Even if Aliens are out there, they may never find us, nor us find them.

Originally posted by Unidentified_Objective
The answer may be in anti-matter. If we can figure out how to produce it or harness it more efficiently, it may lead to a solution. At the moment, we can only produce very little of the stuff...

Good and informative post overall, except for this small problem. Anti-matter is like regular matter, except with charges reversed. It does not have anti-gravitational properties required to do all the fictitious nonsense of artificially warping spacetime. That requires something called "exotic matter" which has negative mass, something the vast majority of the scientific community regards as an absurdity and has no basis in reality.

You'd think it would have occurred to me to say in my previous post, but who's to say we could even identify an alien species, or it us? Most of us assume alien life would be carbon or silicon based because its all that we can wrap our heads around. Assuming an alien species would even use genetics, suppose the basis of life in their case were a heavy metal such as osmium. Its entirely possible that their functions would move at such a slower rate compared to us that we could only observe metabolic processes on the scale of centuries, and mistake it for something as simple as erosion. They, on that same supposition, may never notice something as fleeting as us.

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
If the universe is billions of years old and there is life in other galaxies with much older star systems, Aliens would have figured out how to leave their planets before there star system made it uninhabitable.

Problem with odds, is they work both ways I feel. What are the odds of you being alive right now in your present form.

Your universe had to be created ...
Conditions of universe had to be correct for you ...
Planet had to be an acceptable distance from the sun ...
Nothing had to crash into your planet ...
You had to evolve ....
Then your species had to thrive ...
Then your parents had to meet ...
Then the right reproductive cell had to meet with the right egg ...

If I had to bet on you existing in your present form right now on this planet with your name and history if we redid everything over again ... I don't think the odds would be that amazingly fantastic. A lot of things have really low chances of happening but happen always.

Also, assuming other species of ultra smart beings are nice, if two ultra smart species meet ... then there is two species that can interstellar travel. If those two find one more, there is three and so on ... Its unlikely perhaps, but we only need one of us to get 'ahead of the class' as a species.

Also imagine this ... what if there is no species that works it out alone? What if it's two species communicating over giant distances that achieve the first interstellar travel method via sharing their discoveries of the universe? In this case, it is very important to keep searching. (See the film 'Contact')

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


They are already here, BJ.
So already you are behind the 8 ball.
And who told you they need to travel a million light years?
To say they can not get here from there is to think in 20th century human terms.
Like 20th century man knew it all.

You deniers must lie a lot, if you think everyone in the past 50 years has been lying about aliens this whole time.

Life and Earth are indeed unique. Many scientists subscribe to the fact that life, as we know it, that appeared on earth was nothing short of a miracle. I am not bringing in religion or beliefs of God, I am just using a word, term that many have used to describe the magnificence of life itself.

Like many of us, I am a dreamer, lover of life and like to think with and open-mind about many things, including the possibility of life elsewhere, perhaps in our gallaxy, solar system, the Universe. Is the existence of life elsewhere possible............how could anyone say NO to this question?

I believe there are many mysteries yet to be discovered both here on Earth and out there, in vastness of Space.

For many years of my life I've wanted to believe in ET. Although I can't say that it is impossible, would never do that, however, I think that the possibility of intelligent, and highly intelligent life out there existing continues to get smaller and smaller IMHO!!

I remain open-minded, however, after reading a lot, researching and attending many scientific symposiums (I am not a scientist, just a info-guru, lol) I have come to the belief that life on Earth is indeed unique and its' being, defies our current logic. If you subscribe to the theory of Evolution, then, just the muddy steamy soup of the beginning of single cells and then multi-celled organics evolving to US is nothing short of being almost impossible....but we know differently. Of course, maybe our beginnings were entirely brought about by another unknown means? We just don't know!!

In conclusion, as much as I would like to believe, and I do leave open the possibility of life being out there, somewhere, my feelings as to it being intelligent, or highly intelligent, is dwindling. In any event, I do not believe that any of us, at least during our generation(s) will ever see such!!!

