The Myth That Greeks Do Not Work Hard, page 1

Pages: << 1 2 >>
ATS Members have flagged this thread 5 times

Topic started on 6-2-2013 @ 08:36 AM by michael1983l

I was inspired by another thread I read about US postal workers and them not working Saturdays any longer and it made me want to look into the working hours over here in Europe. The first suprise to me, is not what most MSM would lead you to believe is that the Greeks work some of the longest hours in Europe. See the below table published by Eurofound in 2010

www.eurofound.europa.eu...

You will notice the Greeks at the top of the table with a working hour week of 40 hours, whilst the EU's leading 3 economies are all near the bottom 35.6, 37.5 and 37.7 respectively (France, UK and Germany). So this begs the question, what actually makes a strong economy if it is not hard working population?

The BBC has also done an article on this and I quote

A look at the average annual hours worked per person in selected countries puts South Korea top with a whopping 2,193 hours, followed by Chile on 2,068.

"Korea sticks out because it's a developed country that's working long hours," he says. "Normally it's developing countries like Bangladesh, Malaysia, Thailand, Sri Lanka - countries like this that are working long hours."

www.bbc.co.uk...

An interesting point but not a suprising point was that the developing nations work the most excessive hours.

Another thing to note is the complete disparity between certain nations when it comes to paid leave.

Some European countries have a higher statutory level of paid leave - 25 days in Austria, Denmark, France, Italy, Luxembourg and Sweden in 2010, according to the European Industrial Relations Observatory (Eiro). And some employers provide more paid leave than the statutory miniumum.

From what I understand from family working in the USA, that they only get 2 weeks paid leave a year, how on earth does the worlds biggest economy only give its workers 2 weeks paid leave a year. For example I get 4 and a quater weeks plus any public holidays, so totalling over 5 weeks a year.

It goes to show, working hard does not always pay off.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:42 AM by rickymouse

reply to post by michael1983l

When I was working I used to work a minimum of 60 hours a week in my business. The rest of the time I spent working on building my house and blowing snow. I did take a couple of hours off a day to have coffee in the restaurant though. Where did it get me? My body is kind of worn out and it's regenerative properties are pretty well used up.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:47 AM by sligtlyskeptical

Originally posted by michael1983l

From what I understand from family working in the USA, that they only get 2 weeks paid leave a year, how on earth does the worlds biggest economy only give its workers 2 weeks paid leave a year. For example I get 4 and a quater weeks plus any public holidays, so totalling over 5 weeks a year.

It goes to show, working hard does not always pay off.

You get 2 weeks if you have a good job. Most jobs in the USA do not give paid vacations.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:47 AM by mythots

Paid leave isn't controlled by the Goverment in the states unless you work for them. In the States each compnay is more or less free to set it's own standards. The difference all those countries and the States have is the benifits companies are forced to give the people working for them and the higher taxes they have to pay . at least as of right now anyways. sure that will change soon.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:47 AM by michael1983l

reply to post by rickymouse

I think like in all aspects of life, a happy medium will probably be the best way to approach working hours. A work/life balance is certainly needed and I think those countries that go to extremes of working their people can develop their own social problems because of it. I could not work for a company that only gave 2 weeks paid holiday a year, that is a disgrace as far as I am concerned.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:49 AM by michael1983l

Originally posted by mythots
Paid leave isn't controlled by the Goverment in the states unless you work for them. In the States each compnay is more or less free to set it's own standards. The difference all those countries and the States have is the benifits companies are forced to give the people working for them and the higher taxes they have to pay . at least as of right now anyways. sure that will change soon.

So do you think that the EU has this right or wrong? I can't make out which side of the fence you sit on. The EU has the working time directive and the UK government enforces a statutary minimum of holidays ect.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:56 AM by Toadmund

A hard working population is a tired population.

There is not even enough jobs to go around for everyone to be working 40+ hours a week, so why do we keep working 40+ hours?

Oh yeah, I know, to subsidize those who do not have a job....got it.

