Help : I need your advice. Lots of smart people here.

DP and I don't mean displaced persons.

Sounds to me like the perfect plan, and if she can do it - she SHOULD do it. For herself.

Ask her how she would feel if she bailed on this idea when she had the chance, and worked those 5-6 years for the full shebang, and then got sick. Obviously she has already considered that. She will REGRET not doing this if she doesn't.

And besides, it's the very same planning that runs through my head each and every day, including the sailboat (I already have one, inherited from my folks that I am fixing up).

If she can opt out of the system, by all means, GOOD ON HER!! DO IT!!


The problem with pressure and kickback from others is the plight of us Boomer's dilemma. What worked for our parents has not worked for us...and will not work for our children, either (she being childless is a HUGE factor in this - my kids are what keep me bound here, for now - but even that is working itself out. I'll be 55 this year; kids are out and on their own...daughter already moved to New England and wants us all to join her, which I'd gladly do.)

I think that we were taught to squelch our dreams as very small children, to toe the line, to get the pension, to do the work...buy the starter home, trade out and up as finances improved - but that system is now broken.

I can't tell you how many people I've known both professionally and casually -- as an empathetiic listener, friend, and thinker, hearing stories of people who did follow their dreams, and those who refrained due to "authority."

Some of us are happy to dance the dance of the masters. Others of us are, by nature, RESTLESS, CURIOUS, idealists, who still want to pursue our OWN happiness.

I hope she does this. Her parents may not understand it, but she is bright enough to do these calculations, so she is bright enough to explain it in a way that they can at least appreciate....if they love her, and honor her as their daughter.

I hope she does this. I will be envious, but empowered to continue to follow my own dreams. It's not too late until it's too late.

Tell her I wish wind in her sails, clear skies, and much success; and to know that I, for one, am with her in spirit!

First, if your not doing work that is your love, so making it not really work at all, then you'll want to get out of it and do something else.

If your like me and your "work" is your love to the marrow, your only fear is to ever not be at work.

Retire and turn vegetable, go do stuff for a couple years then die of boredom once you come to realize you have chosen to become worthless.

If she's asking she likely wants to but is afraid to make the jump. Remind her that when we get into long habit patterns, like working somewhere, the brain is so accustomed to them because it has made deep channels and connected untold number of neuron pathways connected with that habit. So she will have to make a conscious effort go ahead and leave. The fact that she has to actually get up out of bed, walk out the door, and go to work means she is going, and can change that pattern at the point of, well, staying in bed, or not opening the door, or just going somewhere else.

Here is one of the saddest things I've ever read. A company in-house newsletter reported on a married couple who worked there and were receiving an award. Both of them had 25 years of service, and had never missed a day. Not once in 25 years did one say to the other "Honey, let's skip work today and go to the zoo" or a walk in the woods, or a museum day. Not once. In 25 years. Please tell your friend that story, maybe it will shake her loose a little. It still sticks with me.

If she can get out of the rat race and still have the means to live the way she wants, I say Go For It.
I'm not a sailor, but living on a boat somewhere warm, throw a line in and fish for dinner, going where you want when the urge strikes, sounds pretty close to Heaven. To quote a old song, "Go on take the money and run"

Money doesn't seem to be a problem. So I would suggest she take a month's vacation and see how she likes it.
After a month off she will know if she is really ready to retire or keep working.
Saying it and doing it are two different things, some people can't accept retirement.

reply to post by wildtimes


I truly believe that we are sold a system of compliance. We are taught by our parents that taking on debts, working for the life you live working 7-5 busing an hour back and forth is just the way it has to be.

We buy into a system that ends up making us a slave to its tune,and when we are well hooked in to it and indentured, we toe the line for most of our life.

Her bill list is ridiculous. She knows this. She has everything written down and folder-ed because it is so confusing to stay ahead of it, it is scary.

Here is a partial list from my memory

Mortgage - 500
Home ins - 130
Car - 375
Car ins - 125
nat gas - 100
power - 180
prop tax - 160
net / tv - 80
cell -120

there was more I cant remember and I may not be 100% on the figures, but I am close.

So over 1800 of the 2400 take home gone to support a lifestyle that she hates.

This does not include

food
clothing
entertainment
debt repayment
car fuel
home maint
make up / hair

It makes me feel sick just looking at the figures, knowing how hard she works, its total enslavement in my opinion. That said I am not always right, but this makes me queasy.


