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The Lost Civilizations of North America?

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posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 08:53 PM
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Hello

Tonight I'd like to present two videos for your consideration. I'm sorry if you're reading this and cannot watch the videos. The general premise is whether or not there was an ancient coast to coast civilization here in North America? Now many of you are already familiar with locations such as Monks Mound AKA Cohokia



The first short video describes the well known locations and goes into what we already know or believe we know about those inhabitants.

The second video is more speculative.

I've viewed both and have my own thoughts on the subject but before I go into those I'd like some members who are interested in this topic to view them for themselves first and then post what they think. Then hopefully the discussion will be interesting. If you are aware of other interesting or mysterious locations here in North America please provide links and pictures etc.


The Lost Civilizations of North America



The Lost Civilizations of North America

"The Lost Civilizations of North America" is a powerful film that gives answers to the question of why we haven’t heard about the great civilizations that existed on the North American continent and why theories about their origins have passed out of place and time.


Evidence for Ancient North American Civilization Discovered ( 3500 - 8500 Years Old!)



Pre-historic researcher John Jensen discussed evidence of canal systems that may have been built by an ancient civilization in the United States. Jensen explained that he first made this discovery while using Google Earth to research Civil War forts along the Mississippi River. It was then that he noticed an "eroded canal" beside a fort and, upon zooming the map view out, realized that it was merely a part of a much larger system of canals. In subsequent months, he uncovered over 250 sites which appear to have ancient canals, roads, or even strange symbols in the Earth. Rather than put forward a specific theory as to their origins, Jensen stressed that he is more focused on "'what is it' rather than 'why is it.'" Moving forward, he hopes for more on-site investigations of these formations in order to create a "time map" which will indicate the ages of these anomalies as well as when they were abandoned.

Jensen revealed that he has contacted "an array of individuals" from specializations such as archaeology, anthropology and geology, in the hopes of gaining some insight into these mysterious formations. Unfortunately, these attempts have been met with a "defining wall of silence" from academia. The lone response he did receive was from a graduate student who asserted that 100 percent of the canals were the result of oil exploration. A skeptical Jensen retorted that some of the canals have Cyprus trees "that appear to be quite large" growing in them, an attribute which would make modern origins for the formations "a little hard to explain." However, he was open minded about the possibility the formations could be modern and noted that he has already removed some sites where information has revealed their contemporary origins.




posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:02 PM
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interesting i still gotta wathc the vids will do when the woman gose to bed!



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:05 PM
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There were a number of these centers. There was one south/west of newark Ohio at Chillicothe. There was an old road between the two towns. Chillicothe had at one time two of the large earth "pyramids" but they were destroyed for their top soil at the birth of the steam shovel age.



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:14 PM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Something to consider:


Each of us was interviewed for this film. None of us was asked directly for our opinion on what turned out to be its underlying claim; that Old World civilizations played an active role in the development of Native American cultures, especially the mound builders. Instead, we were asked general questions about Native American societies, their remarkable technological achievements, genetic histories, and we were also asked to comment on the biases of many nineteenth-century historians and archaeologists concerning the abilities of the native people of North America. We fear that the context of our general remarks as they currently appear in the film might lead viewers to conclude that our words on these subjects provide support for the film’s claims. That would be a mistake. In fact, our remarks, if presented in an unedited form, show clearly that we reject the assertions made in the finished documentary concerning a non-native source for the complex cultures of Native America.


ohio-archaeology.blogspot.com...


Interesting...hopefully the truth emerges.





posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:15 PM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Bookmarking for when I get home.



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:29 PM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Interesting. I'm curious about the dating. 3500 years ago? Approximately 1500 BCE?

That would raise some issues, an established culture building structures, and studying astronomy? That would indicate advanced technology, and a resident population.

I'll have to research this a bit more.

Thanks for another great thread!



