Re-read 'Out There' (by Howard Blum) this week. He discussed speculation on whether the MJ-12 documents were forged, and if so, why. Now this quote:

"But, after some digging, the FBI had come up with a more specific reason for the enemy's putting such a complicated plot in motion--revenge. It seemed in the 1960s that the CIA had done its best--again for the usual cold war reasons--to spread tall tales about menacing flying saucers throughouth the Soviet Union and in the southern provinces of the People's Republic of China." (Chapter 38 / pg 264)

Any info / thoughts on the CIA planting UFO stories behind the Iron Curtain? I'd hever heard anything about this.

I'll have to check that book out.

Yes, all stories of UFOs were fabrications to influence air force/military budgets.

Originally posted by DaTroof

Yes, all stories of UFOs were fabrications to influence air force/military budgets.

Well, that's a silly statement.

What about people who misidentify mundane object as UFOs? Those reports are not "fabrications to influence air force/military budgets".

All stories documented by military. The rest is just dumb people not understanding air traffic or window glare.

During that period the DoD was flying 'Moby Dick' camera-balloons over those regions. I wonder if the 'UFO' misidentification helped mislead Soviet and Chinese intelligence? Possibly the 'UFO' label allowed the reports to escape censorship and be published, so the DoD could read accounts of where missing balloons really wound up? I don't see what method the dod could have used to create the myths, but when the stories developed all on their own, the DoD certainly could have exploited it to get unique observations of their OWN vehicles in flight.

Originally posted by works4dhs
Re-read 'Out There' (by Howard Blum) this week. He discussed speculation on whether the MJ-12 documents were forged, and if so, why. Now this quote:

"But, after some digging, the FBI had come up with a more specific reason for the enemy's putting such a complicated plot in motion--revenge. It seemed in the 1960s that the CIA had done its best--again for the usual cold war reasons--to spread tall tales about menacing flying saucers throughouth the Soviet Union and in the southern provinces of the People's Republic of China." (Chapter 38 / pg 264)

Any info / thoughts on the CIA planting UFO stories behind the Iron Curtain? I'd hever heard anything about this.

I would think if this is true it may be to intimidate the soviet union/china. I would assume people were still worried that UFOs were largely enemy aircraft. Hence if these countries' UFO programs were in their infancy this idea would still be firmly rooted. Now I will say I do believe the MJ-12 documents are forged. William Moore who originally obtained these documents was found to have passed on a copy. He had a habit of retyping reports so we have no idea what the original looked like. Not to mention this document was passed on by none other than Richard Doty. A known disinformation agent that worked for the AFSOI. He was notorious for passing on half truths and straight lies. There are many inconsistencies in this work. Honestly I think this is just an attempt to stir the pot more and further muddle the waters for ufologists. Draw attention away from the real powers in this coverup.

Originally posted by JimOberg
During that period the DoD was flying 'Moby Dick' camera-balloons over those regions. I wonder if the 'UFO' misidentification helped mislead Soviet and Chinese intelligence? Possibly the 'UFO' label allowed the reports to escape censorship and be published, so the DoD could read accounts of where missing balloons really wound up? I don't see what method the dod could have used to create the myths, but when the stories developed all on their own, the DoD certainly could have exploited it to get unique observations of their OWN vehicles in flight.

true. read a book a few years ago about cold war surveillance/air (we lost some airmen on secret mission, some facts still not released); before the satellites were operable we came up with balloons that could cross over the USSR taking pictures, to be retrieved off Alaska (I believe it was Project Mogul). The huge high-altitude balloons were tested and flew for hundreds of miles; I remember a quote, ''we could track the balloons by following the ufo reports". (we only recovered a handful but the intel they provided more than justified the program)
one theory is that the USAF encouraged ufo interpretations as it would keep their balloons more secret!

aliens dont exist
most ufos are military

Originally posted by xszawe
aliens dont exist
most ufos are military

edit on 8-2-2013 by xszawe because: (no reason given)

And now we pause for a message from her majestys intitute of programming and propaganda. Please look up to the nearest CCTV-camera so that your face may be recorded. All so called extraterrestrial or interdimensional phenomena are just lens flares reflecting Venus through swamp gas via weather balloons. Please move on to your next shopping experience and avoid eye contact with your fellow citizen, as it transfers swine flu from Al Qaeda. Mass sightings and abductees are just malfunctional shopping units and evil terrorists who do not ingest enough pints of fluoride a day. Or just simply rocks rockin n rolling on the surface of Mars.

