on programs like these the money should be spent creating jobs.

reply to post by conspiracy nut


If I have to take a drug test to EARN a paycheck then why should those on welfare, food stamps, receiving housing assistance, free phones, etc. not have to do the same to TAKE from hard working tax payers? Its not demonizing anybody! I think its only fair if they get to have all the things I pay for for free.

Originally posted by lee anoma

Originally posted by Virole
Not to play the devil's advocate but at my school there are 6 people I personally know that are on welfare and I saw first hand use drugs.

Wait so you are hanging around with drug addicted welfare recipients?
They can't be all that bad then, right?

Seriously though, I agree with the program but not the abuse of the program.
Corporate welfare, and the White-collar criminals that rob us all of are the real problem with this Country, not these crumb-chasers.

- Lee

I'm an atheist but I believe there are good little nuggets to be found everywhere. One that comes to mind is the biblical story of Jesus eating with sinners....

Jesus Calls Levi and Eats With Sinners-
15 While Jesus was having dinner at Levi’s house, many tax collectors and sinners were eating with him and his disciples, for there were many who followed him. 16 When the teachers of the law who were Pharisees saw him eating with the sinners and tax collectors, they asked his disciples: “Why does he eat with tax collectors and sinners?”

17 On hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”

I use to be heavy into drugs in my high school years but I quit all that while I was an exchange student in Quito, Ecuador. I've been around the world as a civilian and as a Marine and am now debt free and happy. So who would I hang around if I want to be a role model or help open people's eyes to other ways of life? Granted I'm not always around them, but it is pretty awesome when you see one of them admit that it's time to leave childish things behind and do something with their life.

Lastly, I know you just being funny but seemed like a good opportunity to say that. So many people judge the "sheep" but never go out and talk to them.

Originally posted by parrothead0333
reply to post by conspiracy nut

 

If I have to take a drug test to EARN a paycheck then why should those on welfare, food stamps, receiving housing assistance, free phones, etc. not have to do the same to TAKE from hard working tax payers? Its not demonizing anybody! I think its only fair if they get to have all the things I pay for for free.

edit on 4-3-2013 by parrothead0333 because: (no reason given)

Every time, people come around with this argument, and every time, they ignore the fact that you dont HAVE to take a drug test to get a job. You VOLUNTEER to take a drug test to get specific jobs.

reply to post by antar

Not sure that was clear on my last post, 2% has to be an incorrect number because in all reality those numbers would be much much higher.

That number might be a little more accurate than you think, because, 90% of entitlement benefits go to the elderly, seriously disabled, and to working families. The majority of the remaining amount goes out in the form of medical care, unemployment insurance (which requires a work history), and social security benefits.

This was pointed out in my previous post in this thread.

This notion that drug addicted, lazy, welfare queens who abuse the system being the 'norm' of benefit recipients, is misguided and simply not accurate. While it is true in a minority of instances, it is still a generalization.

Originally posted by Virole
Lastly, I know you just being funny but seemed like a good opportunity to say that. So many people judge the "sheep" but never go out and talk to them.

Not me.

I grew up in a house with addicts, and now I live in a house with recovering addicts.
I speak to them everyday. Even when they've obviously relapsed.

To be honest, I thought you were trying to say that the number of 2% was too low because you know a number of recipients on drugs and the rest are probably cheating the tests so that sounded a bit judgmental to me since there is no evidence that this is happening...hence the (sort of) joke. Maybe I misunderstood your point but that is what it seemed to be.

As far as my opinion of the percentage being correct or higher, I couldn't care.
I don't care if it is 2% or 20%.

I think welfare scammers and cheats are a non-issue when it comes to the theft of the American dream. They don't even own a full slice of the cake being hauled away on a regular basis. Not even half.

Unless we take down these corrupt politicians, lobbyists, banksters, the corporations that beg for tax dollars then find loopholes so that they pay practically NONE (or put their dollars offshore) and other white-collar criminals bleeding us of what we are due, then we're going to get the crash we deserve.

This is just a distraction being played on the gullible by the wealthy elite and crafty pundits who don't want you looking at their own cooked books. They aren't like 'us'. We couldn't even afford to be in their circles. But they cry and hold up the American flag and tell you who to be angry at for desecrating it this week.

They even go so far as to jump head first into the conspiracy territory to tap into another market of the angry and confused. They claim to represent us and then get on national TV to scream, threaten, rant and rave and we astoundingly cheer them on like they've delivered a major blow to the elitists they serve.

Now who would have thought I'd be agreeing with the friggin' Red Skull?
I thought it was Captain America that was supposed to make sense.



It's obvious who that is...isn't it?

It's a joke.
A big fat joke with a Cuban cigar in its mouth.

To them we are all the poor, and so the game is to have the fight be the poor vs poor while they claim to have our best interests at heart in an indestructible palace that is recession-proof.

Again, that 2% or greater are just crumb-chasers.
It's either we get the guy running with the cake or shut-up altogether in my opinion.

Or...fight each other to the death in the colosseum, while they sit in box seats with a good view.

- Lee

Aren't most drugs undetectable after a day or 2?

So, I think the only people they'd catch anyways would be pot heads.

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
not a huge fan of rachel maddow so bear with me on the source

mods sorry if i put this thread in the wrong forum.

drug testing people on welfare.

