The One People's Public Trust & Sovereign Citizens Movement Scams Broken Down.

reply to post by Crakeur

the website www.thepublictrust1776.org is not affiliated with TOPPT and, yet, the owner of the site, which is seeking donations, is the same Charles Miller who is listed as debtor on the TOPPT documents.

Keeping an open mind here....

Maybe that site was set up to discredit toppt and that perticular Charles miller is fictitious and was planted for someone like you to find as proof for a scam when it's not?

Just a thought. This all does hinge on the power of belief, and would be a perfect tactical counter action to the movement.

Nevertheless good find.

I Just skimmed through the OP, because of the HOAX label given to the thread of the same topic.

Read the last few Pages, a practice I do because of my casual time on ATS, and was Led to this website.

Gonna keep the site Stickied, as reading through, there are a few People denying Mortgage Payments, electric Bills and such, and as a Voyeur, I wanna see where this goes.

You can go the the HOME page an look around, opptcourtcases.forumotion.com...

This is the page you should be looking at:

opptcourtcases.forumotion.com...

Anyone fancy a small wager on the figures improving.....My money says they won't!

reply to post by Wifibrains


no, that answer is akin to billy meiers and michael horn claiming the feds doctored his photos to discredit him, after he had shown them as proof of his visits.

Yes VERY good find. Again, Crakeur and others, note that in the link I posted with Clay Douglas talking with Charles C. Miller and Heather Tucci-Jarraf (link again here www.youtube.com... ) that Charles freely admitted first thing as soon as Clay introduced himself and his guest, that he did 12 years + in prison. He was completely transparent.


For the record, anybody going against the Federal Reserve, especially back what would now be about 15-16 years ago, that would have gone badly. He got railroaded, let's not make light of it.


But when Vkey brought it to my attention, I dropped everything and researched. Even DRAKE (you know, THAT guy) had something to say about Charlie, as he called him. I dug and dug, I also posted questions on the RTS forum, and OPPT forum. I wanted answers, because I have NO problem abandoning something if I can prove it is a fraud. I know that this last statement may shock you, or you may not believe it, but there IS a point at which I would throw it all away.

So, I dug, and found links to the interview I just linked. And I listened. And then I realized this refers back all the way to the Trust that was formed back in 1776 and then abandoned, will full explanation of every detail, exactly like I've heard before in history class. I also heard this from my grandparents, and when he started talking about the 1933 New Deal, my jaw dropped because I researched the living heck out of that years ago, and all of it was just playing back in my head while he was talking. He's telling the truth.

The 2011 events with their Trust (the one before the One People's Public Trust) that went after the corrupt judges in Cali and Washington...that made headline news everywhere (including here) in 2011. Its the same people! Same people that helped unify the occupy movement before people were clued in to the fact that it was all started by the bankers themselves.

IMO, you have to look at it ALL, for face value. Someone went to jail. So did some very brilliant minds for trying to buck the system, in history. Take things for what they are. This person on these interviews is telling the truth. This changes everything for me, because the skepticism I had remaining on the history of the trust and how it came to be was clarified. Crystal clear. And Miller, despite what you might have seen in newspapers (controlled by...who?) served his time and served it peaceably. That is quite a sacrifice to attempt to fight the system.

Every issue about this has two sides, except one. The Trust that started the attack against corrupt judges is the very same Trust that then went after the bankers and corporations that pose as governments etc. The same people (plus a couple), and the same purpose. The Trust is the original 1776 Trust that was abandoned, which is critical for people to understand. This is all true. Very interesting, very twisted thanks to lots of changes in who rewrote history, but in the end the original trust info is out there for all to view.

Something to consider for all really having a hard time with this...take a peek at the 2011 work the trust did against the Cali and Washington judges!

Originally posted by ajay59

Originally posted by Mkoll
reply to post by ajay59

 

I am sorry a large fraction of the people who participated here don't conform to your model for how people should behave and think.

