Remember the whole "United we stand, Divided we fall"? What happened to that?

This is the first thread I have created on ATS, I've seen what happened to other people when they post threads, kinda scary. Still, I am curious about your opinions on the bull that's going on in congress. Why are we working so hard to stay at each others throats. Rather then trying to find common ground, I keep hearing people yell about civil war. Is that what you really want? Brother killing brother? Our bloodiest battles were during the Civil War. Have we forgotten that? I would think that is the worst case scenario that no sane person would ever want. I know the libs want to take your guns, I hear about it nonstop, even though many of us libs are responsible gun owners ourselves. That is in every headline everywhere, and I am going to address it for a second even though that's not exactly what this post is about. It plays a role in the whole mess so needs mentioned. I almost would call that a non issue, because I personally do not believe guns are the real issue but rather a way to divert us from addressing the real issues going on in society. If both sides were not so busy screaming about guns maybe we could sit down and look at the reasons people are using guns to kill each other, like lack of health care (mentally unbalanced people committing crimes) and the lack of jobs and poor economy (we had an armed robbery at a grocery store in my small town, the woman was stealing food for her children). I say this knowing if we ignore the pro/anti gun issue, then we can get all partisan and fight with each other about who deserves health care and food. Starving people and sick people that are not helped are not a good thing, impoverished areas have more crime. It's not just because they are inherently bad people, but they are desperate in many cases. When you are desperate, raised in a not so good way, you are just not going to be equipped to make decent choices. Our society is sick, and by arguing about non issues like guns we are basically debating cough medicine and allergy medicine because we have a cough due to pneumonia. These are huge issues we need to come together as a country and solve, and fighting with threats of revolution solve none of these problems, they create all new ones.

A good example of this lack of coming together happened this week with the sequestration. The hardcore libs want to expand government spending and raise taxes, the conservatives want to not raise taxes and cut spending. I can see where this would cause a disagreement. Then we have a voice of reason propose that we make some spending cuts and raise a few taxes. A nice bipartisan approach that doesn't overly hurt either side. Instead of saying ok lets agree to this and get stuff done, enough members of congress refused to compromise in any way. Automatic spending cuts, which are a drop in the barrel in total spending but do damage to our economy, are going into effect. Oh, and since most people don't realize this, those cuts were proposed by the Dem. leader and signed in by the President as a way to combat inaction and force compromise.

Here is what I think, I think we all need to basically sit down like the small children we are acting like (this goes for both sides) and put it all on the table. We need to look at each issue as a symptom of the health of our society and try to find real solutions. Both sides won't always agree, but try to find things that will work in the middle, take approaches from each side. What we are doing now is not working, so why not try something new. If it don't work, then we try something else.

reply to post by redneckprincess


I, personally, don't want them to work together. It isn't like if they magically come to terms on one single deal to eliminate pennies from out future debt that they are somehow going to change the outcome of our country or the way they act towards the wills of the people.

The sequester is a dog and pony show of magnanimous proportions and should nothing go through it will only quicken the pace that this country takes the necessary steps it needs for the economy to truly recede so that it can be rebuilt. Even if some miraculous last minute deal occurs to show the "greatness and workmanship" of our leaders, it will amount for little to nothing in the big picture for America and the path we are on. The politicians will continue doing exactly what they have been doing and one of two things will happen before long.

Civil unrest (revolution) or total economic collapse. It is inevitable that one of these things would happen. I can only hope that it is the first of the two, because economic collapse would only allow us to rebuild this crap hole in the same exact image it is now, only to repeat the mistakes again and again. If the people actually stand up for change, we might be able to get something on the books that can prevent this situation from occurring or at least reduce the risks drastically for centuries to come in our country's future.

But until then... we wait and we accept the rotten cake that Washington feeds us.

The current administration can't even spell compromise. They want this sequester. They want to vilify Republicans to destroy the two party system. They could cut spending in a way so as not to hurt the public. They will however choose the worst thing to cut in order to vilify the Right. They planned this event. Just watch, the media will be all over the bad effects that the Left will choose to cut and vilify the Right for them.

reply to post by redneckprincess

Remember the whole "United we stand, Divided we fall"? What happened to that?

If ATS is any indication of where we are at socially and politically as a nation....I guess it's "divided we fall" because so many don't want to accept the results of the last election and absolutely refuse to compromise.
They would rather see America fail, as long as they can blame it on someone else.

