Tell me about Russian /Soviet counter insurgency /intelligence.

So I have a question /request,

Can anyone tell me about Russian counter insurgency. I am interested in familiarizing myself with Russian intelligence from the former Soviet union that went for sale to the highest bidder after the collapse. I am interested in their counter insurgency tactics and other such related material. I looked in the usual places and found the same material over and over again. It is very limited. This is my first attempt at getting to know the course of events that befell those working in that part of defense from the former Soviet union.

Where would they have been employed following the collapse of their system?

The reason for my asking is that I would like to be able to identify such individuals. To identify such behavioral markers that could validate them as being such and spot those posing to be such.

I know its a strange request but humor me if you can /will.

also, how hard is it to fake a Russian accent and familiarize yourself with general Russian background information to have a working false identity for the purpose of subversion? Again, strange I know. BUT I am really interested and I thought to ATS for the retired now living the good and anonymous life that may have worked during the periods I am interested in and have some general information which they can speak of freely.

Thanks in advance.

I can tell you this: spies never stop being spies. What they do with that information is another story. Every double/triple/etc agent who is "retired" basically has the option to live freely among nations of employment. This isn't a guarantee of safety, but is rather an honorable gesture for those who've had access to sensitive information.

Do you have neighbors being mouthy about past espionage? If so, that's kind of a tell tale sign they're bluffing.

reply to post by DaTroof


No, I wouldnt think to that if they did.

I have noticed something and I would like to clarify exactly what I am noticing or just rule it out.

Thanks.

reply to post by zedVSzardoz


unless you're in the industry in some facet, you'll likely never know who these people, the real ones anyway, are. the only one way to know the ones that have any background in it are by looking at what they do now. a lot of them ended up being free-lance bodyguards, mercenaries, and the like. some ended up working for the Russian Mafia (a lot did, actually). some went in to corporate espionage. some got out of the business entirely.

the ones who would be willing to talk about this are few and far between, and wouldn't be likely to share anything that might get them found out by their former employers (who do still exist, albeit under other names). a comparatively small percentage of them have gone on to make money off their stories or as consultants for Hollywood, but chances are if they're at all involved in the same kind of work still, you'll only ever hear vague and general response to questions, and any sort of bragging is typically a tell-tale sign the person is a sham.

if he tells you he was a tax auditor, but is well built and has cold eyes, probably a good bet you're getting fed a back-story.

reply to post by Shamrock6


this is closer to what I was looking for.

I am living in Spain where for some reason allot of Russian mob comes to retire. I am in the north and they have not really moved here and set up shop. They like the south and have had a place to go there since the 80´s.

Thing is a couple weeks ago up to now there is a build up of new eastern faces. Like the ones that hit the bricks and scope things out and do ground work. petty grunts.

I am from NY and am very observant. I see them scoping out commercial streets, popping in and out of stores and what not, just generally observing. They live way too comfortably to be the type of criminal they should be. Average Romanians are not as well dressed and casual. They are also NOT Romanian, even though they will pass them selves off as such. They are generally more stressed and edgy. These guys are not.
They are well oriented and groomed. They are not pulling little tricks for money to send back home to the starving mother. They come and go with someone. They are like the typical bag guy that sits in a cafe or bar all day and leaves in a rush after being too focused on his phone the whole time there.

Then there is the arrival of well off ethnic Russians and their older family members who have quietly bought apartments and houses and have causally blended in, but only interact with other Russians of a similar status. They have been schooled in Spanish. Perfect Castilian and are very worldly. They have been here for a little while but I cant say exactly because they have expertly blended in like water in water. Which is not normal in a small city where people are noisy and revel in gossip. Especially about new comers. I ask them where they are from sometimes just because I hear them say something very quickly and lowly in another language when I am far off. I have great hearing. I chat them up about where they are from which is usually pretty dry compared to casual talk in "character" when I assume they are spanish.

ok,

so the ground work is done and now I think the real players are coming in to town to see where their parents and grandparents have installed themselves or simply are visiting their employers. They seem to be passing through. Like they were on an errand.