Peace!! ID

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


I agree. I am as sure as I can be that there are probably many other civilizations throughout the universe. Having said that, I haven't seen anything that would lead me to believe that any of them have knowledge of Earth or even of each other for that matter. I suppose maybe it's easier to think that another life form would be more advanced that we are, but it's just as likely they are not as advanced as us. Regardless how much more advanced the life form, there simply isn't any real evidence that they would have the ability to for interstellar space travel.

reply to post by usernameconspiracy


I don't want to criticize those that think we have already been visited and made first contact, that's what this forum is for, and I respect that. But just like a person can be agnostic or atheist towards God, a person can be that way towards Aliens.

Is it possible God created one sentient life form per galaxy and it's there own galaxy to grow into ?

Thus the possibility that the Fermi Paradox is in fact a reality for our own galaxy alone, but not the universe ?

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


Could be were were quarantined for the good of the universe.

Originally posted by OpenEars123
2 words; worm holes.

Never say never!

Hopefully you understand that there's a lot more to wormhole travel than just jumping into a hole and falling out of it somewhere else. Maybe you can find one in a singularity generated by a black hole, but you would need an insane amount of energy to get past the event horizon while avoiding being crushed into a thin paste, and even more to survive a trip "through" it (if there even is such a thing). We're talking galactic scales of energy. and navigation to get where you want to go? How to do that is anybody's guess.

Yeah, sure. "Wormholes!" Like that is the easy answer to everything.

Originally posted by Malfeitor
reply to post by Blue_Jay33

 

Could be were were quarantined for the good of the universe.

I think you give us way too much credit. If the "eat and be eaten" laws of nature found on Earth extend out into space, we would probably be at the level of plankton.

Originally posted by wjones837
I remain skeptical about alien visitation for this very reason. Even if the universe is teeming with life, the chances of any two crossing paths is small with the immense size of the universe.

The sheer expanding size of the universe does a couple of things. It increases the possibility of life happening more than once -- since you have all of time and space for random things to happen -- but it certainly doesn't bring it any closer to us. If you think about it, if life managed to form someplace else about the same time it did here on Earth, in 4 billion years it has now drifted even farther away from us than it was then, and it's still going.

Then there's a kind of philosophical question I wonder about. If you can never, ever prove there is any other life out there, even if there is, what difference does it make if it does or doesn't? People sometimes like to quote the Drake Equation and say that there could be tens of thousands of intelligent alien civilizations out there. But if we will never find them, or can never prove they exist, how are they any different than just imaginary civilizations we dream up in fiction? If you can't prove something actually exists, or it exists on some level that is completely incomprehensible to our little monkey brains, does it really exist?

When you get right down to it, the only aliens most people are interested in are those like us. Something out of Star Wars or Star Trek. Who exist on roughly the same level we do. Organic creatures that are not immortal, who have individual consciousnesses and points of view, who have a similar very limited perception and comprehension of the electromagnetic spectrum and time and space. So given the size of the universe, as unlikely as it would be for us to cross paths with aliens, it's made even less likely and more improbable because they have to be similar enough to us for us to even comprehend or interact with or relate to.

I had a dream the other night about aliens. They turned out to be terrifying, huge, bug-like things that only partially existed in our familiar reality and screamed and buzzed constantly like cicadas. There was no way to reasonably communicate with them or deal with them and no way we were going to learn the secrets of the universe from them. They weren't purposely malevolent, any more than a bolt of lightning; just completely outside any of our notions of good and bad and positive and negative. They didn't even have "spaceships" as we understand them. They were either there, or not. Let's hope we don't ever run into that type of alien.

I think they could potentially find us through a mod'd telescope combined with X-ray/thermal/infrared and maybe even life sensory equipment imaging at a high zoom rate.

I realistically imagine them being able to look right on our planet from light years away like a DARPA surveillance drone overlooking a battlefield.

I'm willing to bet we have this capability within a half century.

Originally posted by TheLieWeLive

Example: A cellular phone. If you took one just a hundred years in the past you would absolutely blow peoples minds.

boingboing.net...

Originally posted by metalholic
reply to post by TheLieWeLive

 

I want to expand on your thought and say. Imagine how a black hole is an open end that vacuums the space around it. Now if everythign that gets sucked into it is condensed to pure energy.

