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The First Shots of the Second American Revolution have been fired

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posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:17 AM
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reply to post by DaTroof
 



I like your idea about the small business. However, many small businesses still need the goods produced by mega-corporations to stock their shelves. One simply can't exist without the other unless we return to a pre-Industrial world where we all knit our own sweaters.


The free market solves these problems. We got by just fine before Washington became the 6,000 lb bull in the China shop.




Part of me wants a simpler life, but it's just not feasible for millions and millions of people to ALL be self-sufficient. Same applies to government. The small, local governments can thrive or fail, but they will have to adapt to federal laws in order to even stay in power. (business)


It doesn’t have to be a simpler life and there would be no federal law after secession…only state law.

The only thing Texas would need from the other states is a mutual defense agreement. Aside from that we could function just fine…actually better IMO!




posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:22 AM
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Originally posted by seabag

The only thing Texas would need from the other states is a mutual defense agreement. Aside from that we could function just fine…actually better IMO!

So, is this the Real Agenda of Seabag?
The whole "Im a Patriot" thing you push, just a pretense.
What about your Brothers in the other 49 States?
Every man for Himself?



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:22 AM
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reply to post by seabag
 


Interesting analogy, the bull in the China shop. That brings another discussion into the mix, which is the degradation of American goods and exports. Had our great country decided quality was more important than profit, many states wouldn't be in the financial dregs they're currently in, begging the federal government for assistance.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:23 AM
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The larger government gets the larger its failures are. The Federal side of government isn't efficient...in terms of actually providing for people is does more harm than good.

The smaller more local the government the smaller the failures. The government on smaller/local levels is not only more voluntary it is more "in-touch" with its constituents and is there for more supportive of their lives not to mention that the "representatives" are directly effected by the laws/bills they are passing...The federal government is completely out of touch and lives lives outside and unaffected by the people they govern...



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:31 AM
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reply to post by Tw0Sides
 



So, is this the Real Agenda of Seabag?
The whole "Im a Patriot" thing you push, just a pretense.
What about your Brothers in the other 49 States?
Every man for Himself?


We are a nation of states. I’m all about the will of the people and adherence to the principles set forth in the constitution…it doesn’t get more patriotic than that.

I care about people. I want everyone to succeed. However, just like employees of a company (yes, another business reference), sometimes you have to let people go if they aren’t on board and committed. I can’t tell you how many people I’ve heard on this site say that the constitution means nothing. Our own POTUS despises the constitution! I don’t think it’s patriotic (or even reasonable) to remain part of a union when the rules that the STATES ADOPTED AND AGREED TO are being cast aside by a dictatorial regime (Rep or Dem).



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:34 AM
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reply to post by DaTroof
 



Interesting analogy, the bull in the China shop. That brings another discussion into the mix, which is the degradation of American goods and exports. Had our great country decided quality was more important than profit, many states wouldn't be in the financial dregs they're currently in, begging the federal government for assistance.


So why remain part of the union??

When you don’t like what a state does (income tax, healthcare, laws, etc) you can pack up and move. When the fed does it you have no recourse. This is the situation we find ourselves in.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:35 AM
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reply to post by seabag
 


Those states will have fun paying back their share of taxes and debt to the Feds if they break away.

Not. Going. To. Happen. (but you can keep dreaming)

I swear you must work at an infusion center, trying to stir up people for easier watch list targeting.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:41 AM
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reply to post by seabag
 


For those thinking we can vote our way out of this mess, the Patriot Act and a whole lot more have passed constitutional muster with the Supreme Court over the years and its beginning to pile up.

They can't be voted out.

So yes, the states and the people will have to step up to the tenth amendment bat (as well as the other nine).



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:42 AM
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reply to post by MystikMushroom
 



Those states will have fun paying back their share of taxes and debt to the Feds if they break away.

That’s silly. The Federal Government is a union of states. When the states leave the union there is no federal government. Who would be there to collect?




Not. Going. To. Happen. (but you can keep dreaming)

If it doesn’t then I’ll continue to live in the nightmare we currently occupy.




I swear you must work at an infusion center, trying to stir up people for easier watch list targeting.

Is that a polite way of calling me a disinfo agent?


I work for no one. I’m simply discussing issues on ATS much like you and every other member does daily. I don’t like the status quo so I’m discussing options.


If you don't like what I say then debate me or move along....I don't care either way!



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:46 AM
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Originally posted by MystikMushroom
Those states will have fun paying back their share of taxes and debt to the Feds if they break away.



I think 'breaking away from' would preclude a cessation of Federal debt. For example, I'm pretty sure South Carolina didn't pay Uncle Sam a red cent in 1861. Think of all the money they would save not having to buy ten thousand dollar federally contracted toliet seats or funeral expenses for Tim Osman er Bin Laden.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:50 AM
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reply to post by seabag
 



I'm on board with you on that one. Many of our trade policies, taxes, tariffs, embargoes and other sanctions are "grandfathered in", leaving us and future generations political prisoners.

