The reasons why your "bugout plan" will absolutely fail!

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posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 06:19 PM
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reply to post by sirbadazz
 


I don't know what all this talk is about not being able to survive. I think there was a story on here not to long ago about a family living somewhere in siberia because they were running away from ww2. They survived till they were found.

I don't think they were indian and they were able to survive so I don't know what that has to do with it.

If a situation rises where people "bug out" I am pretty sure country folk can and will expect them to come into their areas so it will not be unexpected. It is not going to be a OMG WTF ARE THESE PEOPLE DOING HERE scenario where they will be wonder why they are here. they will know why and unless they are complete a holes I am pretty sure they can co exist.




posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 07:04 PM
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Originally posted by votan


If a situation rises where people "bug out" I am pretty sure country folk can and will expect them to come into their areas so it will not be unexpected. It is not going to be a OMG WTF ARE THESE PEOPLE DOING HERE scenario where they will be wonder why they are here. they will know why and unless they are complete a holes I am pretty sure they can co exist.




Why sure we can. When you come please bring plenty of liquor, drugs, coffee and your tender young females.


Ever see "Deliverance"?



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 07:49 PM
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Originally posted by votan
reply to post by sirbadazz
 


If a situation rises where people "bug out" I am pretty sure country folk can and will expect them to come into their areas so it will not be unexpected. It is not going to be a OMG WTF ARE THESE PEOPLE DOING HERE scenario where they will be wonder why they are here. they will know why and unless they are complete a holes I am pretty sure they can co exist.




I'd like to think so too, but it's not the way it would be.

What would happen, is someone would come into these communities, big and "badazz" and think they can start calling the shots. It would cause a divide. Why? Because someone, somewhere, f will get it into their head that they can run the show better, manage the supplies better, because they are so much more sophisticated and better.

Don't say it wouldn't happen. It would.

There are ALWAYS, always people who think they know better, or can do better, or were born better than everyone else. Nope, your best bet is to find a community NOW and know that your welcome to bug out among them. Your not stopping where I'm at in the country. I'd have teenage girls to protect from would be progenitors of the new human race.
I'm not setting my family up for murder, rape, and subjugation. According to you, I should just scoot my butt on over and let anyone just plop down and take part in my family and communities provisions. If everyone was nice and good, maybe. But we all know, people aren't very nice and good, particularly in survival situations. I have problems trusting people now, but I'd trust people even less during a time of disaster.

Peace,
Cirque



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 08:06 PM
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I'd like to think so too, but it's not the way it would be.
Sadly enough I think this would be a true statement.



What would happen, is someone would come into these communities, big and "badazz" and think they can start calling the shots. It would cause a divide. Why? Because someone, somewhere, f will get it into their head that they can run the show better, manage the supplies better, because they are so much more sophisticated and better.

Don't say it wouldn't happen. It would.


I also think this a likely probability.



There are ALWAYS, always people who think they know better, or can do better, or were born better than everyone else. Nope, your best bet is to find a community NOW and know that your welcome to bug out among them. Your not stopping where I'm at in the country. I'd have teenage girls to protect from would be progenitors of the new human race.
I'm not setting my family up for murder, rape, and subjugation. According to you, I should just scoot my butt on over and let anyone just plop down and take part in my family and communities provisions. If everyone was nice and good, maybe. But we all know, people aren't very nice and good, particularly in survival situations. I have problems trusting people now, but I'd trust people even less during a time of disaster.

Peace,
Cirque


I agree finding a place to go to now is the best idea. The only fault I find in your logic is that I personally think if a stranger happens upon your community that you should not just send them on thier way. It could very well be that the reason that they are there is due to thier own community falling to scavengers or another innocent reason for seeking asylum. Not all people are "nice and good" but some people still are......

I think that people should be open to offering aid to a point. Allow people the opportunity to prove trustworthy and not turn them away on sight. People that come into your community should be watched VERY closely though. If they even hint at being a detriment then they should be "asked" to leave, if they resist then forcefully so. To not give a person even the opportunity means we have already lost and don't have a society worth fighting for in the first place.



