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Should a permit be required to have babies?

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posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 05:47 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by danielsil18
 


No, you should NOT need a permit just to have a baby. That is completely unnatural. What's next, needing a permit to use the bathroom?


Don't schools already have hall/bathroom passes


We're doomed


Carbon taxes are really going to hit hard on people with major flatulence in the coming future.




posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 06:41 AM
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While i consider the right to pass on and maintain the line of our individual genetic heritage IS a fundamental Human right, i have given a lot of thought to the OP's premise over the years.

The right to have children is a basic Human right...however, there is more to it than that.

The way things are in society, where we are seeing essentially children having children, or the totally inept passing along their ineptitude to their unfortunate offspring needs to be tackled and addressed, by legislation if need be.

I'm not talking about denying the right to carry on your genetic line, but a huge shift in our attitudes to our children and their upbringing needs to happen imo.

In recent decades the emphasis has shifted from care of and aspirations for our children, to economic aspirations and higher comfort and luxury levels for ourselves.

As a society we are increasingly driven by what we can achieve in our careers, driven to earn a higher salary or wage, and by virtue of those, possess larger properties, with a higher standard of furnishings and gadgets, and newer vehicles, international travel and richer social activities.

We are not children focused as we once were, and imo, should be again.

Personally, i'd really rather live in a basic property, take vastly lower income and focus all leisure activities around our children and generally BE with our kids more than not be with them.

There isn't a more valuable investment of time and energy we as human beings can possibly make, than that invested into our children and their upbringing, no career, no job, no amount of money in the bank...nothing comes remotely close. But for many parents, they don't or won't appreciate the reality of that position, and will often claim they are doing both....they're not. They might try to convince themselves they are, but really they are not.

Schools have a huge role to play too. We should train our children, while they are at school how to be good parents. It's not necassarily about a parent being blessed with a high IQ, as anyone who has a good heart and willingness to be the kind of parent their children deserve can be trained how to parent.

I would suggest that from the ages of 12 upwards, parenting classes (not talking about sex education btw) should be part of the regular national curriculum and taught to both boys and girls.

Parents should be more valued by society than they currently are. A BAD parent will almost always create offspring that when looked at on national levels, become a huge burden on society in many ways.

Financially, money wasted on social services, to constantly visit bad parents and check they have 'remembered to feed or change their babies' (yeah, but it does happen), money wasted on the effects of a lot of these kids indulging in vandalism and mindless destruction of infrastructure and private property, money and resources wasted on policing these kids and the criminal justice 'merry-go-round' that we see time and again being applied to them.

Arrested - booked - court - prison/community service - probation - arrest - booked - court - prison/community service, around and around they go.

The cost in community quality of life is not insignificant, with many people hesitant or simply too afraid to run the gauntlet of hoards of so-called 'latch-key-kids', whose parents are physically not there when they return home from school, because they are too busy with their careers or jobs to actually carry about their more important job of being a good parent.

Effective parenting education for children while at school, emphasising key roles and responsibilities and insights of parenting, encouraging the restructuring of general social attitudes to parents and good parenting practices and recognising the enormous and often overlooked benefit to society that are the obvious knock on effects of raising stable, respectful and good kids, is what will stop the rot.

If these issues are not addressed and soon, the rot will continue and society, like many communities have aready, will continue the inevitable and steady decline into entropy and disorder.

For those parents whom for whatever reason, cannot or will not or are ambivalent to the emotional and parenting needs of their children, while should not lose the right to procreate, but ultimately should lose the right to negatively impact the lives of those children, and demonstrating the consistent failing to take proper care of their children means they should lose the right to be a parent.

The child in those circumstances should be removed from them and placed with parents who will do as they should have done themselves which is to love and care for the kids, and endevour to live life FOR the children, not in spite of them.

Just my opinion.



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 08:46 AM
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Yes I think the ghetto trash folks should. And when their spawn at 15 starts gangbanging the parents should be fined and sterilized.