It was worse for her about a year ago, as she had CC debts on top of everything else. You know the crazy interest a CC will suck from you. I convinced her to sell some junk, some antiques she got from granny and a few things she just didn't need. That was the first thing I asked on Monday when I seen her, if she slid back into the CC trap. Fortunately she has not, and has approx 50k in CC with about 1k owing.

~~~~ __/) ~~~~~~

Originally posted by tkwasny
First, if your not doing work that is your love, so making it not really work at all, then you'll want to get out of it and do something else.

If your like me and your "work" is your love to the marrow, your only fear is to ever not be at work.

Retire and turn vegetable, go do stuff for a couple years then die of boredom once you come to realize you have chosen to become worthless.

Your right of course, and if she was doing a job she loved, that was part of her, I could understand her being contented.

Office Exec Admin, dressed to the 9s but having to work for a lot of demanding crybabies.

Personally that would be hell for me, sitting under florescent lights having my neck choked by a a tie, running around looking after idiots. It is not to hard for me to see why the odd person goes mental and then postal.

So no, she is not an artist, or an artisan, she is not a butcher, a baker or a candlestick maker.

Though once she made me a tasty cake.

~~~~ __/) ~~~~~~

I think she should make the most of her life whilst she still can.

wildtimes

Wonderful and thoughtful. Thank you.

I believe once we make our decision, that the universe will conspire to help us see it through. But you cant do it wishy washy, you need to commit, it needs to come from within you, not from someone else, you need to do it for yourself, regardless of what your circumstance is. If you want it bad enough you'll work it out.