It must be terribly frustrating

edit on 14-2-2013 by Mkoll because: (no reason given)

You see this people? This is the perfect example of what I have stated above. It should have been abundantly clear from what I posted, that neither you, nor anyone should be influenced by the words of another! This is a clear example of what I speak about. Read the above with understanding and SEE what this post attempts to do. I say again, listen, read, take in all that you are able, the decision on the truth is ultimately up to you.

The leader of the Tanith's elite scout unit, Mkoll is not a person to be taken lightly.
True to his job description, Mkoll can blend seamlessly into the environment and move with almost perfect stealth.
He also has the unique ability of being able to intuitively know which way to lead his men, being able to find meaning in something as warped as a Chaos mobile base.
He is also quite adept at silently killing any enemies that may cross his path.
Mkoll's skills are impressive: he has destroyed a Chaos Dreadnought, outstealthed, outsmarted and killed a Dark Eldar Mandrake assassin unaided, and personally killed Chaos warlord Sagittar Slaith.
Because of Mkoll's abilities, Gaunt gives the master scout a wide berth to operate, always letting him choose who he wants to recruit as a scout.
Due to his exacting standards, he only takes the best of the stealthers in the Tanith First to be trained.
Mkoll was part of the insertion team to Gereon and joined the resistance when extraction was impossible.
During his time on Gereon he and the other scouts on the mission honed their skills to an even greater extent and astounded the other scouts on their return to the Tanith First (at that point, the 81st-1st Recon).
In Only In Death, Mkoll leaves Hinzerhaus in pursuit of Eszrah across Jago's deadly badlands in order to retrieve Gaunt's powersword, taken by Eszrah to complete a suicide ritual to avenge Gaunt's "death".
Mkoll catches up with Eszrah and demands that the Nihtgane return the blade (saying it belongs to the regiment) but ends up going with Eszrah to the Blood Pact command post and disabling a long-range vox caster as well as killing the Pact commander.
He kills a number of dying POWs out of mercy, and almost kills Gaunt before Eszrah realises who the blind man is and stops him.
Before the Loss of Tanith, Mkoll had two sons with his wife Eiloni who - according to Mkoll in Ghostmaker - had died of "canth-fever" sixteen years before the Monthax offensive.
His sons are presumed to have died during the Fall of Tanith.

yah' , somethin' is up with this character

it's like he is trying to control this site ... oops! i mean thread.

Originally posted by squarehead666
This is the page you should be looking at:

opptcourtcases.forumotion.com...

Anyone fancy a small wager on the figures improving.....My money says they won't!

This was brought up a few pages ago, and if you'll notice this thing is extremely new. check the dates of creation. The whole thing was made public only on Dec 25th, and most sites were built around it in Jan. So we're a month and some change into the whole thing. But I am keeping my eye on the site, including the cases in progress, AND the non-cases but still relevant issues that people are talking about with things like student loans, or credit card issues.

If you are interested in damning them, you might want to give everything ample time to actually get reported!

reply to post by fourthmeal


please respond directly about the points raised in my post, rather than give some long nonsensical explanation as to why we should overlook this guy's criminal past.

You named a site that you stated was not affiliated with TOPPT and that TOPPT would never ask for money. That site, which asks for money, which you cited as not affiliated with TOPPT, is owned by one of their primary guys who, it turns out, also happens to be a convicted criminal.

reply to post by Crakeur


I didn't say it was an answer, it was just a thought.

If it can be proven it is the same person receiving the donations, I'd say you crakeured it. That's why I said nice find...

Nothing will stop those who believe they should have the right to be free from the system from fighting for that right.

Originally posted by squarehead666
This is the page you should be looking at:

opptcourtcases.forumotion.com...

Anyone fancy a small wager on the figures improving.....My money says they won't!

Why should I look at the Empty Page??

The Site looks like its Weeks Old... you think Court Cases are done in Hours???