Doesn't it then make sense that at the other end of this wide bas is a focal point. Mirroring on a huge scale the base of a pyramid leading up to the point.

So that the highly condensed pure energy becomes the nucleus and or power plant of a star. As stars are just points of massive amounts of energy.

I'll bet a model would be a sphere with two funnels (small ends on the sphere) sticking out of it sort of like that hourglass nebula or even haven't they found jets coming out of a black hole or something like that? Maybe if the black hole is spinning on an axis you could fly into it via one of the poles and jet out the other end in some other part of the galaxy or universe. my question is how do you navigate?

Originally posted by usernameconspiracy
reply to post by Blue_Jay33

 

I agree. I am as sure as I can be that there are probably many other civilizations throughout the universe.

That sentence on its own is part of the problem here. There are many millions if not billions of species of life on this planet, but how many have formed 'civilisations'? One to the best of my knowledge - us. Of course, I understand the term is subjective, but it shows the leap from life, to sentient life, to a level of intelligence to use tools at first at a crude level then reaching more complexity. Then the need for technological progress - some of which may be purely down to chance then.... and I could go on and on. and that's without the chances of some catastrophic event destroying all that progress before it reaches a further stage.

For me personally that's why life elsewhere is more likely than not, but it does not by any means lead to that life being in a position to - or maybe even comprehend - travelling outside their own planet.

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33

The chance to travel a few million light years would take longer than a space ship could survive and the crew even in stasis would be hard to survive for millions of years.

My point, I don't think there is travel between galaxies. And if we are alone in the Milky Way we will never see those other life forms in other galaxies. We certainly won't be traveling to see them anytime soon, it would take several thousand light years just to get to the edge of the Milky Way.

This is the same logic as those had 150 years ago, predicting that in our, modern times, the planet will be sunk deep into Horse shiate since everyone will have a carriage.

Point is, we cannot know or predict what technology a civilization will have available which is 100s, 1000s or even 10000s years more advanced to us. Latest scientific findings might well lead to the idea that space/time can be manipulated, which would make space-travel basically "instant". The entire idea of how alleged UFO propulsion works is based on this. Just 150 years ago, on THIS planet, electric light, bacteria, moving pictures, wireless communication, cars, planes etc were pure science fiction. People could not even *imagine* those things.

reply to post by something wicked

There are many millions if not billions of species of life on this planet, but how many have formed 'civilisations'? One to the best of my knowledge - us. Of course, I understand the term is subjective, but it shows the leap from life, to sentient life, to a level of intelligence to use tools at first at a crude level then reaching more complexity. Then the need for technological progress - some of which may be purely down to chance then.... and I could go on and on. and that's without the chances of some catastrophic event destroying all that progress before it reaches a further stage.

A very good point, we have on our own planet an example in the dinosaurs existing on our very own planet for over 200 million years, and you could double even triple that and they were never going to develop even a 0 type civilization. You could put them on any class M planet and the result would be the same, look at the size of there brains. Then an extinction level event occurs and just like that it's over for the dominate life on the planet.

reply to post by Blue_Jay33



the problem is you only have human beings as a reference point to this logic. what if there's an intelligent race out there who worshiped technology and never wasted time with blowing each other up or the slavery of economic system?

a being like that could probably surprise us on what they can do technologically.

Or maybe the oldest beings that have been around since almost the beginning of the universe whos to say what they cant do?

The possibilities are endless if you stop and think outside the Human culture as a reference point.

As for us achieving this? maybe if we can survive long enough from eachother.

Think for a moment of traveling to Saturn. Seeing the rings...did your thought not take you there faster than the speed of light? Don't tell me the speed of light is an impregnable barrier. IT JUST HAPPENED!

All your claims of 'not being able to travel' are just laughable.... EVER heard of chemical elements not found on Earth? Ever thought that there may be technology we cannot even imagine.. No! You think it all has gto be done by HUMAN thinking, HUMAN technology, SPACE is only the way you imagine, ever considered there are things and ways we may not even imagine exist?

Noo... all thought frm human perspective. Well this is evry UNscientific to think... because you do not know how they would travel..