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 08:56 PM
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reply to post by sirbadazz
 


I don't know. I think I'm gonna go ahead and call shenanigans. For a person so educated and skilled, you show a complete ignorance of nutrition.




i am a former wilderness patrol ranger. i was responsible for solo backpack patrol and rescue in wilderness areas for years. i am a hunter who makes jerky, etc. i have a multi acre garden. i have survived in remote wilderness situations on several continents in extreme conditions. i have a full stock of arms and skills to use them. i have medical and all other survival skills, and own my own remote, productive acreage. i am of native american heritage and have all the cultural warrior hunting/training. i am an expert fisherman, ocean and river/lake, and i am not talking rod-n-reel fishing. i would last approximately 1-3 years...max, on my own with all the above, fully prepped, in a societal meltdown. you wont last as long as me.




I really don't believe you. You may have a point about community, but its really hard to take you seriously when there is so much GLARING BS.



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 08:58 PM
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reply to post by Darkphoenix77
 


I'm sure I would. I know if I saw a family passing through the community I was part of in a survival situation, I know I couldn't turn a cold shoulder to children, the elderly, or disabled. So, yeah, I'd help others in certain circumstances.

However, a guy, just showing up. No - I've got babies. My two oldest children are girls. It's not a chance I would take, but I might direct them to another homestead without children, that might be more willing to take the chance. But I couldn't. I wouldn't. My children are my everything. I'm not going to trust some guy who's been on his own in the wild for who knows how long, and then wake up to one of my girls raped, just because my heart bled for his plight. I wouldn't take that chance. I'm an mst victim. I don't trust too many people, and I've good reason to trust men even less.

Peace,
Cirque



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 09:01 PM
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reply to post by sirbadazz
 


There are small communities across the U.S. that fit your criteria for survival. They have community gardens, surrounded by rural farmland as well. They also have a sense of community and family.

Will they have problems?...sure they will. But as long as they are organized, they can survive.



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 09:09 PM
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Originally posted by CirqueDeTruth
reply to post by Darkphoenix77
 


I'm sure I would. I know if I saw a family passing through the community I was part of in a survival situation, I know I couldn't turn a cold shoulder to children, the elderly, or disabled. So, yeah, I'd help others in certain circumstances.

However, a guy, just showing up. No - I've got babies. My two oldest children are girls. It's not a chance I would take, but I might direct them to another homestead without children, that might be more willing to take the chance. But I couldn't. I wouldn't. My children are my everything. I'm not going to trust some guy who's been on his own in the wild for who knows how long, and then wake up to one of my girls raped, just because my heart bled for his plight. I wouldn't take that chance. I'm an mst victim. I don't trust too many people, and I've good reason to trust men even less.

Peace,
Cirque


I see what you are saying, but if you had a pretty big amount of protection you would still turn a lone stranger away? I think it depends on how big a group of people you are talking about...just my thinking.

Edit: I gave your initial dialogue post with me a star now that I know your full reasoning, I agree some people by definition are truly dispicible.
edit on 24-2-2013 by Darkphoenix77 because: Edit
edit on 24-2-2013 by Darkphoenix77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 09:29 PM
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reply to post by Darkphoenix77
 


I don't know how I could answer that question, not being in, or ever being faced with such a situation.

The only thing I can relay, is what I think I'd do in that situation. But what I actually would do, remains to be seen. Do you know what I mean?

Peace,
Cirque



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 09:40 PM
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Originally posted by CirqueDeTruth
reply to post by Darkphoenix77
 


I don't know how I could answer that question, not being in, or ever being faced with such a situation.

The only thing I can relay, is what I think I'd do in that situation. But what I actually would do, remains to be seen. Do you know what I mean?

Peace,
Cirque


That is fair enough, I guess none of us "actually know" how we would respond until actually facing that kind of situation. I definately do understand your reasoning, I guess maybe I am just trying to see the situation of someone who is alone in the world trying to find a place to belong for reasons that are beyond thier control.



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 09:40 PM
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Originally posted by Darkphoenix77
I see what you are saying, but if you had a pretty big amount of protection you would still turn a lone stranger away? I think it depends on how big a group of people you are talking about...just my thinking.


Most certainly I would accept a lone stranger in my clan.

Anyone read "The Stand"?



