Homosexuality= 999,999,999,999,999,999 God= 0

Originally posted by meggiddo2012
reply to post by lupodigubbio

 

Question. If you eliminate the male or female sex from the equation, could humanity or humans continue to exist or will we cease to exist?

Is this a genuine question, or are you asking a rhetorical question in order to insert your religious beliefs into the conversation?
Yes, we humans have a biological reproductive process that currently requires a male and a female.
And guess what?
Some of us that are reproduced are not straight.
Do you understand that concept?

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

 

Being Gay is not normal any more than being a psychopath is normal. What is normal is what most people do. I can say that homosexuality is not normal and still love my child if they end up gay. I really don't need to teach my child any lies. If I say homosexuality is normal than I lie, because statically it is simply not normal.

Homosexuality is an abnormal choice and there is nothing wrong with me teaching my child the truth.

Last time I checked, the motto around here was "Deny Ignorance"....
Perhaps it has been changed to "Reinforce Ignorance".
I dunno, just checking...maybe I missed the memo.......

reply to post by sacgamer25

I can say that homosexuality is not normal and still love my child if they end up gay.

This love the sinner not the sin does not translate here. This isn't a particular character trait. It's the core of who they are.

If your child was gay and you viewed it as unnatural, wrong, immoral in the eyes of God, believe me real love would be incompatible with that. You wouldn't be loving that person, you would be loving your version of that person. And that version would be far removed from the truth.

reply to post by lupodigubbio


It seems many homosexually inclined individuals turn to the more hypocritical forms of christianity to fight their natural desires in the sad attempt to conform to a warped society.

I believe many of the "straight" church leaders fall into this category as they're always going on about fighting the urge to ... co-mingle with the nearest member of the same sex.

As a fairly straight individual, I don't find myself fighting the urge to sexually attack my same sex friends, or aggressively go after opposite sex people except when socially acceptable.

Those people kinda scare and sadden me.

if the guy had a meaningful and heartfelt transistion to christianity, harrassing him because he's christian is not going to go over any better than harrassing him because he's gay. so if you thought it was hard on a homosexual to endure being treated like a pariah, just imagine what the gay guy in the op is going thru. people need to back off

It was interesting to read the first 2 pages of this. Realized some people still have a bit of, dare i say "hate"?
As far as i'm aware there is no word for "homosexual" in the original texts.
The closest thing they got was male prostitutes, right?

Hey, i don't know, i was myself born straight. So if i was born straight, which is a sexual orientation. Why would homosexuals NOT be born homosexual? I don't know, it seems to me that perhaps it upsets and makes people uncomfortable (heck, i still feel a bit awkward around 2 gay people, not going to lie) but i think that's because society has put a lot of pressure on people these days.

All im saying is.. those who are saying "but yes we are all born with sin" but being born with a straight orientation isn't considered a sin, right? So why would a different orientation at birth be considered a sin?

And yes, i am religious. Raised a catholic. Keppin' it real.

reply to post by Baddogma


let me put it into perspective. jesus is not the problem. in fact, i can see very clearly why a gay man or woman would be attracted to not only what he had to say, but also his overall essence. he was a compassionate humanitarian, 1000s of years before human beings even had the idea that maybe being excellent to each other was a better plan. he was the first to preach against slavery (but no one listened to him) and the first to erase the lines of authority between men and women (but no one listened to him), the first to suggest we use common sense and love in difficult situations. he pointed out that we are not the physical conglomeration of genes we were born with, but, well, let yoda say it

reply to post by undo

if the guy had a meaningful and heartfelt transistion to christianity

It has more to do with the idea he, and others, thought a belief system could change ones orientation. Many religious think this can occur. OP is an example of that not being the case. Many non-religious continue to watch this happen meanwhile knowing full well what the outcome will be.

harrassing him because he's christian

I want to say this. And it's a statement that transcends this thread and ATS.

I am not going to stop harassing religion. I do it with passion on my side. I try to match the harassing force put upon us by the religious with equal conviction. Atheism, or in my case, anti-theism, is a reactionary position. It came after the religions. If religions didn't spend as much time affecting our lives with their dogmatic beliefs we would have no reason to harass in return. So I submit, it's the religions that need to stop.

people need to back off

I am not sure how literal you're being. Do you believe the guy in the article is reading this thread?

Originally posted by undo
if the guy had a meaningful and heartfelt transistion to christianity, harrassing him because he's christian is not going to go over any better than harrassing him because he's gay. so if you thought it was hard on a homosexual to endure being treated like a pariah, just imagine what the gay guy in the op is going thru. people need to back off

I'm not harassing him because he is a Christian. I'm pointing out that he is a blatant liar, that God did not heal him of the ever-elusive "Sin" of Homosexuality, (nor has he ever healed anybody from homosexuality, as it is not a disease) and that he should stop brainwashing others through his writings and blogs, especially the LGBT youth.

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


so you believe miraculous healing is impossible? it's rare, i'll give you that, but impossible? do i hear the sound of the religion of probability?

reply to post by lupodigubbio


well let's look at that another way. in the old testament people were killed for various things, homosexuality being one of them. they were also killed for failing to keep the faith, for failing to perform according to impossible standards erected by human societies. jesus went to those who judged the people and told them to stop the stoning and all the other difficulties surrounding it and to use common sense and compassion instead. whether he is healed of it or not, isn't the point. here is YOUR opportunity to treat him compassionately, and you can't do it.

reply to post by MrConspiracy

As far as i'm aware there is no word for "homosexual" in the original texts.

There is not no.

That word wasn't termed until the late 19th century by Karl-Maria Kertbeny. Same person that termed 'heterosexuality'.

