syatema spetznaz vs mma who would win? would they tie?

I am not a big fan of these “who would win” type of threads no one can really truly give an definitive answer its more to do with opinions until it can be tested.

The first problem I have with this thread is the use of the word Spetsnaz, Spetsnaz itself is not really a single unit but rather it is a umbrella term for what the Russians call “Special Purpose Groups”. While most Spetsnaz units will undertake training in Systema not all will to the same degree. For example a member of a regional FSB Special Forces unit might not be as highly trained as a Spetsnaz member belonging to a Alpha or Vympel unit in the arts of Systema. I know that point may be pedantic but some might find it interesting.

Now let’s say to answer the OPs question that we have a say the chief instructor of the Systema for all Russian Spetsnaz forces going up against the current MMA champ, who would win in a fight to the death? I would say nobody knows there is a good argument for either to win, the Spetsnaz guy has probably killed before and is an expert in his martial art, however the MMA guy is probably more experienced in hand to hand combat using various styles and has been training for longer. Like I say however the question isn’t very good, we will really never know which is better or who would win.

It would no doubt be fun to watch, but as the comments above state there is no real way of know what the outcome would be as both are experienced in different environments. I'd be more interested to see a knockout comp involving spetznaz, SAS, Seals etc, that would prove that Spetznaz are the toughest dudes on the planet.

reply to post by Dustytoad


You miss understood me, MMA is deadly my son inlaw fought professionally and his cousin is a world champion.
I understand and have participated in MMA and military Spec ops training as I am a former Army ranger and Navy UDT. That being said a world class MMA fighter has trained for endurance, endurance of High output for short period of time, that would be an advantage against Military trained, also pro fighters typically train daily as military elite do not focus their training merely on MMA on a daily basis.

A fight not to the death I would favor the MMA pro, A death match would favor the spec ops, they are trained to disable and terminate their foes quickly.

Under what possible circumstances would this occur, what is 'open field', and just why???

Is plain silly to try to quantify the outdoors or even combat experience of MMA trained persons since its not even a demographic with standardized training or practices ... and it's disrespectful to a soldiers training to distill them into a singular close combat event thrashing around like a cockroach when they're clearly designed to function as a group of persons with guns.

Originally posted by Ginga
It would no doubt be fun to watch,

Be about as fun to watch as any other two people killing each other for entertainment I guess ha

reply to post by rockoperawriter


You're comparing a professional fighter against a professional soldier.

If we're talking about a fist FIGHT then the fighter would have the advantage. If you're talking about anything goes with weapons and tactics...soldier obviously wins.

Keep in mind, MMA was created to find out which discipline is the best. There are MANY current and former elite military members in MMA today and they quite often lose. Not one of them is a world champion. That should tell you something.

Originally posted by Pinke
and it's disrespectful to a soldiers training to distill them into a singular close combat event thrashing around like a cockroach when they're clearly designed to function as a group of persons with guns.

Incorrect. Most special forces are trained in close combat, one on one, so as an observer, just out of curiosity, it would be "fun" (interesting) to see who comes out on top. At the end of the day that's what both are trained to do so let's see who is the better.

Originally posted by DOLCOTT
reply to post by Dustytoad

 

A fight not to the death I would favor the MMA pro, A death match would favor the spec ops, they are trained to disable and terminate their foes quickly.

No I understood you. I don't agree with you is all.. Terminating foes quickly isn't easy when they are not going to let you hit them.. I give it to MMA.. Constant training wins.

reply to post by Dustytoad


Lol then we agree, if it was a death match match than a pro mma athlete would not be considered an athlete, he would be a warrior, soldier, gladiator. Not an athlete totally different mind set. Apples and apples

Originally posted by Ginga

Originally posted by Pinke
and it's disrespectful to a soldiers training to distill them into a singular close combat event thrashing around like a cockroach when they're clearly designed to function as a group of persons with guns.

Incorrect. Most special forces are trained in close combat, one on one, so as an observer, just out of curiosity, it would be "fun" (interesting) to see who comes out on top. At the end of the day that's what both are trained to do so let's see who is the better.

Here a video of a US Marine whooping a Spetsnaz.



They’re not some mythical killers…they’re only human! If they can’t hang with this Marine they surely aren’t going to hang with a professional MMA fighter.

Sport fighter vs real fighter

No contest

Real is real.

There are so many variables that are unquantifiable without getting into exacting minutia for me to make a call on this.

First off - the individual matters. Every person is different. Who has the most heart? The most to lose? Who had the lighter breakfast?