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 10:55 PM
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The most important traits are true intelligence (problem solving) and the will to survive....everything else, albeit important, is secondary.



posted on Feb, 24 2013 @ 11:34 PM
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Originally posted by aem56
think what really frightens me is how in no press nor online will anyone in America raise the issues of the disabled.. It is as if they do not exist.I take tht sielnce to mean our govts plan to let them die or make their orad harder.. I'd like to hear how some of you with knowledge actually think folks with disabilities can protect themselves..
I can shoot.. and I don't live in a city..


prove to me some folks here have a bit of humanity in them and answer this post.I now tons of disabled folks who need the info. I see our govt doing what they can to thin the herd now. WE know that is going on in the UK.. UN Hitlers time we went first.. care to step intohow we can prevent ourselves from being killed..? WE'd just love to know
Those questions you are addressing are very concerning. So sad to see people NOT give a crap for those who are less fortunate because of an illness or an ailment.

By trade, I am an Occupational Therapist. I have also spent a great many years volunteering in shelters to help the less fortunate. I have many other skills, but nothing that is going to make a big difference if the SHTF scenario does come into play.

It is pretty sad to think about. All those years making the difference in other people’s lives, only to have those egotistic, self-serving peppers tell you “oh well” bubb, you’re on your own.

Maybe America does need to fall into oblivion.


bug

posted on Feb, 25 2013 @ 12:00 AM
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reply to post by sirbadazz

130224
bug-out is a fantasy much like 'the grass is always greener on the other side'
1. +80% of US population lives and has lived for generations in urban areas 50K to 200K population (2500 person mile^-2)
2. Much of that 80% ability in getting food and water is going to a nearby grocery store or turning on the hot/cold water tap.
3. with ~290 million "surplus eaters" you can rest assured the US government will not hesitate to put 70 to 90% of them "humanely" out of their misery due to breakdowns in food resupply, coal resupply for local electricity production, and lack of imported crude oil to produce fuel and petrochemicals (i.e. plastics, drugs, fertilizers).
4. trying to bug-out will simply make you a target of opportunity for those grasshoppers that being unprepared and hungry want anything they can take; as long as their ammo holds out.
5. your best chance of survival, and enjoying the standard of living you have become accustomed to is to fix the glaring problems now, vs preparing to run away 'out of the frying pan into the fire.' The cause of the catastrophy will still be there, what you made little/no effort to correct while you had the chance.
e.g. hold corporations (that demand same/similar "rights" ordinary people have) and their 'executives' responsible for the wrongs they are doing. e.g. no GMO labeling; burrying turd nuclear waste pretending 'out of sight out of mind;' stop private bankers from printing money out of thin air and insist there must be tangible value to money not an imaginary promise... ect
hold politicians responsible for their criminal selling out instead of guaranteeing them multi million retirement packages irreguardless of crimes while in office; stop the insane facist military budget that consumes nearly half the yearly GDP;

From earier replies to this thread
A. Starches are carbohydrates, it is how plants store sugar e.g. cereal grains (wheat, rice, corn, oats, barley) as well as tubers such as potatoes are rich in starch.
B. when 'shtf' most of normal society will breakdown/cease. e.g. water sanitation, no more "clean" tap water, no more flush toilets, no more 20 to 80 gallon showers.
There are four main types of disease caused from contaminated water:
cholera, typhoid, dysentery (diarrhoeal diseases);
lack of surplus hygene water -- scabies, trachoma, flea/lice diseases;
parasites in unclean water -- dracunculiasis, schistosomiasis and other helminths;
vector contact and spreading of pathogens -- dengue, malaria, yellow fever.

There will no longer be a fully staffed general hospital, stocked pharmacy.



posted on Feb, 25 2013 @ 01:00 AM
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i am a former wilderness patrol ranger. i was responsible for solo backpack patrol and rescue in wilderness areas for years. i am a hunter who makes jerky, etc. i have a multi acre garden. i have survived in remote wilderness situations on several continents in extreme conditions. i have a full stock of arms and skills to use them. i have medical and all other survival skills, and own my own remote, productive acreage. i am of native american heritage and have all the cultural warrior hunting/training. i am an expert fisherman, ocean and river/lake, and i am not talking rod-n-reel fishing. i would last approximately 1-3 years...max, on my own with all the above, fully prepped, in a societal meltdown. you wont last as long as me.


Based upon your lists, I have no idea what makes you think if you could Cut-it & Rough-it for 3 years, you could not do it indefinitely. If anything, the real threat to living in and off the wilderness are 1) Loneliness (what's the point of life if there is no one to share it, 2) After initial supplies run out, vitamin and mineral deficits but if these are identified and natural sources found, you could live a reasonably long life and 3) The hungry hoards.