No, it's the Puritan work ethic that we still cling to.

I am sure that if the new full time was 30 hours a week, the cost of living will adjust to what people can pay, not only that but productivity may go up due to less tired people.

Yeah, it is interesting that the most well to do countries have shorter work hours and more paid time off.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:56 AM by HelenConway

reply to post by michael1983l

Michael I do not think that it is said that the Greek people do not work hard. Is it not more about the level of tax that they pay? Tax dodging is a national sport - or so the MSM tell me, i do not know if this is true.

Plus all the Greek bail out funds have gone to the banks to prevent their collapse, not to the people.

Joining the Euro a one time triple AAA currency meant they could borrow with low interest rates, when changes in the global economy and then subsequently in Greece's economy occured, inflation was outstripping their ability to repay loans.

This meant that the govt departments were defaulting.

Greece needs to be able to devalue its currency and start again, it can't do this because it does not havea central bank and it is in the odd position of have 'junk' status applied to its ability to repay its debts, yet it uses a currency where the central bank is not under the control of its govt.

Only solution IMO - leave the Euro, go bust, start again - with a new currency - plus pay taxes this time. She needs a clean slate.

edit on 6-2-2013 by HelenConway because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 08:58 AM by jazzguy

its a sad age we live in when your self-worth is measured by the amount of time you spend working for someone else.

conditioning at its finest

remember back in 80s when people were afraid of losing their jobs to computers, and the MSM came out and said Dont worry we will all be working shorter hours.

i swear love of money is a disease

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:01 AM by HelenConway

Originally posted by michael1983l
reply to post by rickymouse

I think like in all aspects of life, a happy medium will probably be the best way to approach working hours. A work/life balance is certainly needed and I think those countries that go to extremes of working their people can develop their own social problems because of it. I could not work for a company that only gave 2 weeks paid holiday a year, that is a disgrace as far as I am concerned.

I know 2 weeks a year is a disgrace. Americans why do you let them do this to you !

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:02 AM by MrWendal

reply to post by michael1983l

This is an interesting topic to me.

My current Supervisor used to work in France. He is a well traveled man. We talked one night about workers in France and Greek and in his words, "They are lazy". I found it an odd thing to say and I asked him to explain,. I can not recall exactly what he said about Greece, it may have been that the average person only works like 6 hours per day or something to that effect. I remember vividly how he said in August many places in France are closed because everyone is on holiday (vacation).

As far as American workers and what type of time off we get, it depends where you work. As I have said before on this site, I worked as a DJ for 20 years. I got no time off. There was no vacation time, there was no paid time off. To give you an idea of what it was like for me, as a DJ, I actually broke my back at work one night (my L2 and L3). I got one day off. On day 2 my boss called my phone to ask me how I felt. He then asked if I planned to come to work that evening. I told him I needed a few more days, to which he replied, "I know you're hurting and injured and I don't want to rush you back but if you do not come in tonight I will have to replace you".

Yes you read that right.... after breaking my back at my job, I was told to suck it up and get back to work or lose my job. We had no vacations, you could take one if you wanted... but that did not mean you had a job when you got back. As a DJ, I did get 4 days off once.... after working 3 years in the same place, and it was not paid.

Now my current job is different. They actually have a pretty good benefits package, especially compared to many other places I have worked. After 1 year of work I will get 12 days of paid time off. However the fact is, there are many workers who do not get vacation time, do not get paid time off. They literally get nothing for their work. Here is the US it varies greatly, there really is not a norm that I am aware of.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:03 AM by iwontrun

When I lived in Greece the normal work week was about 32 hours, most only worked enough to pay their bills and called it quits for the week. It made it really hard to count on co-workers. The other thing I found really odd was how an 08:00 start time meant 8ish if you showed up about 08:30 that was OK. Oh and don't forget siesta in the afternoon, and some people didn't come back after that. I also noticed they had virtually no manufacturing jobs there. I'm not criticizing, I think their " Work to live, not live to work" attitude refreshing. I believe their financial problems come from rampant corruption in the government and misappropriation of funds, not a bad work ethic. I could have gotten my DDS license for $10,000 no schooling required!