These new guys, there is something to them I have noticed before. Quick eyes, VERY observant. They watch EVERYTHING in peripheral vision. They have a certain strained look to them. Groomed over but there if you look at the little things about their demeanor. They dont tap their feet or their fingers to a great song everyone else is listening to and initiating that social phenomenon where if you tap your foot or a pen to a certain melody of a song everyone picks up on it subconsciously and does the same. They have discipline for the way they carry themselves. You cant surprise them. You cant lead them. they thoroughly read you and your facial and corporal ques. i doubt they all happen to work as mentalists for some carnival show.

They dress with clothing that is american made or at least not from the area. Expensive and always functional. It would blend in perfectly in the states but not in this part of Spain. Germany as well. Northern countries.

They all wear mostly sport boots or sneakers. Hiking shoes. They are well built. Not muscular, but you can tell their body has gone through some conditioning. Their hands, their knuckles are very healed over but you can see that they trained in martial arts/ self defense at one point in earnest.

if you drop a metal tray or a glass they dont jump or twitch. They dont like people behind them. They are obsessed with personal space. They anticipate everything you do. If you make a sudden movement at their side or behind them they immediately place their footing in a defensive position, but very casually and seamlessly. if you make a strange movement over their food or beverage, they will not touch it again. Things that the average person would not pick up on. They would not watch your hand from their peripheral vision to even notice you had your hand like you had something cupped and opened your hand after it passed over their cup.....even though you didnt have anything in it.

I dont know. I am a people watcher. I am also very extroversive when I want to be, so I fish for details. I ask where they are from and listen to see if their accent matches the ethnic look of their faces and clothing. I observe how they respond, if they are spontaneous and at least a little hesitant /normal. If they are well rehearsed and too quick with what most people take a second or two to respond to, then I focus more on my next question and see if they at least show some sign of being like everyone else, or are very well tuned.

I know this can be my own behavior generating this sort of erratic behavior from people. We are mirrors. Thing is I have always been a people watcher. These people are not like the rest. Giving the known situation my part of the world is in, where this part of the world, and this country in particular has made for people who come here to quasi retire from lives in organized crime, and that they often employ ex-soviet intelligence. I am curious as to what exactly may be around me and if I should play a little dumber or think nothing of it.

Again,
thanks guys.

reply to post by zedVSzardoz


I would strongly encourage you to stop testing them or feeling them out. they sound like either career criminals or former government men. both types have similar traits and skills, it's just a matter of who they utilize them for.

regardless, if you keep testing them or trying to get a response out of them, you're very likely to wind up getting more response than you want from them, and it will likely hurt a lot, for a long time.

reply to post by Shamrock6


sounds like good advice.

I have. I just wanted to see if I was going insane.

I have been playing dumb and oblivious for some time. I just wanted to make sure I wasnt doing it for no reason.

Thanks.

no problem. stay safe and enjoy the weather!

reply to post by zedVSzardoz

One of the Soviet counter insurgency specialist organisations,the KGB's Alfa Spetsnaz group,were by and large incorporated into the Russian FSB,of course with the collapse of the Soviet Union,many members of that group who were not ethnic Russians,i.e Ukrainians,Uzbeks etc,did leave(or rather were not invited to remain in the Alfa groups service),some of these former members can be found plying their trade in a number of Middle Eastern former Soviet ally states as well as the Balkans a high number of ex KGB members of all descriptions also allied themselves with the Russian Mafiya.

The Alfa Spetsnaz group,during the cold war,were tasked with(for example),counter insurgency and attack activities in Western Germany prior to any Soviet attack,with communications and transport centres high on their list of priorities,those chosen for that particular mission would have been extensively trained in how to pass as a German citizen,they quite often adopted the legend for a German of Jewish origin for the main reason that since the end of WW2, Germany was very wary of being seen to harrass those of Jewish descent,therefore the Spetsnaz operatives who were given such legends were more able than most to blend in without too much official interference.

It is notoriously difficult for a Westerner to adopt a Russian legend,the variances and nuances of the Russian language from region to region(and often from town to town) make it almost impossible to pass oneself off in the company of a native,the Russians have an exceptional ear for their own language variances.Basically,the west would have adopted the same counter insurgency tactics as the Soviets,i.e sending covert teams into East Germany and passing themselves off as Germans.

As for recognising the genuine article,well that would be tricky,they tend to blend in well and not draw attention to themselves,generally if you hear someone boasting about their time as a Soviet counter insurgency operative,they are not the genuine article.