Tell me when we were ever united? Mankind has know nothing but division since as far back as history cares to recall. Fact is we have always been divided. Religion is the main culprit, history teaches us this. Cultural differences based on some arbitrary beliefs is another. in order for us to become united we must either rid ourselves of dogmatic beliefs or find something we all have in common, that we can all agree on. I can see neither happening anytime soon. As it stands, mankind is doomedd to failure.

reply to post by redneckprincess


redneckprincess, the air was very different when the whole "United we stand, Together we fall" lingo started floating around and for about 5-6 months I noticed a big difference in society here in the states. Especially in the North... I know... Darn yankees!~ There seemed to be pride in being an American citizen and anyone who wasn't.... Well guess they weren't part of the cool club

I believe that same energy is still roaming around the states though not the way it was back when "They took our towers".... It's more hush hush though, think about it. Everytime I go to get gas, the store or anywhere else. Do you still make that eye contact you did after 9/11 giving the pre-verbial head nod like "What's up my fellow Countryman, see any terrorists around?" a quick smile and you were on your way.

Just my thoughts though~ I'll SnF because I never met a redneckprincess before.... You can call me a PolishPhilaBilly~

There's no such thing as compromise. Not good compromise anyway. All you get is "3/5ths a person" kind of crap when you compromise.

I love the sequester. I wish it was a lot more. I want to see it all come down.

reply to post by redneckprincess


We are now, the proverbial 'house divided unto itself' and so long as we are, the various powers that be will do as they damned please.

So long as we are so polarized, so unable to criticize those of preferred political branding and so doctrine-inclined against others because of their political leanings, we will never be able to exercise the power of We the People because, quite frankly, there is no 'we' to the people.

reply to post by redneckprincess


What happened to that? Divide and conquer. Democrat/Republican happened to that.....

Other then the guy saying he wants to see it all fall (and for some reason I now have a tool song stuck in my head) I think we all are agreeing that we are divided and that allows the mythical powers that be do do what they want. Now I only say mythical because we have built these people up as almost more then human, when all they are are people who are taking advantage of a broken system. No one likes to compromise, but sometimes we have too. I almost look at it like they are all a bunch of kids fighting about what toy to play with. Some are willing to compromise but enough of them are the type that will just take their ball and go home that there is no solution left and no one is happy.

Personally, I see fault on all sides. I think there has to be a way to get them to reevaluate what is being done in government. I am obviously big on social programs, but I think every single program needs to be looked at and the fat trimmed from them along with some changes to the tax code to put us more along the lines of Clinton era tax rates. If we did both, we could balance the budget and maybe have the means to start addressing societal problems in this country.

Oh, and for just one person, a redneck princess is a female that shoots, hunts, runs barefoot in the woods, then comes home and breaks out the latest fashions for a night out. I got the nickname back in college :p

The progressives never compromise. Ever.

Remember, Obama said they're(republicans) gonna have to sit it the back.

Who is dividing who.

reply to post by bjax9er


I disagree with you that the progressives never compromise. The healthcare bill, which most people on both sides don't really like, was a compromise by the progressives. What we wanted was full socialized healthcare, to get any form of healthcare reform we have to give up half of what we wanted to get it passed. I would say that is a compromise when the majority of Americans voted for a leader saying he would give us health care reform. The original stance on the budget by progressives was to jack up taxes and absolutely not touch any social programs. They were willing to try and meet half way by giving up their stance on never touching any social programs. You have to look at both sides not just one side. When you look at something only one way, it would seem that the other side never gives in. You think that the social programs need to be reformed. The other side disagrees. When they finally say we will allow for some reform if you allow for something we want that you don't, that is a compromise.

Originally posted by redneckprincess
Rather then trying to find common ground, I keep hearing people yell about civil war. Is that what you really want? Brother killing brother? Our bloodiest battles were during the Civil War. Have we forgotten that? I would think that is the worst case scenario that no sane person would ever want.

A perfect example of our insanity is people advocating "common ground" among politicians that think the criminals in Wall Street, the Central Banksters and members of our political machine are too-big-to-fail and too-big-to-prosecute. The concept is totally alien to me. How could anyone think these politicians give a rat's %$# about the common man?

I don't claim to be privy to our politician's agenda -- but rest assured their agenda is not being driven for our benefit. It is possible that this defacto coup could lead to bloodshed. If that happens, I sincerely hope these dirty politicians and their enforcement bureaus are the very first victims.

reply to post by redneckprincess


yeah and socialized medicine is what you are going to get.

obamacare doesn't reform anything.

it is going to force insurance companies out of business, and the people onto the gov't plan.

and not one republican voted for obamacare.
how is that a comprimise?

regulations released just today, tax insurance providers $100 billion over the next ten years.

do you think providers are going to pay out out of their pocket, or pass it on to you?


obamacare is the most destructive piece of legislation ever...