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:31 PM
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Quite interesting Slayer
I must admit this is the first time I have ever seen or heard of Monks Mound
Seems to me that the European conceit that a civilization must practice metallurgy has been at least one reason sites like this get glossed over. Seems quite a few civilizations fell into decline in the Americas before the Europeans saw to the last remaining. So many gaps in what we know about the America's history before the Europeans.



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:40 PM
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reply to post by hangedman13
 





I must admit this is the first time I have ever seen or heard of Monks Mound


Don't feel bad. My first time as well.

IMO, it is true how very little we Americans really know about our own country.



Great job on teaching me something new Slayer



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:40 PM
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Hi Slayer; an excellent topic, one which will generate pages of rich info, I'm sure. But before that, I do want to debunk the "ancient canals" alluded to in the video - they are modern creations.

From an earlier ATS topic: Ancient Canals in America


He seems to be assigning ancient origins to much later constructs. Some of these channels and canals he refers to were made in modern times. And from these negligible Google Earth images he's conjecturing "ancient pre-historic" civilizations. That is, plain and simple, very bad science.

He doesn't help his case but stating a "pre-diluvial America" (sic). I'll agree that there was a "biblical" flood, it occurred in Sumer perhaps around 2500-2400 BCE, the textual record of which was appropriated by the Hebrews for their bible, but there never was a single, world wide flood. America certainly may have enjoyed its share of floods and changing coast lines, but there has never been a "pre-diluvial" America.

If you want to see true Paleo-channels, Google that term, especially related to the Nile in Africa.



Interesting images presented on this site, but again, the majority of them are MODERN creations, not the handiwork of an ancient and lost civilization.


dredgingtoday.com
"Dredging operation on the Kissimmee River channel between Lake Hatchineha and Lake Kissimmee"



dredgingtoday.com
"Dredging operation on the Houma Navigation Canal"



This is clearly a dredging canal. The Army Corps of Engineers is responsible for most of these, without constant dredging these canals would quickly silt up. Within a few decades you would never know they were there. Some of these canals will stretch for miles, and some are abandoned. The siltation in gulf areas is rampant.

Biblical floods / antediluvian landscapes:

Of course the end of the ice age brought inundated coast lines, and impacted early mans coastal, river, or lake settlements. Doggerland vanished (who knows how many Neanderthal cave dwellings or settlements disappeared with that?), but this is straying into a straw-man argument. Displaying modern dredging canals and arguing that post ice-age flooding is proof of a vanished civilization doesn't really work for me.

I'm not arguing against the possibility of such, just that this guy is going to have to go a lot deeper than Google Earth images before he starts proclaiming an undiscovered civilization.


Not to toot my own horn but from a thread I posted a while back on ATS: Excavation of ancient Native American canal offers insight - gives a great insight into Amerindians canal building skills (at least in and around ancient Naples, FL). Hanslune made an excellent reply in that thread regarding the Tequesta, Tocobaga, Calusa, and the Hohokam people.

Cheers



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:42 PM
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reply to post by facelift
 


There have been many very very interesting things dug up from mounds here in the US. Things that have never been widly published but have found there way into reports ect. Its not that someone is trying to hide the lot of it, but that it wasnt noticed for what it was.

One of my favs is a set of well made glazed and painted figures dug up from a mound here in Ohio that represent the majior yoga positions....like the "thunderbolt" or Vajrasana, Lotus, ect.



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:42 PM
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reply to post by Blackmarketeer
 


Excellent post. Very informative.

The deal is that we have plenty of threads on related topics but not one yet to pull it all together which would tell a very strange story me thinks



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 09:49 PM
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Originally posted by facelift
reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Something to consider:


Each of us was interviewed for this film. None of us was asked directly for our opinion on what turned out to be its underlying claim; that Old World civilizations played an active role in the development of Native American cultures, especially the mound builders. Instead, we were asked general questions about Native American societies, their remarkable technological achievements, genetic histories, and we were also asked to comment on the biases of many nineteenth-century historians and archaeologists concerning the abilities of the native people of North America. We fear that the context of our general remarks as they currently appear in the film might lead viewers to conclude that our words on these subjects provide support for the film’s claims. That would be a mistake. In fact, our remarks, if presented in an unedited form, show clearly that we reject the assertions made in the finished documentary concerning a non-native source for the complex cultures of Native America.


ohio-archaeology.blogspot.com...


