Should domestic cats be eradicated to protect wildlife?

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posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 03:34 PM
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Originally posted by purplemer
Maybe they should make a cat tax.



Please tell me you are not serious. Really?

Maybe there should be a dog tax or a goldfish tax or some other stupid useless steal money from the public tax. Adding another tax over something you don't like is moronic at best. It will simply lead to another tax somewhere down the road on something you enjoy. The tax money will not benefit anything except the politicians whoes pocket it will go into.

Cats in general are not the problem. Sure there are a ton of feral cats they can be fixed and released, they will die and not breed. The biggest problem is humnas removing habitat and poisoning with GMO seeds and outright poisons. I even pointed out that my cats have never killed anything but a stray bug or spider as they are indoor. One of my dogs however is lethal to anything she can catch when she goes out to use the bathroom.

To date she has killed two sparrows, maybe two rabbits, and a few voles/shrews. This is in a fenced in back yard, she is not roaming all over. She is not the problem either it is her instinct as she was breed for hunting (not her per say but her family for sure). She is fast, can climb and jump very high. This dog is more lethal than any of my cats who are old fat and lazy.

Again though people are the problem they always are. Insted of accepting responsibility though we are looking for a scapegoat in the cat. Look at how many birds die each year from cars and wind farms. Look at the number of birds that die from other predators besides cats (dogs, larger birds, foxs, ect.). And finally look at the number of birds that die as a direct result of human actions (poisoning, GMO crops, habitat removal) and you will see that cats are not the biggest threat.

Sure we need to fix the feral cat population, but anyone who has seen feral dogs, hogs, or anything else knows they can be just as bad if not more so. The root of the problem though is not the cats but the people. Anyone who calls for the complete eradication of a species is simply stupid (not saying you but in general). Each species has their place in the world, even the little mosquitoe helps us keep a bat population. Remove them and a large number of bats will die.

There is a happy meeting ground on this, but too many are against budging from their spot even a little. It is no wonder the world is so screwed, too much pride and not enough common sense.


Raist




posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 03:43 PM
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reply to post by Raist
 


Sorry but I think a cat tax is a good idea. You do not know how many birds your cat kills. Unless you keep it locked up inside. They are dirty animals and carry a lot of diseases. I am sure you may well be responsible but cats will do what cats do...

Hello Raist

f a cat cost like £2000 or something I think that would be fair. The money could be put back into cat exermanation and creating biodiversity for birds.. You cannot compare cats to goldfish or dogs. Goldfish sit in their bowls chilling out they do not spread disease or kill birds. A dog can be trained and kept under control the same cannot be said for cats.

People are always going on about immigrants coming to our countries. Well cats are immigrants and they are killing off native species at a huge rate.

From a quick look on the net it seems that cats kill billions of birds and mammals in the US every year. Car deaths of birds is in its millions.. You cannot make a comparison.

All the best

purp



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by purplemer
reply to post by Eedjee
 




My cat is my child. Utterly human, in fur. As they say in the pro 2nd Amendment community, "Come and take it." (Ya know. If you are suicidal.)


No it is a cat. It is not a human and its life should not be held above that of a human. Cats are psychotic killers and there should be less of them around. Maybe they should make a cat tax.


Nor should the life of a rodent or bird be held above that of a cat. Cats are not "psychotic killers." Ted Bundy was a psychotic killer. Cats are natural predators who hunt and kill out of instinct. It's what they were born to do--survive in the wild by eating other animals. Though we have certainly skewed their role in the world by domesticating them, if left to their own devices they would fill that ecological niche that helped keep the planet in balance, with plenty of songbirds left over to soothe your troubled soul.



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 03:56 PM
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reply to post by ollncasino
 


Excuse me, i don't mean to be rude but, that is absolute TRIPE. It is so arrogant of humans to stick their nose into natural processes. No human has the right to go around and cull species. And confining an animal to a house or a cage is irresponsible and cruel. The axiom we should all adopt is that we, humans are animals, we are not a dominant species, the fact that we are utterly dependant on pharma meds, frozen meals and a phony government to survive in the masses pretty much proves otherwise. I can only face palm.
-Sigh.
The most ridiculous thing i have seen all week!



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 03:56 PM
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double post, sorry!
edit on 5-2-2013 by SageRivers because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 04:02 PM
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reply to post by purplemer
 


Are cats the ones that are continually destroying the atmosphere and have wiped out many species, or humans?

Each life is equal, a cat has just as much emotion and consciousness as a human, same goes for dogs, elephants, and pretty much every other animal, so stop putting human life at the top.

