THIS Is The Problem With Our Community!!!

reply to post by Helious


No problem. It’s all good.

reply to post by Helious


No, straight out right, what you have writtenj, I do not see anything wrong with that. But, and this is the essence of conspiracy theory, Identity.... and the other loopholes that exist within what you have written......

Do we agree on this site, or do we not, that certain technologies and outright lies and obfuscations have taken place to hold hostage and unhinge everything you have written, "to be fair?"

What is your definition of Human, or your body, or your enitty, for this is where we begin with you rights, is it not?
And then after that, well, what, really can come after that. nod to what I said about the Scopes trail, did you not see that? or understood what that meant? And in this age where we are debating things like transhumanism and the AI possibilities, probabilities and FUTILITIES, at this late date, what are we really discussing here???

For, everything you descrirbe about our bill of right and the constution, HINGES, literally, upon your view of what I describe above, and God help all those who do not recognize that.....

At some point, this community, the conspiracy theory community, has to accept responsibility for pushing a feeling of extreme paranoia across a wide range of topics to the public.

That extreme feeling of paranoid is what has fueled the harassment of the Aurora shooters, the theories on Sandy Hook and everything inbetween. If you want to say that these events are being used for political gain, then go for it - but to make the argument that people didn't die, or that parents willingly let their children be shot, is just low.

At this point, the degree of distrust is so prevelant in the conspiracy theory culture, that it will take people being personally affected by a tragic event for them to believe that some of these events happen.

I really enjoy some of the conversations that happen on this board, and enjoy the information that is shared, but some of you need to learn to let the world move on after events and that not everything is this grand conspiracy. It takes a little critical thinking, addressing an issue from multiple angles, and keeping an open-mind towards different possibilities. The problem is that a lot of people hear something that sounds good (I call this BS Logic) and latch themselves on to that story while practicing serious amounts of cognitive dissonance on any new information that might counter their chosen version of the truth.

Even if what you believe happened goes totally against the grain of what is reported to you via the MSM, not a single person on this planet has the right to accuse another person of not being a part of an event. Doing so just violates their rights to believe the event happened.

Originally posted by tetra50
reply to post by Helious

 

No, straight out right, what you have writtenj, I do not see anything wrong with that. But, and this is the essence of conspiracy theory, Identity.... and the other loopholes that exist within what you have written......

Do we agree on this site, or do we not, that certain technologies and outright lies and obfuscations have taken place to hold hostage and unhinge everything you have written, "to be fair?"

What is your definition of Human, or your body, or your enitty, for this is where we begin with you rights, is it not?
And then after that, well, what, really can come after that. nod to what I said about the Scopes trail, did you not see that? or understood what that meant? And in this age where we are debating things like transhumanism and the AI possibilities, probabilities and FUTILITIES, at this late date, what are we really discussing here???

For, everything you descrirbe about our bill of right and the constution, HINGES, literally, upon your view of what I describe above, and God help all those who do not recognize that.....

Somebody is definitely having a better night than me!

I don't see this as a problem with "our community," but rather another pathetic attempt by the mainstream media to bash conspiracy theorists and anyone who questions what they are told.

Spew all the propaganda you want, but I'm going to continue to question what I am told, thank you very much.

Originally posted by indigothefish
I have serious doubts that anyone has tracked down people involved with the Aurora shooting or the Sandy Hook shooting and then harrassed them.

Mr. R. from Newtown says differently and going by what has been and continues to be posted about him it is hardly difficult to believe.

Originally posted by indigothefish
Secondly, from the point of understanding the conspiracy and believing it, the person must have the resources to track down names, addresses and phone numbers of people involved. This actually would require the same amount of critical thinking to do that it would require to have the common sense not to call those people just to harrass them.

It would take the same mental capacity to track these people down as it would take to realize that doing so just to harrass them would make the entire conspiracy more easily hidden as you made the entire conspiracy theorist culture look like harrassers.

I have to strongly disagree with you here. The tracking down of personal info in this case is a group effort and with it all posted online (as it is on other sites) anyone of any understanding or mental capacity has access to it without any effort whatsoever.

Everyone is an "investigator" and can derive the ego satisfaction of being in on the "research" by digging anything up: Parent X's work info, his Facebook page, photos of his family, his previous addresses, court filings, you name it. There is no critical thinking or common sense needed at all. In fact, the more bizarre the connections are that you claim to make, the more you stand out from the crowd.