Interesting...hopefully the truth emerges.




I have always been intrigued by the serpent mound in Ohio and the mysteries surrounding that.

www.greatserpentmound.com...

And also the Topper site ,which if the dating is correct is about 50+thousand years ago.But that site is still on going.

Radiocarbon tests of carbonized plant remains where artifacts were unearthed last May along the Savannah River in Allendale County by University of South Carolina archaeologist Dr. Albert Goodyear indicate that the sediments containing these artifacts are at least 50,000 years old, meaning that humans inhabited North American long before the last ice age. The findings are significant because they suggest that humans inhabited North America well before the last ice age more than 20,000 years ago, a potentially explosive revelation in American archaeology. Goodyear, who has garnered international attention for his discoveries of tools that pre-date what is believed to be humans’ arrival in North America, announced the test results, which were done by the University of California at Irvine Laboratory, Wednesday (Nov .17). “The dates could actually be older,” Goodyear says. “Fifty-thousand should be a minimum age since there may be little detectable activity left.”

allendale-expedition.net...
edit on 22-2-2013 by kdog1982 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 10:14 PM
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I grew up right across the river from Cahokia, and have stood on top of that mound a few times. It's BIG.

Allegedly, several large skeletons have been found buried at Cahokia with red and blonde hair, that were exceptionally old. They were gifted to the Smithsonian, and were never seen again. Or so the story goes.

Also, in the 60's, much was bull-dozed over and destroyed for modern construction. Archaeologists and students tried to save what they could, but even that didn't go so well...

Here's a few sites that cover some history of the finds made in Cahokia that I have found interesting.
The Cahokia Mounds Complex
Cahokia Pt.3

Somewhere, there are some old newspaper articles from the 1800's about the finds made there early on, but I haven't found them yet. If I do, I'll post them.
edit on 2/22/2013 by Klassified because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 10:18 PM
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Originally posted by Klassified
I grew up right across the river from Cahokia, and have stood on top of that mound a few times. It's BIG.

Allegedly, several large skeletons have been found buried at Cahokia with red and blonde hair, that were exceptionally old. They were gifted to the Smithsonian, and were never seen again. Or so the story goes.

Also, in the 60's, much was bull-dozed over and destroyed for modern construction. Archaeologists and students tried to save what they could, but even that didn't go so well...

Here's a few sites that cover some history of the finds made in Cahokia that I have found interesting.
The Cahokia Mounds Complex
Cahokia Pt.3

Somewhere, there are some old newspaper articles from the 1800's about the finds made there early on, but I haven't found them yet. If I do, I'll post them.
edit on 2/22/2013 by Klassified because: (no reason given)


It's funny how some of the biggest mysteries are right under our noses,yet we look past that.



posted on Feb, 22 2013 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by Klassified
 


The Skeletons have always seemed to have disappeared in to the black hole known as the Smithsonian.


Blah...
edit on 22-2-2013 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 23 2013 @ 05:02 AM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Anyone else notice the mounds in the pictures look like the pyramids?