Maybe if she had not sailed with me, and felt this freedom first hand, she would not be unhinged from her present reality. I feel a bit responsible for this whole thing, and just want the best for her.

~~~~ __/) ~~~~~~

A few observations and comments.


She seems in a good position financially, relative to a lot of other people, including me. She could keep working and increase her payout after she put in her years, but the future is uncertain at best, and she'll still be grinding years off her life as a cog (if she's not content with her job).

Unless she is going to live on the boat, don't buy the boat. Boats are never a good purchase unless you are using it for business purposes and can amortize the whole thing and still turn a profit. Either way, boats are a maintenance nightmare. 60 grand will buy a LOT of plane tickets and hotel rooms in some very nice places. Avoid it. If she wants to take a boat trip - rent one. Add: I re-read the part about traveling by boat, having skimmed it the first time. That is an expensive proposition, and I am assuming she is knowledgeable? Still, it seems to me there would be much cheaper ways to do that without spending $60,000. But then again, life is about experiences, not how many toys are in your driveway.

Since she has the inheritance coming, and given her age - if it were me - I would look at the situation as more of a quality of life decision rather than a financial one. She is still young enough to enjoy a lot of things, and she seems to have ample income to support a modestly adventurous lifestyle. She can downsize her house and buy a good used car to cut monthly expenses - especially if she's out on a boat most of the time.

That's what I would do if I were in her shoes.

Three questions?

Is she a youngish looking 59? (actually scratch that one as irrelevant)

Is she married?

Does she want to be?

Originally posted by lnfideI


Union income is reduced by 3% per year for leaving early.
91% of 1300.00 on October 2013 = 1188.00
94% October 2014 = 1222.00
97% on Oct 2015 = 1261

edit on 20-2-2013 by lnfideI because: edit

I'm no financial genius here.... but I think your union pension amounts are slightly off...

The first year would be the $1300, correct?

Next year, 3% decrease, so $1261

Following year, another 3% drop so (1261)-(1261x0.03)=$1223.17

After that, 3% drop from $1223.17 so (1223.17)-(1223.17)(0.03)=$1186.47

Another 3%....(1186.47)-(1186.47)(0.03)=$1150.88


So she will have a "little" bit more money monthly than dropping 100,97,94, etc. for percentages.

Either way, it still sucks considering inflation is increasing on average 1.25 to 3 percent yearly, plus a decreasing income...no fun =(.

Originally posted by AwakeinNM
A few observations and comments.


She seems in a good position financially, relative to a lot of other people, including me. She could keep working and increase her payout after she put in her years, but the future is uncertain at best, and she'll still be grinding years off her life as a cog (if she's not content with her job).

Unless she is going to live on the boat, don't buy the boat. Boats are never a good purchase unless you are using it for business purposes and can amortize the whole thing and still turn a profit. Either way, boats are a maintenance nightmare. 60 grand will buy a LOT of plane tickets and hotel rooms in some very nice places. Avoid it. If she wants to take a boat trip - rent one. Add: I re-read the part about traveling by boat, having skimmed it the first time. That is an expensive proposition, and I am assuming she is knowledgeable? Still, it seems to me there would be much cheaper ways to do that without spending $60,000. But then again, life is about experiences, not how many toys are in your driveway.

Since she has the inheritance coming, and given her age - if it were me - I would look at the situation as more of a quality of life decision rather than a financial one. She is still young enough to enjoy a lot of things, and she seems to have ample income to support a modestly adventurous lifestyle. She can downsize her house and buy a good used car to cut monthly expenses - especially if she's out on a boat most of the time.

That's what I would do if I were in her shoes.

edit on 20-2-2013 by AwakeinNM because: (no reason given)

OK, lets look at this a bit.

When you rent, what do you end up with?

When you rent a house, lets say for 10 years, when you move what equity have you accumulated?

Rent is $1000.00 + per month here, in ten yours you have spent 120,000 and leave with what?

When you lease a car (rent) and you drive it for the lease term say 3 years, lets say 400 monthly, 14,400, and when you give it back, what do you get?

Back to the boat:

Her boat would be her home until she was done traveling. renting one would be extremely expensive by the year.

I know some (a lot) of boats are a money pit.

case in point :
Owner buys boat for 50k
Puts over 80k into it for a circumnavigation with his wife
Then gets diagnosed with Parkinson disease and now cant go offshore.
Boat for sale 35k
yonder-sail-boat.com...

Select the right boat, and you can potentially use it for years and recoup most if not all of your money back.
A Tayana 37 is a good example. This boat was 58k new in 1980. Now a good Tayana 37 will cost you 120k
Westsail 32, a good one factory finished not a kit boat will cost you 40k,and go around the world, and then when your done, someone will want it because it is a legend.


Sick of sailing and living full time on a boat? no worries
www.i-to-i.com...
Live in a tropical paradise for 400-600 a month. like a queen. Its not fantasy, as 100s of thousands of people are doing it.

Selling your home now here is a sellers market.
Buying your boat now here is a buyers market.

You see how you could leverage both ends of the sale?

Thanks for your input, you made some good points.

It is appreciated.

Originally posted by Golf66
Three questions?

Is she a youngish looking 59? (actually scratch that one as irrelevant)

Is she married?

Does she want to be?

She has looked after herself very well. Works out hikes, camps, sails, very sporty if you know what I mean?

She is not married no. She was at one time.

I don't think she wants to marry no.

Originally posted by garrett5462

Originally posted by lnfideI


Union income is reduced by 3% per year for leaving early.
91% of 1300.00 on October 2013 = 1188.00
94% October 2014 = 1222.00
97% on Oct 2015 = 1261

edit on 20-2-2013 by lnfideI because: edit

I'm no financial genius here.... but I think your union pension amounts are slightly off...

The first year would be the $1300, correct?

Next year, 3% decrease, so $1261

Following year, another 3% drop so (1261)-(1261x0.03)=$1223.17

After that, 3% drop from $1223.17 so (1223.17)-(1223.17)(0.03)=$1186.47

Another 3%....(1186.47)-(1186.47)(0.03)=$1150.88


So she will have a "little" bit more money monthly than dropping 100,97,94, etc. for percentages.

Either way, it still sucks considering inflation is increasing on average 1.25 to 3 percent yearly, plus a decreasing income...no fun =(.

edit on 20-2-2013 by garrett5462 because: Typos

edit on 20-2-2013 by garrett5462 because: (no reason given)

Here is how I understand it.

Full 100% pension is 1300.00 per month.
Take it one year early, lose 3%
Two years early 6%
3 years early 9%

So:
1300 - full
1261 - one year early
1222 - two years early
1183 - three years early