I am just saying that based upon your skill set, I think you under estimate your potential for survival in the wild. The American Indians did it and you could probably do it as well.

I have all the same skill sets and some you did not list, as well as some resources you don't have but, I have determine that if a so called bug-out (long term) is required, I will be doing it at sea because the worst threat to survival will come from these City Dwelling Mutants who will make their way into the countryside and wilderness.

edit on 25-2-2013 by MajorKarma because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 25 2013 @ 01:03 AM
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Originally posted by rockymcgilicutty
He didn't have 299,999,999 other people wanting his stuff either.


Yup, this is why the majority of people will die, because NO ONE knows how to cooperate and work together any more.

Its just a "all for me, or nothing" world now.



posted on Feb, 25 2013 @ 06:57 AM
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Originally posted by Propulsion

Originally posted by aem56[/


It is pretty sad to think about. All those years making the difference in other people’s lives, only to have those egotistic, self-serving peppers tell you “oh well” bubb, you’re on your own.

Maybe America does need to fall into oblivion.
[/quote

You won't find the selfless and compassionate online here.. I knew after years of reding here how much prejudice some here have. I also know from having fallen out of the middle class how they will treat folks like me.. which I why I live on 25 acres and have a shotgun.. It's sad we cannot put aside of diffeences because theat is the only way we will take back our country from the coporations.

I apprecaite your post because it's obvious you have a heart an soul... I now that I will not be staying here long. WHat I know and what I have learnbed on my journey would not interest these folks]



posted on Feb, 25 2013 @ 07:11 AM
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reply to post by sirbadazz
 



you didnt have the heart or courage to stand against out-of-control globalist insanity that caused the fall.


Native Americans couldn't stand against the US army of the 1800's...what chance in hell do you think any force of courageous warriors has against the modern US army? ZERO....of course, is the answer... A force of rebels would be taken out by drones before they knew what hit them. No, the answer is making change gradually, and legally, by who we elect as our reps, and by what laws we vote on.

As for bugging out, I don't think most "preppers" are talking about taking their BOB and going to live in the wilderness forever. No, most are using that to help get them home or to a place they have a better shot at riding out whatever SHTF scenario may occur.

Unlike most, I really don't believe any SHTF will disrupt civilization for more than 3-6 months...I just want to be able to maintain a decent lifestyle during that time.



posted on Feb, 25 2013 @ 07:40 AM
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Native Americans couldn't stand against the US army of the 1800's...what chance in hell do you think any force of courageous warriors has against the modern US army? ZERO....of course, is the answer... A force of rebels would be taken out by drones before they knew what hit them. No, the answer is making change gradually, and legally, by who we elect as our reps, and by what laws we vote on.





Frankly just be that one post...you reveal the reasons behind the karma of this collapse... Maybe we " Natives" (the term is indigenous or aboriginal if you must reduce us to labels.. I am CHEROKEE so get that label right..
WE are standing because why would we sit still a second time? There comes a time when even when you face tanks..you have to stand where DR KING stodd and belive in the basic goodness and em[pathy that humans are born with.. THose who don't have any humanity.. welll Great Spirit will deal with them.. WE will win with peaceful NON VIOLENT action

Karma does run over dogma eventually



posted on Feb, 25 2013 @ 08:40 AM
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reply to post by sirbadazz
 


I have interacted with people making this same type of statement and read many posts on this as well.

While I give you respect for doing what you do, you really do have a big ego about the whole thing.
Most people would not be heading out alone. Most that I know, or know of, will beheading out in small groups usually from 3 to 15 people.
Where I live, we have a HUGE amount of backwoods life and culture, not to mention that growing up in rural North GA, having spent lots of time in the back woods, desert and mountain, I will be just fine.

History has shown that people can do what you are stating as impossible. Unless you are just relying on your statement that the people already there will just kill the new comers.
Having Military training, LE training, wilderness training, I will tell you that if it comes to a fight, I may not win but I will inflect as much pain if not more on those that seek to harm me or mine.

Now, instead of posting threat, why not post in the SHTF forum and actually help those that will be fleeing the cities when things do in fact go to crap.





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