Then there is the circumstances of the fight. Are both fighters acclimated to the environment? Or just one? Or neither? Are they fighting over an issue that one is more passionate than the other about?

Ultimately I'd have to say that you could take out both descriptors and substitute them with any others and get the same real world answer. On any given day, either man might win. It all depends.

~Heff

I read an interesting story on an MMA forum awhile back. Some dude was a CIA field agent. Ex Navy Seal to boot. He was home on leave and went into a pizza hut and hit on some girl at the counter. I guess it was the girlfriend of the 16 year old kid working the register. That KID beat the snot out of the guy. Apparently beat him badly enough he had to go to the emergency room and was admitted into the hospital. Moral of the story? Questions like this are utterly pointless. Fighting, regardless of the system of training or even any training at all, boils down to about three things. 1. Punching power. 2. Reflexes. 3. Instincts.

MMA fighters are not to be trifled with. Boxers are not to be trifled with. Thai Boxers are not to be trifled with. The 16 year old cashier is not to be trifled with.

reply to post by seabag


You have any proof those two are what the title suggests? Real Spetsnaz and Seals don't get in the ring together.

Originally posted by JayinAR
I read an interesting story on an MMA forum awhile back. Some dude was a CIA field agent. Ex Navy Seal to boot. He was home on leave and went into a pizza hut and hit on some girl at the counter. I guess it was the girlfriend of the 16 year old kid working the register. That KID beat the snot out of the guy. Apparently beat him badly enough he had to go to the emergency room and was admitted into the hospital. Moral of the story? Questions like this are utterly pointless. Fighting, regardless of the system of training or even any training at all, boils down to about three things. 1. Punching power. 2. Reflexes. 3. Instincts.

MMA fighters are not to be trifled with. Boxers are not to be trifled with. Thai Boxers are not to be trifled with. The 16 year old cashier is not to be trifled with.

Somebody once taught me a valuable lesson: the route to success in fighting is surprise. It doesn't matter how well trained you are or how how tough you are - a decent sucker punch out of nowhere and not many have a chance.

Originally posted by Ginga
Incorrect. Most special forces are trained in close combat, one on one, so as an observer, just out of curiosity, it would be "fun" (interesting) to see who comes out on top. At the end of the day that's what both are trained to do so let's see who is the better.

* At no point do I claim that special forces soldiers aren't trained in close combat
* MMA fighters and soldiers are not trained to do the same thing

By all means cross training MMA as a soldier is not a bad idea, that doesn't make the comparable.

Comparing soldiers who are trained in multiple different tasks and to work as a squad with MMA fighters just isn't relevant to me. Similar comparisons:

* Soldiers vs construction workers - they both dig holes
* MMA with body builders - they both lift weights

Most of the time a special forces soldier in the vast majority of units purpose is to stay out of hand to hand combat, or even stay out of combat altogether. They're trained to run long distances carrying weight for prolonged periods, escape and evade, and use large varieties of equipment.

Their muscle mass reflects the purpose they are trained for. They will use every means to avoid engaging in hand to hand unless absolutely neccessary, and will use a knife or shovel before using bare fists and grappling.

An MMA fighter is trained to be at peak physical fitness and perfection to operate for 10 - 20 minutes at a time using purely their hands in small areas in controlled environments fighting another opponent at a specific size. That's not to say they would be at a disadvantage, since they're not running up and down hills carrying 100lbs plus of stuff, losing weight and muscle mass and learning piles of other relevant skills. They're not jumping out of helicopters, learning E&E, practicing first aid, learning to shoot, lead, follow etc etc etc ... They focus on crafting their body, eating right, and training right all day long just for one task.

It's just two different things regardless of how similar they appear to be.

Approaching a target quietly over a period of days in a combat environment undetected... my money isn't on the Ultimate Fight Championship leading leading an offensive here.

Winning a series of professional one on one fights (even to the death as silly as that is) without a dramatic shift in training regieme ... I doubt any special forces team would volunteer thinking they would come out on top.

reply to post by Ginga


I could almost fill an entire page with stories like that one. For instance, my own little brother has knocked out a professional MMA fighter three times now. My bro hasn't trained a day in his life. Just superior punching power and athleticism.

Also, I would take Anderson Silva and give odds against anyone on the planet. Haha

Originally posted by JayinAR
Also, I would take Anderson Silva and give odds against anyone on the planet. Haha

Id take that bet if the odds were 30 to 1..

reply to post by Dustytoad


I didn't say WHAT odds I would give.

reply to post by seabag


effin a. great video find. good fight