Paul was a murderer

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by Logarock

 

You mean the stoning that conveniently left him unharmed? What about the time he was almost killed but the Roman guards came and saved him?

What about it? Even in the Roman world you couldnt execute someone outside of a Roman court. Paul was a Roman citizen and had rights. Which gets back to the question you passed over.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by cuopar

 

In me is life, and my life is the light of man (me). Except, I comprehend the light, others can't see what's literally right in front of them and in them.

Your arguments are based on suggestion and supposition. Try to develope and argument based on something one can sink their teeth into rather than "seems sort of odd to me" cotton candy.

reply to post by Logarock


I'll try to put it simply: the "light of god" is in your possession now, it's what you see with. The light of god is consciousness. Remember when god told Moses that he was the I Am? Yeah, that's you, me, and everybody else, the I Am.

Clear enough for you?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by Logarock

 

I'll try to put it simply: the "light of god" is in your possession now, it's what you see with. The light of god is consciousness. Remember when god told Moses that he was the I Am? Yeah, that's you, me, and everybody else, the I Am.

Clear enough for you?

Oh sure. This "i am" thing has been around a while. And no me and you isnt an "i am" or the "I Am". Maybe out in Palms Springs or LA.....

reply to post by Logarock


I am! See how true that is? That's as true as it gets, that I am. Yes, even you can say it, though you may not see the significance behind it. It's been around a lot longer than "a while" too, it's been here forever.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by WhoKnows100

 

Replying with comments like this makes you look like an ass. And the answer is that YES it is a possibility he picked some manuscripts up when he was going town to town killing them.

Umm, manuscripts of the NT didn't exist when Paul was still alive. The three Alexandrian MSS were made in the 3rd and 4th centuries, the Antioch MSS is earlier. The gospels were written after Paul. The early church just had letters from Paul, Peter, James.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by Logarock

 

You mean the stoning that conveniently left him unharmed? What about the time he was almost killed but the Roman guards came and saved him?

He made known his Roman citizenship. The guards saved him because there were protocols in the Empire that had to be followed for Roman citizens. One distinct privilege was an appeal to the Emperor which Paul later demanded.

Also, why did Luke spend all that time gathering information on Paul's journeys and trial only to leave us guessing at what the outcome of the trial was? Seems kind of counter-productive to me.

Because that was Paul's legally required affidavit for his appeal to the Emperor. Acts ends without finding out the fate of Paul because it was written before his 2nd appeal.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
This is going to be a short post, but I think it will get some people thinking.... maybe.

Most Christians claim that Paul couldn't have been a fraud because his words seem inspired by the holy spirit. What most forget though, is that Paul rounded up followers of Jesus and killed them by the hundreds before his conversion and epistles.

Since Paul murdered followers of Jesus, wouldn't it be safe to assume that he would have also found teachings of Jesus among these followers that he killed? If he did, then wouldn't it be safe to assume that he could have plagiarized Jesus' words and called them his own in order to LOOK holy when he really wasn't?

What say you fellow ATS'ers?

It makes perfect sense to me, paul probably realized that there were just too many christians and that they were multiplying faster than he could kill them.
He decided to infiltrate their organization and destroy it from the inside.he knew that he would need to attain a high place in the organization in order to do the most damage. He also knew that they were gullible so he knew there was little risk in claiming that jesus talked to him and converted him.

After infiltrating the organization he immediately set to placing himself squarely at the head of the organization and head off any questions about his authority by claiming that what he preached weren`t just his opinions but that they were commandments directly from god himself.

If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

He says right there that anyone who does not believe that what he is writing are commandments from the lord, then that person isn`t spiritual, as in that person isn`t a christian.

Calling Paul a murderer is a bit of a stretch, I've seen no evidence of this. After all, Saul of Tarsus, was a zealous pharisee and would not have defiled himself with murder.

reply to post by backcase

Did you not know that in Christ's journeys he found man in a cave. This man's name at the time was Felix of Endor, and upon hearing Jesus words he broke down, confessed to murdering his wife, was forgiven and became a disciple. Jesus gave him the new name of John of Endor and he thus excelled to become one of the most perfected of disciples.

Where do you get this stuff and how do you expect to be taken seriously when you put this kind of pseudo junk forward?