Kertbeny also put forward the view that homosexuality was inborn and unchangeable, an argument which would later be called the "medical model" of homosexuality. This contradicted the dominant view up to that time, that men committed "sodomy" out of mere wickedness.

The psychological understanding of 'orientation' is actually relatively new. Back in Biblical times they would have used words to describe the physical expression of sexuality, and not one that encompasses the innerworld of said persons psychology.

The closest thing they got was male prostitutes, right?

On page 5 (?) I gave some examples concerning that.

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


ah yes! see, i should read further before giving my opinion.
hahaha, thanks

reply to post by meggiddo2012

Originally posted by meggiddo2012
reply to post by OptimusSubprime

 

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
New Living Translation (NLT)
9 Don’t you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, 10 or are thieves, or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people—none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. 11 Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

Romans 1:18-27
New Living Translation (NLT)

18 But God shows his anger from heaven against all sinful, wicked people who suppress the truth by their wickedness.[a] 19 They know the truth about God because he has made it obvious to them. 20 For ever since the world was created, people have seen the earth and sky. Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God.

21 Yes, they knew God, but they wouldn’t worship him as God or even give him thanks. And they began to think up foolish ideas of what God was like. As a result, their minds became dark and confused. 22 Claiming to be wise, they instead became utter fools. 23 And instead of worshiping the glorious, ever-living God, they worshiped idols made to look like mere people and birds and animals and reptiles.

24 So God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies. 25 They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. 26 That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. 27 And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men, and as a result of this sin, they suffered within themselves the penalty they deserved.

The following is a small breakdown of other things the bible forbids and I feel it shows how crazy it is to pick and choose the parts you adhere to:

Clams, oysters, crabs, lobsters, and shrimp are abominations to God. 11:10-12

Don't let cattle graze with other kinds of Cattle (Leviticus 19:19)

Don't have a variety of crops on the same field. (Leviticus 19:19)

Don't wear clothes made of more than one fabric (Leviticus 19:19)

Don't cut your hair nor shave. (Leviticus 19:27)

Any person who curseth his mother or father, must be killed. (Leviticus 20:9) Have you ever done that?

If a man cheats on his wife, or vise versa, both the man and the woman must die. (Leviticus 20:10). I wonder if Dr. Laura would like that one to be enforced?

If a man sleeps with his father's wife... both him and his father's wife is to be put to death. (Leviticus 20:11)

If a man sleeps with his wife and her mother they are all to be burnt to death. (Leviticus 20:14)

If a man or woman has sex with an animal, both human and animal must be killed. (Leviticus 20:15-16). I guess you should kill the animal since they were willing participants. Are they crazy?

If a man has sex with a woman on her period, they are both to be "cut off from their people" (Leviticus 20:18)

Psychics, wizards, and so on are to be stoned to death. (Leviticus 20:27)

If a priest's daughter is a whore, she is to be burnt at the stake. (Leviticus 21:9)

People who have flat noses, or is blind or lame, cannot go to an altar of God (Leviticus 21:17-18)

Anyone who curses or blasphemes God, should be stoned to death by the community. (Leviticus 24:14-16)

Don't let cattle graze with other kinds of Cattle (Leviticus 19:19)

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by lupodigubbio

 

well let's look at that another way. in the old testament people were killed for various things, homosexuality being one of them. they were also killed for failing to keep the faith, for failing to perform according to impossible standards erected by human societies. jesus went to those who judged the people and told them to stop the stoning and all the other difficulties surrounding it and to use common sense and compassion instead. whether he is healed of it or not, isn't the point. here is YOUR opportunity to treat him compassionately, and you can't do it.

Well, most of humanity (including Christians and yourself, I'm sure) have failed from time to time to be compassionate and merciful like the great Nazarene.However, if you carefully read my OP you will see there is some benevolence and compassion in my words. But you are right, I am hardly Saint material.

i do believe sodomy was an act in the old testament, and not a type of person, since some hetero males have been known to sodomize enemies as an act of violence and humiliation and are otherwise, hetero.

i am of the belief that there are moments in the old testament that refer to god, that are not referring to a supernatural being but pharaoh and that these lines had been blurred by the time of later translations. i think the grizzly end of sodom and gomorrah was a pharaonic event, in other words.

L.G.B.T

there is so much in a title... or should I say "entitlement"

with a designation it will never be considered normal. Heterosexual has one definition = "normal"

as long as the lgbt's keep using a title such as gay or lesbian they will never be "normal"

makes perfect sense to me envisioning the effect an entitlement has on a population as a whole whether they know it or not.

reply to post by undo


I think you misunderstand why the freethoughts blogger exposed him.
At no point (as far as I see) has she attacked him for being Christian, she has exposed him as a hypocrite as he was a prominent figure within an openly anti-gay group.

reply to post by undo

so you believe miraculous healing is impossible? it's rare, i'll give you that, but impossible?

Part of my belief is the position that "God" doesn't interact in this manner.

The problem with believing in miraculous healing, prayer, and equivalent, is that it invites (rightfully so) judgement towards God's benevolence. For ever person claiming miracles from the divine in their favour, someone else can, for instance, point to tsunamis killing countless believers.

Personally I don't think 'free will' and 'benevolence' as religious ideas can be reconciled unless God is unattached from Creation. At least insofar as further interaction.

I used to pray. At times to God, times to the Universe itself, to luck and fortune as though it were an entity... but at the end of the day, I couldn't faithfully say I was more deserving of that miracle than many many others. Surely I was further back in the line of those needing benevolent assistance. To the point, why doesn't God heal amputees?

reply to post by b14warrior


Wow that Leviticus guy was a right old misery guts wasnt he?