Look in the Forums, where people are talking about their Ongoing Process.

reply to post by Crakeur


And that is VERY interesting, because OPPT themselves said they aren't affiliated with that site. However, Charles C. Miller is not one of the Trustees bonded to the OPPT. He is/was bonded to the American Trust of 1776, from 2011 discussions just like mentioned above. Same? Different? certainly related either way.

But as I also explained above, knowing what I know now about Charles makes a big difference. A positive one. It was going to be negative until all the actual information came out about it. All the stuff that didn't show up in the newspapers, of course.

reply to post by fourthmeal


so the fact that your trustees are in bed with a convict, who is known for these kinds of scams, who has started a site that you claimed is a scam, doesn't deter you from being involved?

Honestly, after you outright declared the site to be a scam, only to find out it is owned by one of the 4 integral people behind TOPPT, I'm shocked you're even responding to this.

It's like Michael Horn, paid to continue to defend, regardless of the hopelessness of the case.

Originally posted by Tw0Sides
Look in the Forums, where people are talking about their Ongoing Process.

And we find someone tried this nonsense and lost their bike.... so a great success there!

So we are quite clear, I do not think someone going to jail because they fought the Federal Reserve is a suitable reason for discrediting someone. History will probably record that person later on as a hero. But we'll have to see.

"Convicted Criminal" in what, exactly? Did he kill and murder and wage war like the bankers have for all these years? Who's the criminal?

Just from a human perspective, I'm asking.

Originally posted by Eyesa2diffcolors
reply to post by vkey08

 

This just happened. What are you doing on ATS. You should be talking to police or security right now. This is not the time to be on ATS. Would this time not be better spent talking to fellow employees and the like. This is why I do not believe you. Might have happened in the past. My BS meter is going and I am having a hard time hearing you over it.

It may have just happened, but i don't have to be the one to write the report, I'm busy with other things today. Another girl is writing this all up and dealing with the particulars. I do have other responsibilities besides making sure the crazies are fed and watered.

What will most likely happen is he'll spend a few hours in a cell and then be sent home, no harm no foul, but you need to understand, this sort of thing happens OFTEN, maybe twice a week, we get a laugh out of it, and go on with our normal business. There's really nothing to discuss with security, our office, being Civil Rights, doesn't have the same rules as a normal Federal Office, you CAN carry a firearm in if you have a permit to do so, we will not infringe upon that right, as it would be an oxymoron to do so, we can't claim to protect rights and then deny them. People can just walk in, sit down and wait to be heard, there's only 3 of us, so any discussion we have will happen as we're all doing other things..

Maybe if you spent a day here you'd understand.

but to break it down into numbers:

About 250 people cross through every day, of those, about 60 are nutcases that claim this or that, and try to serve us with some sort of document that has to do with some UCC scam, and claim that it's being served upon us because we are supposed to protect them from the IRS, etc etc. We kindly accept their documentation, give them another form to fill out and send them home. of those 60 we hear from maybe 10 again in the same week after they've filled out the form with someo nonsense about their name being a legal fiction and the like, again, we cheerfully accept the documentation and move on. About 100 people are just confused about what a violation is of their rights, or think that they have a right that is not specified, such as the student yesterday that said their teacher was violating their right to life, liberty and happiness because they were given a lot of homework to do and it cut into their free time. I could empathize as I never did homework in High School, and some of my teachers were relentless in teasing me because of it, I too think it's a waste of time,however, it's not a Civil Rights Violation. Now you get to the real cases, people who have been frisked and fondled by the TSA for example, those people are given a complaint form, they fill it out and we begin an investigation, normally in conjunction with the Transportation Security Administration, or the person fired because they were a woman or Hispanic, those are valid concerns and must be addressed, if I hadn't gone in today for example, I never would have seen the poor woman that was having trouble simply because her neighbor didn't like Chinese people.

The point I'm trying to make is, I have about 1000 examples of people that follow these movements popping in and out, and trying to claim this or that, I've had at least 40 people attempt to arrest me under various violations of the UCC over the past year, and THAT is why I asked to keep this thread alive and going, because for every 10 people that take this for what it is, OR take it to mean love peace and happiness, there are at least 2 or so out of those 10 that take it so seriously that they feel the need to act upon it.