ATS has done a good job of policing this but if you go elsewhere it is frankly mind boggling. There certainly appear to be some seriously unhinged, paranoid people fixating on this. How much of this is trolling is hard to say but I don't envy those who are the position of having to worry about it.

reply to post by Evil_Santa


I was with you until that last paragraph and you lost me. I am not sure I comprehended that part. I am tired so it is probably me.

Anyway there are so many different theories on just about every subject floating around and every once in a while I find one with merit that has the required supporting evidence however the vast majority are opinions presented as fact which I don’t go along with. Now there are many people out there that fancy themselves as investigators yet they do not seem to have any ethics and I question their common sense or intelligence to be harassing victims of a crime.

The people who are harassing these victims are low lives and I cannot imagine what their motives are. Honestly I think some of them are sick. What is it that these people think? There has to be a certain level of accountability you can’t just harass people because you have a theory? Do they think that because someone did an interview on TV that they should take phone calls from everyone who has seen that interview or that they should be available for questions if you pound on their door? That is the timid stuff. The guy who took in the kids has had his life made into a living hell IMO. There is no justification for the harassment of those people and the people who do it are scum in my book.

I hope that I am never put into a position where if I do an interview that I am harassed by people that don’t like the MSM. I wouldn’t be surprised if some of those people move to a ranch in the middle of nowhere to find peace and great trespassers with a shotgun full of rock salt or bean bag rounds. I probably would. It is enough to make person go postal IMO.

Originally posted by SilentKoala
I don't see this as a problem with "our community," but rather another pathetic attempt by the mainstream media to bash conspiracy theorists and anyone who questions what they are told.

Spew all the propaganda you want, but I'm going to continue to question what I am told, thank you very much.

edit on 8-2-2013 by SilentKoala because: (no reason given)

Thank you for epitomizing exactly the point I want to make. Rather than even entertain the notion that there might be another side to what you think, you opt to see all information not in line with your own feelings to be "another pathetic attempt by the mainstream media to bash" and spewed "propaganda".

Deflection, conformation bias, messianic thinking, and cognitive dissonance all rolled together. This is demonstrated by the fact that the OP is not a call to stop questioning and using sound deductive process. It's about crossing the line into infringing upon the life, liberty, and happiness of not just others - but others who have suffered horrible and unspeakable tragedy.

Since you seem to be championing the concept, I'll ask you directly. What the Hell makes you think you have the right?

~Heff

reply to post by Hefficide



I think Heff, that there are those out there who can't sign onto a reality out side their own personal paranoia. I can sympathize with them in that it is difficult to determine the truth of a situation, but is It to difficult to accept that in all that occurs some events are truly as they seem? It appears that for many it is. It may appear that these individuals are existing in a delusional state, and any appeal to reason is futile.

I personally don't accept that. I think a good many people tag along. That is, they somewhat acknowledge the fit between their own personal fears about the public reaction to the event and the paranoid delusion of the true believer. These people i feel it is important to reach.

But you are right on it and you had the courage to say it. Repeated expressions of this paranoia, particularly when it becomes aggressive and defiant,. as you cited, invites a scrutiny.

reply to post by Hefficide


I'll just ask you this - why do you think the AP ran this article? Do you think they genuinely care about the CO victims? Or do you think there is an agenda to demonize alternative thinking?

Did the AP bother to mention all of the conspiracy theorists who don't do what they're talking about? If not then they're making a small fragment of a community look as though it represents the entire community.

I don't harass anyone. But I have every right to say I don't believe something.

You are only allowed to question victim accounts if you are in the media and getting paid to do it.
en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Superhans
You are only allowed to question victim accounts if you are in the media and getting paid to do it.
en.wikipedia.org...

Says who? Besides, they're only a victim if their account is true. And the only way to determine that is to question it.

I'm glad science still exemplifies the kind of intellectual integrity that doesn't seem to be found anywhere else these days. When a claim is made, you determine its veracity through rigorous scrutiny.

reply to post by Hefficide


Good keep up the work guys, phony shootings should be pushed that much. No more should we accept the death throes of the cabal.

reply to post by SilentKoala


I agree 100% with you, push the truth

reply to post by Evil_Santa


There is no point in Aurora or Connecticut that had anything to do with the general public, and especially the more awake members of it. The perpetrators are is evil pestilence running the world, and in specific the US portion of it, though they seem to have many birds of a feather in power globally. They're the ones who did that and every other horror on earth. Sick bunch of extremely evil (doers).