I see it as not a big loss at only 3% per early year.

It is the Canada pension Plan that really bites when taken early (approx 6% a year.)

Taken at 65 she gets approx 1000.00
Taken at 60 she gets approx 690.00

But she gets decent interest on the sale of her home and that can make up approx 200.00 of the loss per month.

The Canadian Gov only wants to pay your pension when you are on your last legs and no longer can contribute to the work pool. I opted out of their ponzie scheme a long time ago, all I do now is cost them $ and grief.

By my calculations, she takes it early, and by the time it catches up to her it will be 10 years down the line,and why will it matter then?

By taking everything early and un plugging from the prison she is in, it will take 10-11 years for it to not be worth it.
In other words she is in a win win situation for at least 10 years, and by that time (in 5 years) she gets another pension OAS old age security, and have her inheritances.

What would a person in this situation be waiting for?

Originally posted by lnfideI

She has looked after herself very well. Works out hikes, camps, sails, very sporty if you know what I mean?

She is not married no. She was at one time.

I don't think she wants to marry no.

I was just kidding - seems like she's all set to do whatever she wants in life with the assets to do it. I wish my parents were in her situation. I am going to end up supporting them both soon enough.

I was able to retire at 44 after serving in the Army. I invested well lived frugally, purchased distressed property and improved them - now I own my farm outright have a thriving dairy business. I decided that if I were ever going to work another 80 hour week it would be for myself. I've always loved working with dairy animals (we have caprines and bovines), I love milk and cheese and while I only sell bulk organic raw milk we make our own goat cheese and yogurt.

If she still wants to work at something and has a passion - I suggest entrepreneurship.

If you take into account the Net Present Value (NPV) of money she really isn't losing anything overall because she's getting retirement money 6 years early so there is 72 months of "free income" being paid to her without the need for her working. It's also in 2012 dollars, not 2020 dollars, so it's worth more. Also be sure to take into consideration that she won't be paying into these funds any more, so she can afford to make less and still break even. For example, in my American case I was paying 7.5% into social security and 7.5% into the retirement system. That's 15% that is no longer outgoing, so I can afford an income 85% of what ot was and still break even. And not working her expenses ought to be less. I'm saving $500 a month just because I have no more commuting costs. Instead of driving 15,000 miles a year I drive less than 4,000.

In my case I took social security at age 62 instead of waiting until 66. My monthly income is reduced, but the break even point is at age 78, which just happens to be the longevity table. After that I "lose" compared to if I had waited, but the first few years I don't lose very much. If I live to 110 I may regret it. You can do the same thing with her numbers using a spreadsheet to see when the break-even point is.

If she were going to stay in her house and continue to live the city life it might be a more difficult decision, but given what she wants to do it's almost a no-brainer. She has a pretty good and steady income for life.

I say Go For It! But.......she might want to have an exit strategy. Sooner or later she's going to get too old to sail, so she will either have to park the boat or find a retirement situation that suits her. By that time she will have a cushion from her inheritances, but it's still something to consider.

As far as her family is concerned, they are being emotional and selfish. It's her life. Smile sweetly. Tell them you love them, and sail away.

Thats sound advice.

I forgot to mention both retirement incomes get an automatic 3% upward adjustment yearly for cost of living.

She makes 4200 a month but only brings home 2400 of it, as fees, union dues, taxes, retirement, blah blah blah get sucked from her cheques.

I would be pissed as well.

Originally posted by schuyler
If you take into account the Net Present Value (NPV) of money she really isn't losing anything overall because she's getting retirement money 6 years early so there is 72 months of "free income" being paid to her without the need for her working. It's also in 2012 dollars, not 2020 dollars, so it's worth more. Also be sure to take into consideration that she won't be paying into these funds any more, so she can afford to make less and still break even. For example, in my American case I was paying 7.5% into social security and 7.5% into the retirement system. That's 15% that is no longer outgoing, so I can afford an income 85% of what ot was and still break even. And not working her expenses ought to be less. I'm saving $500 a month just because I have no more commuting costs. Instead of driving 15,000 miles a year I drive less than 4,000.

In my case I took social security at age 62 instead of waiting until 66. My monthly income is reduced, but the break even point is at age 78, which just happens to be the longevity table. After that I "lose" compared to if I had waited, but the first few years I don't lose very much. If I live to 110 I may regret it. You can do the same thing with her numbers using a spreadsheet to see when the break-even point is.

If she were going to stay in her house and continue to live the city life it might be a more difficult decision, but given what she wants to do it's almost a no-brainer. She has a pretty good and steady income for life.

I say Go For It! But.......she might want to have an exit strategy. Sooner or later she's going to get too old to sail, so she will either have to park the boat or find a retirement situation that suits her. By that time she will have a cushion from her inheritances, but it's still something to consider.

As far as her family is concerned, they are being emotional and selfish. It's her life. Smile sweetly. Tell them you love them, and sail away.

Originally posted by Golf66

Originally posted by lnfideI

She has looked after herself very well. Works out hikes, camps, sails, very sporty if you know what I mean?

She is not married no. She was at one time.

I don't think she wants to marry no.

I was just kidding - seems like she's all set to do whatever she wants in life with the assets to do it. I wish my parents were in her situation. I am going to end up supporting them both soon enough.

I was able to retire at 44 after serving in the Army. I invested well lived frugally, purchased distressed property and improved them - now I own my farm outright have a thriving dairy business. I decided that if I were ever going to work another 80 hour week it would be for myself. I've always loved working with dairy animals (we have caprines and bovines), I love milk and cheese and while I only sell bulk organic raw milk we make our own goat cheese and yogurt.

If she still wants to work at something and has a passion - I suggest entrepreneurship.

edit on 20/2/2013 by Golf66 because: (no reason given)

You have really been milking the system. Good on you buddy.

When I seen the digital ACU in your av, I thought you may be Military.

A personal thanks for the service.