‎"Only about 2% of applicants tested positive, and Florida was forced to reimburse everyone else for the cost of the drug test, plus pay for staff and administrative costs for the drug-testing program, plus pay the legal fees to defend the policy against court challenges -- and the challenges were successful."

i found this tidbit of information very interesting. lets stop demonizing welfare recipients and find a way to bring the jobs back to america and put these people back to work! perhaps government assistance getting these people to move to a place where there is available work.

They only test around 4000 people. Think of it this way. You get a letter saying that you need to be tested for drugs to collect welfare. You need to do this in a certain amount of time. Who do you think will be the first 4000 people to run and get tested. Probably the people not on drugs.

well, the program was fail to begin with when you have to make the person pay for own test, they should have incorporated that with the procedure and they wouldnt have had that much backlash.

also, it really isnt that hard to pass most drug test at least for herbal drugs there are products like goldseal ect ect, and if they are not random testings and or multiple random tests in a period of time you can stop taking the drugs a week or two before and clean out system. i know may seem like a lot of work, but we are talking mostly about the retards that dont want to work and will actually go through more work to get out of work and get "free money" lol.

same type of kids in school that would spend more time trying to cheat than actually spending the time studying lol.

"Having begun the drug testing in mid-July, the state Department of Children and Families is still tabulating the results. But at least 1,000 welfare applicants took the drug tests through mid-August, according to the department, which expects at least 1,500 applicants to take the tests monthly.

"So far, they say, about 2 percent of applicants are failing the test; another 2 percent are not completing the application process, for reasons unspecified.
Cost of the tests averages about $30. Assuming that 1,000 to 1,500 applicants take the test every month, the state will owe about $28,800-$43,200 monthly in reimbursements to those who test drug-free.
That compares with roughly $32,200-$48,200 the state may save on one month's worth of rejected applicants.
The savings assume that 20 to 30 people -- 2 percent of 1,000 to 1,500 tested -- fail the drug test every month. On average, a welfare recipient costs the state $134 in monthly benefits, which the rejected applicants won't get, saving the state $2,680-$3,350 per month." article


i would say that had the program set up free tests and a more random checking system that 2% would be much higher, and take into account this is only half, 2% of people dont even finsh gee wonder why? maybe if they were FORCED to take it they would fail? is that the 2% thats using harder than herbal and cant clean out. id bet money on it lol heh.

so we can really say its 4% and thats on a monthly basis, MONTHLY BASIS , i would say thats pretty damn good. the real thing holding this back is the 30 $ test, wtf is that, pee in a cup, put into a machine, it spins around and spits out data, im pretty sure if we drop who ever is supplying the contract and make a generic test we could get that down to 2.50$. and even if its the blood work version its not like it cutting edge tech its been around for years, plastic syringes and drop who ever has contract to make a generic contract still make that less than 5-10 bucks.

now mind you i am all for LIMITED support for anyone in a country , be it a single mom , to the lunatic crazy man peeing his pants on the corner, but if you CAN AFFORD DRUGS you dont need my assistance cause i can barely AFFORD MINE ^^

reply to post by WaterBottle


Agreed this was a con. They just wanted to make it look like they were doing us a favor, but it cant be further from the truth.

reply to post by conspiracy nut


Not much... Please, don't try it in Hollywood



They are 50% actors and musicians...

reply to post by St Udio


You sound scared...

Originally posted by Hopechest

Originally posted by MyHappyDogShiner
reply to post by Hopechest

 

One must consider how much economic activity is generated by consumers who cannot afford to consume without help,the economy would collapse overnight without them .

It's kinda like bailing out an economy that can't survive without the participation of those who would otherwise die.

Things have been wrong for a long time,we need to adopt a different economic model,but those in power benefit from it too much to allow changes to occur that are needed for everyone.

Times do change,but money is a doorstop which keeps doors open that should have closed long ago.

I would say you have a point except that there was a time when there was no welfare, government approved, and the country did just fine. We progressed forward.

The government needs to get out of the daily lives of individuals, this is where the majority of our problems are coming from, they are there to deal with security to our nation and interactions in the global community. Helping people for making poor decisions is not a task I can find anywhere in the Constitution.

I'm sorry but your thinking is outdated and quite frankly dangerous to all of us.

The time you talk of...we didn't have 300 million people living here! So yeah if you live in a town of 300 people you can wish government get out of the lives of people...heck most of that town can be cousins LOL. However a large segment of our population live in large cities where government interaction is necessary.

Originally posted by jhn7537

Originally posted by daryllyn
It just goes to show that the stereotype of the lazy, drug addicted, welfare queen sitting atop her throne of government cheese is not nearly as common as some would have everyone believe.

edit on 3-3-2013 by daryllyn because: (no reason given)

To be honest, it's not that hard to pass a drug test even when you use... There are numerous masking/cleansing products out there and there are "other" means of passing drug tests, like the Whizzinator... I'm just saying that it's very possible, quite easy, and lots of people who use are clever and know how to do one with the other.

As someone who has worked in welfare for the past 8 years, it's a complete myth that welfare customers are druggies.

They don't have the discipline to qualify and remain on welfare. You know there is a federal (though I believe Obama just obolished this) and State requirement that recipients be engaged in an activity for 30-40 hours per week. Druggies don't have what it takes to do this for a measly $200 per month.