Its not sane to not be aware of the world.

reply to post by Hefficide


I hear ya Heff,

It all just makes me think of Problem, Reaction, Solution.

Gun Control - capitalizing on high profile incidences for a disarming of America agenda.. whether you believe in false flag scenarios or not.

Freedom of Speech/Press/Internet - it seems that these cases are purposely being mishandled to frustrate the situation & therefore the people.

It seems to me with both the Colorado shooting & Sandy Hook things have been handled as if its the first case ever.


It feels like a boiling point is being pushed to introduce some CFR, Trilateral Commission, invisible agenda 21 government plan already written out decades ago.. to just lock it all down. the technology is here, now to control people on a massive scale with the fewest amount of resources. the average guy has no idea how the technology around him works & no idea how to live off the land..

when I think about protests in Americas past.. you just cant do that anymore. behaving that way now your a terrorist.

anyways..

I hear ya. people should be respectful.

Americans also need straight up facts. a healthy dose of truth for a generation would go a long way...
Politicians who go to jail when they break the law. Government Officials who are punished when they mess up on the job not promoted.. investigations that investigate. News that reports facts and does not promote a political emotional angle that aligns with the money of their parties affiliate.

I think we are getting mad as hell, and we just might not take it anymore. Certainly harassing victims is not the way, though.. once, you know, its established as fact..

reply to post by Unity_99
I was going to say nearly the same thing! What if the harassers are shills trying to stir up some trouble.

I mean, come on... You'd pretty much have to be a psychopath to harass people in the hunt for truth.

But, it seems that that is the exact label they want put on "conspiracy theorists". Just a thought.

Do you think maybe they're putting this out there to encourage censorship, and to nudge people into harassing those with questions?

While it comes as no surprise to see people on the internet taking things "too far", or just being "too weird"... it comes as a massive surprise to see a coordinated effort to silence people or to encourage censorship, even on sites like ATS.

I think it is all bullcrap.

When it's skeptics or those offended telling me I can't say certain things in certain places, I accept that. When all over the internet so-called site owners make a coordinated effort to completely restrict me from saying or even seeing certain things.. Then I'm a little concerned.

Originally posted by Helious
reply to post by tetra50

 

To be completely fair. Almost everything in our daily lives is regulated by the government. If your grass is too long you get a ticket. If you try to put a garden box in your front yard and it goes against township rules or the homeowners association you will be forced to remove it.

If you have a vehicle that you own and is in your driveway you want to restore but the tags are expired, they can force you to update the tags in many communities even if you don't drive it. You are forced not only to pay for yearly registration for your vehicle but in many communities and states also for a city sticker that serves absolutely no purpose to you as a citizen and is only pure revenue to the county.

You pay federal income tax, state income tax, medicare, social security, property tax, sales tax, tax on licensing your vehicle yearly, city stickers, fees for any licenses including those to hunt and fish which would be important if you choose to live "off the grid" which is impossible because in order to use any land owned by the government you will need to pay fees to do so and also carry the proper hunting and or fishing license less you are committing a crime.

Somebody buys a car brand new, pays an ungodly amount of tax for it, pays it off then sells it too you, now you have to pay tax on it again. A brewer, brews a keg a beer, he pays tax on the hops and barely and malt to make the beer, once he is done, he pays tax when he puts it in a keg for the stamp. He then transports it to the retailer for sale and the retailer pays tax again on the same barrel. The retailer sells it to a restaurant and restaurant is taxed on the sale of that keg, the keg is tapped and for each beer sold the consumer is taxed for there glass of beer.

Do you see anything wrong with this? Rights? Violated? Taxation without representation?

That is a long quote, but it is so good I hope I can repeat it.

It is unimaginable what the government has done to us, but we think it is normal.

reply to post by Evil_Santa

At some point, this community, the conspiracy theory community,

The problem is that the conspiracy theories are mainstream now, more than ever before, I can't remember a time when you would hear them mentioned on the news like you do today, once we were pretty much ignored.

That is a problem for the government when a large segment of society aint gonna take it anymore, and is on to them.

Conspiracy theories, many, have a grain of truth to them.

It is in the governments best interest to discredit us.

I think our government is worse than ever, and I came to ATS a skeptic, not particularly interested in CTs at all.

I wanted to believe this was the land of the free, and that our leaders were honest, I did believe it, now I can't think of one I trust.

Before me things create were none, save things
Eternal, and eternal I endure.
All hope abandon ye who enter here.