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We’ll be lucky to BE HERE in 700 years… If all of it IS real, they need to address someone in a position of power, not a Swiss farmer cult leader.
Yes, they are. You’ll see that the man I mentioned is a member of CAUS (Citizens Against UFO Secrecy), who wrote the paper on Horn’s site. Likewise, since it is claimed that the validation was done with secrecy agreements with the labs involved, there is no way for a third party to authenticate that these facilities were used as claimed. Isn’t THAT convenient?
Yes, I have read it, (written by the CAUS member). You’ll also note that this man’s expertise is in digital imaging, NOT photo film analysis. This is like trusting a vet to perform an operation on a human. Sure, some things overlap, but completely different animals here. While I’m no scientist, I do have enough expertise in film developing, etc.
This likely won’t be till early next year, as other things are occupying my weekends through the holiday season.
I myself have many new age beliefs. However, my point was to show that Marcel, like the photo analyst, already has a disposition towards the subject, so he is not the best source to cite as the only scientist to authenticate the samples.
And just what are we to do against it? Warning me that a I’ll be hit by lightning sometime in the future isn’t going to help me avoid it unless you say exactly when and where. This seemed to be no trouble for past events, so why now? (besides the reasons already given). If they truly wished to help, they’d say HOW we could stop it..
Let's review what we have discussed so far. As it stands, your original arguments stand nullified
You said: Photographic evidence is an easily reproducable hoax
I said: They have not been succesfully reproduced
As you have not produced any evidence in this regard, and the ones you have tried to use as evidence, stand debunked, the only proof you can now offer, is reproducing them successfully. Till then this argument ends here.
You said: Meiers prophecies are vague and wrong, using the examples of Reagan and Ayatollah Khomeini.
I said: His predictions are many times precise and specific, and debunked your examples, using the same source as you.
As it is has not been proven that Meier has made these predictions prior to the events, I am left with providing proof that they have. If I succeed, then you should accept this as proof that Meier has genuinely forecasted the events and this is very compelling evidence that he is in contact with the Pleadians. Do you accept this?
How are the ones who reproduced this any more debunked than Billy's photos?
Sorry but silicon chips and film emulsion are completely different animals when it comes to manipulating images.
I'm surprised Billy or Horn hasn't sent these to Bruce Macabee. He's a pro-UFO FILM specialist...wonder what he'd say about them...???
EDIT: Seems like he did have something to say. He even went in for the Gulfbreeze case, but even he isn't swallowing Billy's story... Here's a slight debunking of the Meier film....
No, at the VERY least, it would prove he is a gifted prophet. It STILL wouldn't prove the stated source of the prophecies. ALL prophets are right sometimes, wrong others.
His sites claim he is 100% accurate. If I even show he was a fraction of 1% off, then the claim is a lie.
I believe I did that successfully.
As for attacking my bias, I'm sure that any third party here would agree that we are both biased in our approaches here .
I think we've squabbled pretty much to an empasse...as far as changing our positions on the subject of Billy. I'd love to hear others' input on this as well. This thread isn't exclusive to us you know!
Well considering that they do not succesfully reproduce his images, nor have been tested, in fact outrightly refused to be tested. To add, the retraction of Randi's claim Meier is a hoax. It stands that they are debunked.
You call this "debunking" and the author call it a hypothesis. Proving the UFO moved in a pendular motion, does not disprove it, it just says it moved in a pendular motion. As, you, nor me, have no knowledge of UFO navigation, we cannot say what is normal for a UFO, or whether the pendular motion was intentional.
If you need everything proven to you, why do you even believe UFO's are real? If he has indeed forecasted everything, which proves he has extraordinary psychic abilities, why does he even need to fabricate an alien species
That's called nitpicking, and it is generally done by those who cannot find bigger things. Anyone of Meiers predictions, because they are so precise and detailed, if proven to be genuine, would prove his case.
Your original points about his prophecies are debunked. Do you admit this?
Yeah, I agree. Are there any pro-Meiers out there?
I still believe they did reproduce his images just fine.
Even a broken clock is correct twice a day
Nope. We still haven't changed the fact that those predictions made in the PAST have exact times, dates, etc., whereas those for the future have NONE of this level of precision. We still haven't validated whether or not the claims were made prior to the events/
You are willing to accept photo analysis of multi-generation prints, without negatives, and done by a UFO group member who is not a photo analyst but a digital effects specialist.
You are willing to accept a video which has been shown by a pro-UFO physicist, to coincide with the movement of a model swinging from a fixed point.
You are willing to accept that a scientist believes he can show a sample as being an alien alloy, yet said scientist does not attempt to validate this claim with anyone else in the scientific community.
You are willing to accept that he was somehow able to pinpoint things to the exact minute with past events...but can't even narrow down a month or year for future events.
I would say the above certainly implies some logic dismissal and bias towards Billy here....
I simply still have many questions about the Meier case, regardless of stance. Why no pics of the ship interior? Why no pics of the aliens coming out of the ship? Why no other contactees than Billy? Where are the recent photos of the ships? Why no decent video footage, if they are so easy for him to photograph clearly? Etc. etc.
I just am not buying it....
Originally posted by Gazrok
likewise believe there is more than a shadow of doubt concerning Mr. Meier.
You should seriously consider getting in on some of Horn and Meier's action, as I applaud your debating skills
video of a disc blown by a fan while dangling on a string
I'll be making a new post, and U2U you at that time. Thanks for the discussion!
Originally posted by TerraX
Billy Meier's contact note 251 is a fine example of his prophecies.
Basicly the 23 pages of prophecies are chronologicly shuffled and no
specific years are given.Why? The best reason I can come up with is
that it would hide mistakes.By keeping it vague, incoherent and
non-structured, you stand the best chances of being succesful, depending
of course on your interpretation of the text.
Again, this is the stuff I don't see coming from the Meier supporters
or spokesmen who focus only on what was supposedly correct.I don't
even bother anymore to research the 251st contact note for accuracy.
It's a mumbo-jumbo list the size of a toilet role.Perhaps next time,
Billy Meier and his highly evolved Plejarens can make it a bit more
specific for us dumb Earth people.They wouldn't want us to be tricked,
251, fine example? mmm... not really. Meier published a 400+ page book on prophecies that's very specific. But perhaps you haven't read it yet cuz it's in German, or do I err? Have you read the Henoch prophecies written in 1987? Talking about the global war on terror that the U.S. would spearhead, the lands the U.S. would invade (and puppetize) until they figured out what was really going on, etc., etc. I don't think we can get any more specific than that. What do you think?
I haven't read the Henoch Prophecies, not because it's in German which I can read to a certain extent, it's more about being reluctant to do the effort.It's not being lazy, quite the contrary, I think I've done enough and it's the Meier camp responsibility to distribute the information freely (meaning no cost and I'm not going to pay for it) and openly and in English.
On a sidenote here, the Henoch Prophecies, is that about Russia invading Europe in WW3 where not only countries get invaded one by one but where also civic upheaval and chaos breaks out in France and England? Highly unrealistic compared to today's situation.Makes me think that the prophecy was written in a cold war mindset and in the end incorrect, but I've seen some people swing it into a 'lets wait and see' because, you guessed it, no date is given.
I'm more an 'Adamski-Menger supporter',