If people like you continue to act the way they act, the human species will soon become nothing more than a disease.
edit on 5-2-2013 by extraterrestrialentity because: Typo



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 04:07 PM
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No they shouldn't..we need more stray cat's to eat the birds that carry diseases.
and rodent's....do you want a black plague scenario man? i dont...let them cat's do they thing...

Oh and they kill snakes....i hate snake's..so i will have a civil war with folks they try to steal my cat


Yeah you heard me WAR!!!!!



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 04:29 PM
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reply to post by ForestForager
 


No the issue is humans thinking we have dominion over all other species. We do not and should not. Cats have a right to hunt and kill, it is in their nature and nothing we have any right to stop. If the cat is an outdoor cat and wants to go outside, you have no right to stop and and even less right to kill it. I tell ya one thing, if my cat came onto your land and you killed it, rather than chase him off, well, my cat wouldnt be the only animal dead. Thats for damn sure.

Until we all all start trying to find some harmony amongst us all, we will always been doomed as a species.

It is a sad day. More humans thinking they can go around killing whatever they want because it strayed onto your little plot of land. Typical human Me Me Me, I I I thinking. Selfish species. I'm ashamed to call myself human.



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 04:42 PM
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reply to post by purplemer
 


Yeah, sorry but we are going to have to agree to disagree on this.

Taxing more things only leads to more taxes and they are not used how they should be ever. Most of them are a waste and outright government theft. This nanny state tax everything that I do not like needs to end. You might get taxes on cats passed but soon they will be looking to tax something you enjoy and it will be a pointless tax.

I believe you are looking at this the wrong way. Again my cats do not kill any thing, my dogs have. As for cleanliness you can read back a few of my other posts. My cats do most everything down stairs, no animal is on my food prep areas and they do not lick my face.

Raist



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 04:50 PM
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reply to post by purplemer
 


Goldfish and really all aquarium fish present the threat of a number of zoonotic diseases that can be transmitted to their handlers. I've personally run across fish tuberculosis and I could potentially catch it from my fish. I take very onerous precautions in maintaining my aquarium so that I don't catch disease myself or allow it to get out into the water supply. It is such a burden and so not worth the risk to me anymore that whenever my current population passes on, I will abandon the hobby. It's beyond the scope of this thread, but so much has changed since my childhood and a lot of it revolves around growing challenges in disease and parasite control due to overuse of medications to cover for bad hatchery practices and the decline of reliable suppliers for home aquarists.

ANY pet potentially can give you a disease or pass one into the environment. I read not long ago of negative impacts of dog wastes on local small bodies of water.

And the birds themselves are little incubators of disease and parasites and filth. Have you ever seen how nasty the area around a bird feeder looks? I caught West Nile Virus around the time several dead crows were found scattered around the street and on my property in my old neighborhood. I called the county for help in disposing of the bodies and their response was nothing. So much for my tax dollars at work to protect the environment and the citizenry. In my current neighborhood three wiley crows are infamous for pulling off unsecured trash can lids and scattering garbage all over the street.

But this is not about which pet or wild animal is better, safer, cleaner for humans. This is about humans taking any animal, in this case cats, and managing their care and stewardship so badly they cause a mass chain reaction of fail and then wanting to find a cheap easy way out that seems to draw all the people itching for an excuse to kill just because they can.

Maybe catch, neuter, release combined with humane euthanasia to cull the population to manageable numbers by approved authorities (not open participation for every John Q. Public cat hater) IS the most effective and efficient and humane way out of New Zealand's wildlife crisis. I hate to think it, but seeing pressures and parasite problems lessen after professionally managed white tailed deer culls in my area leave me openminded enough to consider the option.

We do currently pay a tax for our cats and dogs where I live. It is just called a licensing fee. At any rate I can't believe a member of ATS is advocating for more taxation. When the federal, state and local governments get through flaying us alive with taxes and fees and permit fees and licensing fees and inspection fees etc. etc. there really is barely anything left for giving back to the community in ways that are of our own choosing.

More taxation is rarely, if ever, a positive answer to any problem. It all gets misappropriated from its intended purpose and just goes to cronyism and corruption.

But I do agree anyone who owns ANY animal has a responsibility to their community and to their pet to manage their pet wisely and take responsibility like an adult should for their pet's actions and impacts. I'm not against laws and fines to enforce responsibility on those who refuse to acknowledge they have any.



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by Quadraphobe
reply to post by ForestForager
 


No the issue is humans thinking we have dominion over all other species. We do not and should not. Cats have a right to hunt and kill, it is in their nature and nothing we have any right to stop. If the cat is an outdoor cat and wants to go outside, you have no right to stop and and even less right to kill it. I tell ya one thing, if my cat came onto your land and you killed it, rather than chase him off, well, my cat wouldnt be the only animal dead. Thats for damn sure.