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:04 AM by MrWendal

Originally posted by michael1983l
[ I could not work for a company that only gave 2 weeks paid holiday a year, that is a disgrace as far as I am concerned.

Hate to break the news to you, but your options working in the US would be very very limited

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:07 AM by Flavian

reply to post by michael1983l

Just to be nit picky, your thread title is not proved one way or another by these statistics. They show that Greeks are at work longer than many other nations - it does not give any indication as to how hard they actually work whilst they are there! My highly selective (holidays only) and therefore highly unscientific observations would suggest not that hard at all.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:08 AM by HelenConway

Originally posted by MrWendal

Originally posted by michael1983l
[ I could not work for a company that only gave 2 weeks paid holiday a year, that is a disgrace as far as I am concerned.

Hate to break the news to you, but your options working in the US would be very very limited

Look I am with you .. and I KNOW.
But I want you guys to get good holidays so you can come visit us in Europe and wherever, how can you do that with 2 measly weeks a year

When I was 21 I had a job in the US, that for one reason or another I declined. However these days it is near impossible for Western Europeans to get into the US to work.

The easiest route is the asylum route or the lottery of which British citizens cannot partake BTW.

If I had the chance again I would defo live in America for a while.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:09 AM by iwontrun

reply to post by HelenConway

I do agree tax dodging is the national sport. When I did my deliveries, all payments were in cash ( in a brown lunch bag ) and was told to watch out for the tax man. I felt like I was working for the mob.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:10 AM by sligtlyskeptical

Originally posted by jazzguy
its a sad age we live in when your self-worth is measured by the amount of time you spend working for someone else.

conditioning at its finest

remember back in 80s when people were afraid of losing their jobs to computers, and the MSM came out and said Dont worry we will all be working shorter hours.

i swear love of money is a disease

I love that you remember that. I say the same thing to people and they look at me strange. I always remember Disney World and the visions of the future, where robots would replace workers, and everyone would work shorter hours with more recreation. They just forgot to tell us that life was only meant for the owners of the robots and that everyone else would work shorter hours without earning enough for much recreation.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:11 AM by rickymouse

Originally posted by HelenConway

Originally posted by michael1983l
reply to post by rickymouse

I think like in all aspects of life, a happy medium will probably be the best way to approach working hours. A work/life balance is certainly needed and I think those countries that go to extremes of working their people can develop their own social problems because of it. I could not work for a company that only gave 2 weeks paid holiday a year, that is a disgrace as far as I am concerned.

I know 2 weeks a year is a disgrace. Americans why do you let them do this to you !

We are conditioned to think it is normal.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 09:12 AM by HelenConway

Originally posted by MrWendal
reply to post by michael1983l

Here is the US it varies greatly, there really is not a norm that I am aware of.

It was not always like this in the US have you watched Micheal Moores film on Capitalism ? It explains it well, especially where he is talking about his father when he worked in the car industry.

reply posted on 6-2-2013 @ 10:56 AM by mythots

Originally posted by michael1983l

Originally posted by mythots
Paid leave isn't controlled by the Goverment in the states unless you work for them. In the States each compnay is more or less free to set it's own standards. The difference all those countries and the States have is the benifits companies are forced to give the people working for them and the higher taxes they have to pay . at least as of right now anyways. sure that will change soon.

So do you think that the EU has this right or wrong? I can't make out which side of the fence you sit on. The EU has the working time directive and the UK government enforces a statutary minimum of holidays ect.

I don't want Government in any part of my life. So if the company I work for won't give more paid leave sick days or holiday pay then i will just find a company that will. If I can't then I will take unpaid time off. I refuse to work my life away only to leave everything here when I die. Memories may be all that we take with us and people spend to little time making them.

Pages: << 1 2 >> ^^TOP^^