Gs



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 08:54 AM
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Yep! Just what we need, more government intrusion in our lives. About as good an idea as having to get a friggin' license to get married.



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 09:58 AM
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200 years ago, the human lifespan was shorter and the mere sight of a 12 or 13 year old pregnant girl was commonplace and not thought of as in any way offensive or undesirable.

Fast forward 200 years, and we keep hearing about Children having children and all of the moral high ground about who should and shouldn't be allowed to have kids and it's getting very old very fast. Just remember, this is only a 200 year difference between mindsets, and lifespan lengthening. 200 years.. that's all...

Think about that before you start down the "People need permits to reproduce" or "OMG It's children having children"


Personal disclosure: I don't personally think that girls should be having children at age 13, 14, 15 16, 17 or 18 but it happens, and it has happened for hundreds of thousands of years before the current era of Man....



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 10:17 AM
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reply to post by danielsil18
 


Should a permit be required to have a child? Considering the classes and educational courses and all the books and videos and laws that currently exist regarding parenting, all that's missing is that piece of paper certifying you to be an eligible parent.

So yeah, I say go for it. If that's what it takes to make sure that every child has a chance to become a healthy adult, then by all means, do it. The children are our future - what aren't we willing to do to give them that chance?



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 11:14 AM
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I agree with you that not every should have the right to have babies; however, almost everyone has the ABILITY to. A piece of paper giving you permission to fornicate is not enforceable. The only option to prevent people from having children would be mass sterilization, and that's not only beyond immoral, but again, not enforceable.



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 11:17 AM
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reply to post by danielsil18
 


Just from the headline. I have to agree.
Some people shouldn't be allowed to breed.

And, I'll just leave it at that.



Shocker, guess they can't claim racism in this one.

Attitudes of some people.

Kids are product of their own parents, that's for sure.

That girl looks so familiar.
edit on 27-2-2013 by Manhater because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 12:31 PM
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My brother has had several babies.
Some got adopted, some are with their mothers as the fine citizens pay their taxes to support them.

Should permits be required to have babies?
HELL YES!!!

Anyone can breed..and it seems the least worthy breed the most.



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 12:33 PM
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Originally posted by SaturnFX
My brother has had several babies.
Some got adopted, some are with their mothers as the fine citizens pay their taxes to support them.

Should permits be required to have babies?
HELL YES!!!

Anyone can breed..and it seems the least worthy breed the most.
NO, we need more people for the upcoming war with China... Let them breed we need more people in the Military!!



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 12:39 PM
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Originally posted by starfoxxx

Originally posted by SaturnFX
My brother has had several babies.
Some got adopted, some are with their mothers as the fine citizens pay their taxes to support them.

Should permits be required to have babies?
HELL YES!!!

Anyone can breed..and it seems the least worthy breed the most.
NO, we need more people for the upcoming war with China... Let them breed we need more people in the Military!!

Military is being slowly replaced with robots. We don't need tons of cannon fodder anymore. We aren't fighting with muskets anymore.What you need are a handful of Nintendo warriors able to lag pilot drones and the like moreso than a front line (which pretty much doesn't exist anymore).



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 12:44 PM
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Originally posted by DestroyDestroyDestroy
I agree with you that not every should have the right to have babies; however, almost everyone has the ABILITY to. A piece of paper giving you permission to fornicate is not enforceable. The only option to prevent people from having children would be mass sterilization, and that's not only beyond immoral, but again, not enforceable.

or...

Only people whom willingly take temporary sterilization can qualify for any sort of assistance..be it student loans, food stamps, etc.

I know that minorities are disproportionately poor, but its not a racist stance I make...it will effect minorities more than Caucasians, but I don't see what else can be done outside of hiring millions of psychologists to give birthing licenses based on a very odd criteria.