Oh, wait, I know:

The Poem of the Man God (Italian title: Il Poema dell'Uomo-Dio) is a multi volume book of about five thousand pages on the life of Jesus Christ written by the Italian mystic Maria Valtorta.[1][2][3] The latest editions of the book bear the title: The Gospel As It Was Revealed to Me.
en.wikipedia.org...

You know, religion is just all made up along the way. Paul was no more chosen by Jesus than this Italian mystic of yours. That's to say, I don't believe her and I don't believe Paul either. He was a liar and, yeah, a murderer and he blasphemed against the Holy Spirit in his collusion to hijack the teachings of Jesus and keep the masses in the dark.

Paul and Pauline Catholic Doctrine and the evil that came from him and his evil church are evidence enough. The man was the "original" AntiChrist!

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


Are you a Jew ??? Are you following the < Protocols of Learned Elders of Zion > Are you preoccupied with the destruction of Christianity which is one of the protocols written by a big influential Bankster Jews in France ? You have an AGENDA to push . Is it #21 ?

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

reply to post by NOTurTypical


starr...also King David......my buddy says those two...David and Bathsheba was it......knew what they were doing.....David was on the rooftop and saw her bathing.....David sent her husband off to war....off to an impossible to survive battle.....

reply to post by windword


Ah! have you read it?

I have only read part of it, but from what I have read I have found truth.

Also the opinions of yours on spiritual matters are just opinions.

From the words of the gospel I have learned to hear words through the spirit rather than judge from the senses, so instead of seeing the religion and the horrible people who may be involved in it, I see the good people who have benefited from it in a spiritual way.

Like the saints, the church stands behind them, and I look towards them as the people of God as many of them have lived as Jesus would in their very own situation.

I try to apply it to my life but I am much less than a saint.

There may be secrets, but it's all out there already so I'm not worried what's hidden because I know that God is light and exposes all darkness.

And if a true saint should come out of what is taught by Catholicism then I do not think that the doctrine does much wrong.

reply to post by SimonPeter


Yeah! You got me! I'm a secret agent sent in by Satan himself. My screen name is code for 666 and I drink the blood of holy babies and wash it down with their tears. What gave it away? I'm a Jewish Satan too., you're good!

reply to post by backcase


What is gods light? Do you even understand what that means? If god is light, then what would you call the light that YOU see with? That's the true light of god, not the dude they purport in the bible.

Originally posted by backcase
reply to post by windword

 

Ah! have you read it?

I have only read part of it, but from what I have read I have found truth.

Also the opinions of yours on spiritual matters are just opinions.

Also, what Paul wrote were opinions, that we, or I, can choose to accept or reject. Paul also wants us to accept his testimony of a(n) (audible) vision, and he wants us to accept his doctrine based the validity of his story. I don't.

From the words of the gospel I have learned to hear words through the spirit rather than judge from the senses, so instead of seeing the religion and the horrible people who may be involved in it, I see the good people who have benefited from it in a spiritual way.

Are Paul's teachings "gospel"? I thought that the teachings of Jesus were considered "gospel".

There may be secrets, but it's all out there already so I'm not worried what's hidden because I know that God is light and exposes all darkness.

What are secrets? Are they things that you don't know (of), or questions that are unanswered? Or are secrets lies, untruths and misrepresentation of natural laws that are kept hidden from us? If the later is true, and are the "secrets" then the Bible is full of secrets.

Like the saints, the church stands behind them, and I look towards them as the people of God as many of them have lived as Jesus would in their very own situation.

I try to apply it to my life but I am much less than a saint.

And if a true saint should come out of what is taught by Catholicism then I do not think that the doctrine does much wrong.

What is a true saint? Can't anything or any religion produce a true saint? What about Ghandi? He was a saint in my mind. So were many who stood against tyranny, not in the name of a god or a religion, but for what is right in the hearts and minds of men. And not all saints fight for some afterlife of bliss for the masses, but their efforts are for the quality of THIS life, like Martin Luther King Jr.

Saints are not produced through any religion or doctrine, but they arise from oppression and the defeat of those around them. There is no need for religion, church or even a god for true saints to arise in our midst.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by backcase

 

What do you think your free ticket to heaven has given you? Pride. Enough pride to be okay with billions of people burning forever, enough to become complacent. My views don't give me pride, they humble me. Your belief has no room for being humble, humble people don't feel self-righteous because they think they're going to heaven and others aren't. Humble people care for everyone and aren't okay with anyone burning.