posted on Feb, 23 2013 @ 07:02 AM
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I Greet You!
While I was growing up, in the early 1970's there was some university in wisconsin and some other government agency come around the native american homesteads asking for stories and they knew that almost every native tribe and its members history was word of mouth and handed down from generation to generation.
For example, in my native language there are four ways of speaking this native language Hočąk (Winnebago) and my grandfather was one of the few that knew how to speak this old way. They asked him to go around the elders that existed at that time and gather information of stories. They convinced him that one day, maybe some tribal members later in the future might want to keep them stories going.
They made thousands of reel to reel tapes of stories and they asked my grandfather to interpret them stories, I was there the day he asked some of his friends to help, then one night during my grandfather and his friends were interpreting old stories I was waiting on them for coffee and over heard some stories and asked later about them. the next day i went to school and my history teacher that day brought up the subject of effigy mounds in our area, so after class I told him what them people were asking my grandfather and his friends to do , he Mr.Sietz asked to come home with me and speak to my grandfather, they talked a while and I had chores to tend with, by the time I was done and wanted to know what what was said my history teacher was heading home and stopped his car by me and said, you aught to tell your grandfather to think bout what I said!
I went to go see my grandfather about the conversation with Mr Sietz and my grandfather only said, he was going to talk to them people tomorrow. when I got home from school the next day. My grandfather was finishing them translations and his friends had left. After I was done with my chores I asked my grandfather what it was that my history teacher asked of him. My grandfather said, Your teacher asked me not to give vital information due to his belief that the information was going to go missing and used by the government's purpose. The following week my history teacher was absent from school, he later come over to see my grandfather and told my grandfather that he changed his mind and my grandfather should give the government what they wanted, and he only gave simple stories, like growing tobacco and daily living with the interpretations of the stars and planets and how they were applied to the tribes moment to have ceremonies and other tribal activities.
My grandfather kept the other information. Many tribes now a days claim to be descendants of the old ones responsible for them mounds and sacred areas, back in the day no one cared other than the U.S government.
No one in our tribe speaks the old language or even the written language. For instance, my Hočąk name in the revised written language is spelled ca co ni and the old way its spelled tt-tto-ni-k



posted on Feb, 23 2013 @ 07:39 AM
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I am more excited about this thread than any other on ATS thus far. I have always had my thoughts about North America that differ from the standard thinking.

I suppose I should probably view these video first but I can't help but share a few things. Firstly, these mounds? Are we talking about the Hopewell Indians from the Ohio area? If not, they are worthy of checking out also. There are some interesting similarities between them and Maya. There was a neat Season Premier of America Unearthed that linked the stone terraces of Georgia.

This article from the examiner also asks questions about the Hopewell of Ohio and there connections with the Maya.




When American settlers first penetrated the interior of the continent during the late 1700s, they encountered what appeared from their European perspectives to be the ruins of ancient stone castles on the tops of large hills or mountains. The most popular explanation of these enigmatic sites was that they were built by Welsh colonists led by a Prince Madoc in the early Medieval Period. Other explanations were that they were built by the Lost Ten Tribes of Israel, Romans, Egyptians, Phoenicians or Vikings.


www.examiner.com...

Seeing these connections here in North America made me think of an experience. Here in my area just less than an hour away is a very old cemetery just off from the largest man made lake in Pennsylvania. I am dying to go back but have decided to wait until after winter. I hate winter.

Anyways, while visiting Lake Wallenpaupack. I started on this trail that led me to this cemetery. Once there the first thing I noticed was the age of the headstones. Many of the headstones date back to 1804 just after the turn of the century. Which tells me these men and women were some of the first settlers in the area if they had already settled here and died in 1804, seeing how it was first settled in the late 1700's. Amazing.

What's even more amazing is looking around you can clearly see this site was built on top of an older site. The structures or cobblestone walls look very much like Maya to me. (I promise to get pics in the spring!) It makes sense to me that the first settlers would see something like this, recognize it as a special or sacred site and make it their own.

In my area there are several different tribes but in early history there was only one tribe that stood out. They were the Shawnee and from what I can tell, the only tribe to know metallurgy. Isn't that curious? Where did they learn that and more importantly, why only them?



posted on Feb, 23 2013 @ 07:58 AM
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reply to post by kdog1982
 

True enough. There used to be a museum there full of artifacts. But from my understanding, many of those are now gone. Who knows where.



posted on Feb, 23 2013 @ 08:03 AM
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Originally posted by kdog1982

Originally posted by Klassified


Somewhere, there are some old newspaper articles from the 1800's about the finds made there early on, but I haven't found them yet. If I do, I'll post them.
edit on 2/22/2013 by Klassified because: (no reason given)


It's funny how some of the biggest mysteries are right under our noses,yet we look past that.


Please do, that would be really cool.





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