Ultimately this will never, ever happen...so I think its acceptable to speculate. Its akin to speculating about who should be made vampires overall (I say people with a deep appreciation for history on that subject btw...no point being immortal if you are not observing the ages you pass through with a degree of reverence).



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 01:05 PM
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Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by starfoxxx

Originally posted by SaturnFX
My brother has had several babies.
Some got adopted, some are with their mothers as the fine citizens pay their taxes to support them.

Should permits be required to have babies?
HELL YES!!!

Anyone can breed..and it seems the least worthy breed the most.
NO, we need more people for the upcoming war with China... Let them breed we need more people in the Military!!

Military is being slowly replaced with robots. We don't need tons of cannon fodder anymore. We aren't fighting with muskets anymore.What you need are a handful of Nintendo warriors able to lag pilot drones and the like moreso than a front line (which pretty much doesn't exist anymore).
Need all the people you could get if China sent in 2 million troops into japan.. which is not impossible.. You couldn't just nuke japan again in that situation.. So I say let them breed no permit.
edit on 27-2-2013 by starfoxxx because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 01:51 PM
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Absolutely!!!!!!! I think a policy similar to China's One Child Policy would benefit us greatly.


It restricts urban couples to only one child, while allowing additional children in several cases, including twins, rural couples, ethnic minorities, and couples who are both only children themselves.[2] In 2007, according to a spokesperson of the Committee on the One-Child Policy, approximately 35.9% of China's population was subject to a one-child restriction.[




It was created by the Chinese government to alleviate social, economic, and environmental problems in China,[4] and authorities claim that the policy has prevented more than 250 million births between 1980 and 2000,[2] and 400 million births from about 1979 to 2011;[5] this claim is disputed by two independent scholars, who put the number of prevented births from 1979 to 2009 at 100 million.[6]


en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 02:39 PM
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I'm very leery of people who think laws should govern natural biological functions. I may not like how someone else is rearing their children but I sure won't sanction denying them that function. Dig a ditch for someone else and you'll be the one lying in it so be careful about legislating a natural right.
edit on 27-2-2013 by Chai_An because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 02:47 PM
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Reply to post by danielsil18
 


Another good idea but its likely to be failure and have reversing effect thus more babies will be born, best let them sort out on their own individually.


 
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posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 03:06 PM
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I have 0 kids.

And living with 2 sisters.


I would sanction 0 kids.


It's not my choice though.



You and I are paying for it.

Joy, Joy.

Glad you have the money.




posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 03:08 PM
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reply to post by Manhater
 


I don't understand what your living situation and monetary assets have to do with supporting mandatory parenting permits?



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 03:18 PM
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Seriously, this makes me ill. I stopped reading after about the 50th repetition of "for a better society". I am the person this kind of thing would have targeted. I had 3 children, when I was very poor with no real way to take care of them. I worked my ass off, leaned on family for help and 20 years later, my 3 boys are a wonderful contribution to society. Everyone who has ever met them agree. How would it be a "better society" to have banned them from existing? The world is insane, people are lining up to throw their freedoms away for "a better society". How many times do we have to see an empire go this route with horrifying results before we stop even going there?



posted on Feb, 27 2013 @ 03:30 PM
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Originally posted by Endure
Seriously, this makes me ill. I stopped reading after about the 50th repetition of "for a better society". I am the person this kind of thing would have targeted. I had 3 children, when I was very poor with no real way to take care of them. I worked my ass off, leaned on family for help and 20 years later, my 3 boys are a wonderful contribution to society. Everyone who has ever met them agree. How would it be a "better society" to have banned them from existing? The world is insane, people are lining up to throw their freedoms away for "a better society". How many times do we have to see an empire go this route with horrifying results before we stop even going there?


You made a very good example thank you for sharing. All this "for a better society" stuff sound like something from A Brave New World or 1984, a society of unemotional people who make no decisions of their own.
edit on 27-2-2013 by Chai_An because: (no reason given)






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