It sure is going to suck when a Christian mother has to live forever knowing that her atheist child is burning forever in hell. That doesn't seem like a perfect heaven to me.

edit on 16-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

Nobody is okay with billions of people burning forever. First of all, hell is not a place where people will burn forever and ever. Christians try to spread the Word of God with the intention of avoiding that exact thing. When we do that, most people do not accept it and automatically claim we are cramming our beliefs down their throat, etc., etc. Then they say something like we are okay with billions of people burning.

A Christian should never feel self-righteous. They should never walk around feeling as though they are in the clear, and forever safe from temptation of sin. That is the exact frame of mind which caused Peter to openly deny Jesus three times in one night. He was self-righteous, and he felt too "safe". This left an opening for Satan to attack him with doubt. If any Christian is walking around with a self-righteous attitude, they are not a true Christian.

For that matter, if someone is actually okay with the fact that some people will not make it to Heaven, not only are they not a true Christian, but they need their head examined. If you have met someone who has that type of mindset, and claimed to be a Christian, then please do not let it affect your view of God. He wants all of His children to go to Heaven. At the same time, He cannot allow sin to rise a second time after all is said and done.

If we can agree with the fact that human judges do not waver or make exceptions when it comes to abiding by the law, then why is it so hard to understand the same thing must be true for the Creator of the universe? God cannot allow sin to go on forever. There has to be an end to it at one point. He is allowing Satan's plans to fully come to fruition so the entire universe will be able to see that He is a just God, and that He has rightly judged the father of lies and sin.

It is a very, very sad fact that many people will not make it to Heaven. The opportunity is open to everybody, everywhere. Every single person in this world could go to Heaven, but some simply will not accept the love of Jesus Christ, and they push away the Holy Spirit to the point to where God simply has to give them over to their own devices. They can still repent and be saved, but the Holy Spirit will no longer tug at their hearts until they do so.

When Jesus comes to take His church back with Him to Heaven for the 1,000 years, those who were killed with the brightness of His coming will lie asleep until the 1,000 years are over. During that time while we are in Heaven, all of life's questions will be answered. We will be taught the reasons why certain loved ones will not share an eternity of peace and happiness with us. We will be given the time to fully understand everything, and how and why it came about.

After the 1,000 years are up, God will bring Heaven down to the earth. The wicked dead will be resurrected at that point. Satan will deceive them into trying to overtake the City of Heaven. When they try to do so, God will show them in panoramic view how the plan of Salvation was open to them all, and how they willingly declined it. Then He will rain fire down from the sky (via massive volcanic eruptions, and earthquakes which will split open the earth, releasing the oil under the ground which will be ignited by the lava), and they will all be killed- forever, this time. They will not live forever and ever, conscious while they burn. They will simply die. At that point, every saved mother whose atheist son did not make it to Heaven will already have known and understood for the past 1,000 years why and how their son was not saved.

This does not mean it will be easy for them when that day comes. The Bible specifically states God will wipe away the tears from their eyes. If they were tears of joy, He would not bother wiping them away. Just like in this life, over time the wounds will heal.

reply to post by jeramie

A Christian should never feel self-righteous. They should never walk around feeling as though they are in the clear, and forever safe from temptation of sin. That is the exact frame of mind which caused Peter to openly deny Jesus three times in one night. He was self-righteous, and he felt too "safe". This left an opening for Satan to attack him with doubt. If any Christian is walking around with a self-righteous attitude, they are not a true Christian.

So a "true Christian" doesn't ever "leave an opening" and sin? I guess I have never met a "true Christian."

If we can agree with the fact that human judges do not waver or make exceptions when it comes to abiding by the law, then why is it so hard to understand the same thing must be true for the Creator of the universe? God cannot allow sin to go on forever. There has to be an end to it at one point. He is allowing Satan's plans to fully come to fruition so the entire universe will be able to see that He is a just God, and that He has rightly judged the father of lies and sin.

First of all, human judges express bias all the time. They are not above being influenced by the very justifications that have brought those individuals before them to be judged.

Secondly, I can't imagine that a spiritual entity, who created the universe would sit in judgment of the errors of it's tiny creation on a distant rock, and not of it's own mistakes in that creation. If you were to paint a picture, but not be happy the outcome, would you blame the subject of the painting, or yourself?

reply to post by windword


I think there are millions of inhabited worlds, and Christ is visiting them all. It's not just one little rock.

As to the painting analogy...does the painting have a soul? Can it make decisions?