Until we all all start trying to find some harmony amongst us all, we will always been doomed as a species.

It is a sad day. More humans thinking they can go around killing whatever they want because it strayed onto your little plot of land. Typical human Me Me Me, I I I thinking. Selfish species. I'm ashamed to call myself human.

Quadraphobe, it's not a matter of exercising dominion over your cat, but good stewardship. If your cat trespasses and craps all over a neighbor's garden, passes along tapeworm or other parasites, that is poor stewardship of an animal you chose to bring into the community and should be taking responsibility for.

A humane neighbor should meet you halfway and chase off, not kill your cat. But I know darned well and good that some cats are persistent as hell. Your cat's right to roam ends where it causes a hazard to a neighbor or a significant nuisance.

Cats have been domesticated. There are interesting articles about the characteristics of a domesticated animal vs. wild or feral animal. It's okay to infringe a little on the nature of a domesticated animal and manage it so we all can live in harmony. If you feel strongly you are infringing on your cat, you need to think about moving to a more remote parcel of land where your cat won't have to worry about mankind's property lines and property concerns.

Think about it, would you like the dog owners to start asserting their big dog's right to roam unhindered by leashes or fences? Some fools actually do. My mother-in-law's cat sitting on its own porch was nearly killed by an off leash dog that following its natural instinct, ignored the man made property boundaries and ripped into the porch to get at the cat.

Think about what you stated in your own post. The me me me thing. You were right. But you need to recognize that includes you. It's not all about you and your perceived views on a domestic cat's right to roam. There are neighbor's feelings and needs to be considered, too. I hope I made my point respectfully. I'm a cat lover and I understands why you are angry at Forest Forager's comments. They hurt my heart, too. It's not necessary to kill those cats. Animal control can be called for guidance. Humane traps can be used, sprays...any number of alternatives to killing in cold blood as the first and only reaction.



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 05:24 PM
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reply to post by Raist
 


Most municipalities require dog owners to license their dogs.

This really amounts to a tax on dogs. I don't know if any municipalities tax cat owners in a similar way, but I haven't ever heard of one that does.



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 05:34 PM
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reply to post by Quadraphobe
 


I'm going to have to rethink my above post to you. Are you in the UK. I recently learned the views on cats and the laws reflecting those views are almost the opposite of the views and laws here in the USA. It may well be the case in the UK that cat owners very well can't, for various reasons, live with exclusively indoor cats. I don't know, I've never had the pleasure and privilege of visiting and seeing the life there myself. So many times one assumes things from a narrow world view.

Which makes me think the New Zealanders will be the ones to figure out their needs and think all the rest of us are daft yammering about kitchen counter tops, poop, and taxes. I've always been impressed by how the kiwis on ATS respond to a crisis. Their posts in the Christchurch quakes thread revealed they are can-do no nonsense people who get on with things quite well.



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 06:01 PM
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reply to post by butcherguy
 


Yes it is sort of a worthless tax as well.

I am not going to get started on worthless taxes such as that though.

Raist



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 06:12 PM
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And then you should see what those darn cats do to the billions of poultry through the factory farms.

OOPS, it's 'humans', which do that.

edit on 5-2-2013 by Eedjee because: x



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 06:31 PM
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reply to post by Eedjee
 


Same for me. My cat is my daughter and I love her very, very much.

And It angers me that people say cats should be killed for hunting birds and squirrels.

Hunting birds and squirrels keeps the populations of those species to a normal level, though there still are too many cats in the world and I think it would be better to neuter/spay them, but anyone who wants to kill them is just crazy.
edit on 5-2-2013 by extraterrestrialentity because: Too short of a reply



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 06:45 PM
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reply to post by Raist
 


Yes, growing up on a farm, I always thought it was silly that we had to buy a license for the dog, but the 1200 lb steers, 400 lb hogs and dozens of cats didn't require the same.



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 06:51 PM
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reply to post by Raist
 


The main reason I think cats should be taxed is to reduce the numbers... Hope you and your cat are happy non the less..



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 07:00 PM
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I blame cats for climate change, World War 2, and the invention of spandex.

Down with all cats !





[insert slap forehead here]











... the stupid.... it burns



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 07:09 PM
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Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by Raist
 


Yes, growing up on a farm, I always thought it was silly that we had to buy a license for the dog, but the 1200 lb steers, 400 lb hogs and dozens of cats didn't require the same.



so you did have cats !!! Did you appreciate that they kept the rat population down ?
Were you taxed for them and did you keep them indoors only ???????????





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