I probably won't even file a formal report on the incident, its just not worth it, he will cool off and all will be well.

I guess i see it more as an amusing anecdote to all this

reply to post by Crakeur


No, let's be clear (for once).

Charles Miller went to jail for 12 years+ (which is explained here www.youtube.com...) Note that he explained exactly how long, which clearly he was honest about and in fact it was the first thing he said. During his incarceration, he learned more of the system.

Now, at some point in this, he came across the original Trust of 1776, that was abandoned. This is proven true, that Trust did exist before being picked up again.

Heather at the same time had been a prosecutor in the commercial sector, and learned of the corruption. Heather explained that she bonded to the trust with Charles and they went after the judges, and performed investigative work for Treasury Finance AG.

They were also instrumental in the Occupy movement in Los Angeles (if I remember correctly.)

They were also the ones that did the disqualification of judges in California and Washington regarding matters of banking / mortgage issues, on very legit grounds.
d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net...

reply to post by tinhattribunal


You've revealed my secret! I am Imperial Guard scout trooper from Tanith aka Space-Wales (which was destroyed by the Archenemy) and am come to spread propaganda for the God Emperor of Mankind!

You should read those books.

They're fething awesome

Originally posted by fourthmeal
So we are quite clear, I do not think someone going to jail because they fought the Federal Reserve is a suitable reason for discrediting someone.

Why claim that is the reason he went to jail? He apparently went to jail for "

Four persons were arrested in Washington in mid-February on charges of conspiracy to defraud banks, mail fraud, and interstate transportation of stolen property. Most prominent among them was Charles C. Miller. Miller, a former resident of Vancouver, Washington, and Kathleen Cottam, from the Tacoma area, travelled around Washington writing bogus checks that amounted to over $30 million. Miller was prominent among militia and sovereign citizen sympathizers in the Vancouver-Portland area.
Miller, currently incarcerated in the Pierce County Jail in Tacoma, was arrested in Portland as he deplaned a flight from Hawaii. His checks, though, came from Montana. Miller and Cottam had traveled to Montana in the spring of 1995 to Roundup to learn the art of bogus money orders and checks from the leader of the Montana Freemen, Leroy Schweitzer (currently incarcerated in Billings, Montana, on every charge imaginable).

History will probably record that person later on as a hero.

No, history will record him as a convicted fraudster!

"Convicted Criminal" in what, exactly?

See above....

Who's the criminal?

Charles C Miller....

Just from a human perspective, I'm asking.

And from a factual perspective I am telling you, he is a convicted fraudster......

reply to post by hellobruce


So I take it you did not watch the interviews. Got it.

Also are you familiar with how mainstream news twists things? He was more honest about why he went to jail in those interviews than the link you posted. Which, BTW, when I was researching I found first and was why I immediately dug in deeper. The real story is MUCH, much more interesting.

But literally, EVERY single angle possible to attack must be given to those in opposition. I guess I expected nothing less.


Nobody seems to care that this "convicted criminal" was HIRED to investigate crimes of corruption of the highest order, to find solutions to the problem. Nobody cares that these Trustees have done seriously difficult work for the benefit of all on this planet. Just like the video stated happened in Occupy, everyone was mad yelling their problems, nobody was talking a solution. Same here.

Originally posted by Tw0Sides

Originally posted by squarehead666
This is the page you should be looking at:

opptcourtcases.forumotion.com...

Anyone fancy a small wager on the figures improving.....My money says they won't!

Why should I look at the Empty Page??

The Site looks like its Weeks Old... you think Court Cases are done in Hours???

Look in the Forums, where people are talking about their Ongoing Process.

I'm quite aware that it's new......I'm asking if any of you believers (possible beneficiaries) in this scam want to put YOUR MONEY where your mouth is and take a bet with me on whether these idiots will ever win a case?