Just kidding. ;-)

Really? Aliens do not exist? Why sir/maam, we all have our different ideas and experiences through them multiverses of reality tunnels. I for one beg to differ, regarding such a (imo) fivesensed stance as nonexistance of E.T. But i wont impose to anyone what is reality and whats not/nuts. Salud and take care

Originally posted by DaTroof
I'll have to check that book out.

Yes, all stories of UFOs were fabrications to influence air force/military budgets.

That is an absolutely ludicrous statement to make.

I'll just assume you haven't researched the UFO subject one bit then

Here's a story repeated by Timothy Good of a intelligence operation using UFOs as cover:

(Above Top Secret: The Worldwide UFO Cover-up by Timothy Good

“Miles Copeland, former CIA organizer and intelligence officer, related an interesting story to me involving the Agency's attempt on one occasion to use fictional UFO sightings to spread disinformation. The purpose, in this case, was to 'dazzle' and intoxicate' the Chinese, who had themselves on several occasions fooled the CIA into sending teams to a desert in Sinkiang Province, West China, to search for nonexistent underground 'atomic energies.' The exercise took place in the early 1960s, Copeland told me, and involved launching fictional UFO sighting reports from many different areas. The project was headed by Desmond Fitzgerald of the Special Affairs Staff (who made a name for himself by inventing harebrained schemes for assassinating Fidel Castro). The UFO exercise was 'just to keep the Chinese off-balance and make them think we were doing things we weren't,' Copeland said. 'The project got the desired results, as I remember, except that it somehow got picked up by a lot of religious nuts in Iowa and Nebraska or somewhere who took it seriously enough to add an extra chapter to their version of the New Testament!”

This tales sounds a bit like a spy tall-tale told for amusement, but maybe there is some truth to it. The closest thing I could find to a match for this was the monitoring of nuclear activity in Lop Nor.

Rather than spreading a lot of saucer stories, I think they just capitalized on them, using UFOs as a form of passive cover for their spying platforms. They were perfectly happy for them to be mistaken as flying saucers and not inclined to speak up and volunteer the true craft responsible.

Originally posted by CardDown
Rather than spreading a lot of saucer stories, I think they just capitalized on them, using UFOs as a form of passive cover for their spying platforms. They were perfectly happy for them to be mistaken as flying saucers and not inclined to speak up and volunteer the true craft responsible.

Even considering the source, I agree that such stories are not entirely inconsistent with other CIA misdirection and disinformation campaigns to get into the heads of their opposite numbers.

Another example: I was told in a long elaborate narrative by a high ranking USAF officer that the Stanford Remote Viewing project was a misdirection scheme to send the USSR off on dead-ended 'psychic warfare' chases while providing 'cover' explanations for some spectacular CIA espionage successes in the 1970s, successful information acquisition that was so sensitive that a careful counter-espionage effort might have narrowed down and identified the Russians actually spying for the US. Instead, the word got out that the information [e.g., location of a crashed Soviet aircraft in central Africa] was obtained by ESP rather than a sleeper agent, who would have been endangered by an investigation. Apparently, the soviets -- always sucjkers for the paranormal, as athiestic societies tend to be -- swallowed the disinformation and the US assets were protected until much later they were extracted safely.

Example: Glomar Explorer [? or Challenger?]

Example: An ad hoc cover story by a colleague of mine who worked 'Broken Arrow' out of Kirtland AFB [NM} in 1971-2 [when I was there, too], told me of an exercise he had run in the Rockies one summer, assisted by local law enforcement. This was not long after Palomares, when rumors of nuclear contamination had devastated the local agro and tourist economy -- so the project commander demanded that whatever happened, the locals should NOT be spooked by 'radioactive contamination' rumors. My friend grinned as he recalled his solution. The AF decon team had cordoned off an area, and the locals provided perimeter security. The young Captain briefed the locals and swore them to secrecy: "We're picking up pieces of a crashed flying saucer, but you CANNOT tell anybody." Sure enough, by noon the next day the entire region was buzzing with barbershop rumors about the flying saucer. "Nobody ever worried about radiation," he bragged to me.

Ix-nay on the Oswell-ray!

Just a number of good posts and insights here. However let me tell you.....that someone by the late 60s anyway was operating anti gravity craft of several sorts over the face of the earth outside the control of any authority on earth, that we know of. It has long been know that we are not alone on the earth.