I'd like to see more American made products and services. Our economy, and our freedom depends on how willing we as a people are to sacrifice cheap foreign goods.

The more prosperous the State, the less needed from the Federal government.


+6 more 
posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 11:59 AM
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Originally posted by DaTroof
Those talking about revolution... well, you're on the list. Maybe I put you there.


I am comfortable being on the list -

Retired Combat Veteran - Check
Loves Liberty - Check
Owns multiple firearms - Check
Distrusts the Federal Government - Check
FFL - Check
FEL - Check
CCW - Check
Conspiracy Theorist - Check
Resents Excessive Taxation - Check
"Prepped" - Check
Advocates the Secession of his State from the Union - Check

If you are one of the ones making lists I don't fear you - you are forgetting you made me.

Airborne, Ranger, Special Forces, MFF, Sniper, SERE, 11B, 97B, 18C, 35E, 18A (too many special identifiers to list)

Combat tours in Panama, Kuwait, Iraq, Somalia, and multiple trips to Afghanistan. Also, a lot of covert and clandestine operations unmentionable around the world.

I don't have a list but I will be making notches in my mantle for every "agent" who dies in the attempt to illegally sieze anything from my property. Its an 8 foot mantle I got lots of space...

if you want to take your chances come get some...

If I may be so bold recommend a Platoon (+) sized force. At least one APC will be needed for casualty evacuation IMO. You will also need some EOD techs for sure.

P.S. Don't forget the body bags - you will need several.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:10 PM
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Originally posted by Screwed
reply to post by seabag
 


Not even two full pages deep and already the ignorance is astounding.
I still can't figure out if some of you people are serious or if you are just effing with us.
How anyone can read the OP and come away with the idea that the OP is bashing Obama is beyond me and forces me to believe that


Hmmmm....what could ever give us that idea....

Could be this part of the OP


In early 1835, Mexican president Santa Anna began centralizing power and operating as a dictator, much like Obama.



Silly us, thinking he is bashing Obama because we read where he says Obama is a dictator.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:18 PM
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reply to post by seabag
 



I’m past blaming one man or one party. There are idiots ALL OVER this country from every political persuasion.


And now you are putting your faith in State politicians...oh...not just any State politician....REPUBLICAN State politician.

But keep telling yourself that you aren't partisan. The only problem is that the National Republican politicians have seen that the demographics of this nation have changed, and they have to change along with them.

Instead of you recognizing this and evolving with society...you regress back into your hole and continue to look for people who think just like you. You are now at the State level, because they are pretending to be the tough guys to attract people just like you who are looking for their "hero". When they fail, and they will...you will continue to regress down further and further...or hopefully you will see that you need to evolve along with the rest of society.


I’m looking at the problems from a business perspective. Smaller businesses are always more efficient and effective. The states and state economies are like small businesses; some work and some don’t.


Oh yeah....that is why Walmart is doing so poorly.

And hate to burst your bubble...but the States that are throwing temper tantrums right now are the ones that depend the most on the Federal Government...the ones that take more than they pay out.

You would think that your "principles" wouldn't like that...but I guess you have some blind spots.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:21 PM
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you realize the flaw in this idea...

people would have to look up from their phones to revolt

good luck with that



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:24 PM
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Just say NO
Sorry for the misused cliche by Nancy Reagan but it works.
In politics as well as personal relations.
Keeping shooting off your mouths because it does matter.
Especially when it's government representatives that have to hear it.



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by syrinx high priest
you realize the flaw in this idea...

people would have to look up from their phones to revolt

good luck with that


OMG I needed that laugh!


Thank you sooooooo much!



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:28 PM
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So these shots were a metaphor..

And not actually real? And haven't even been proven to be real metaphors yet, since those people say no but haven't been forced to do anything yet..



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:29 PM
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reply to post by xedocodex
 



And now you are putting your faith in State politicians...oh...not just any State politician....REPUBLICAN State politician.


The smaller the organization the easier it is to control.



But keep telling yourself that you aren't partisan. The only problem is that the National Republican politicians have seen that the demographics of this nation have changed, and they have to change along with them.

I am partisan…I said this OP isn’t about party politics.



Instead of you recognizing this and evolving with society...you regress back into your hole and continue to look for people who think just like you. You are now at the State level, because they are pretending to be the tough guys to attract people just like you who are looking for their "hero". When they fail, and they will...you will continue to regress down further and further...or hopefully you will see that you need to evolve along with the rest of society.

What do I need to “evolve” in to? To be more like you? No thanks!


How can you criticize me for wanting to be surrounded by people who think like I do and in the same sentence tell me I need to conform to the way you want me to be? Hypocritical?


Oh yeah....that is why Walmart is doing so poorly.

I didn’t say large businesses can’t be successful. I said smaller businesses are more efficient and effective. Small businesses connect better and are more accountable to employees and customers; that’s true.




And hate to burst your bubble...but the States that are throwing temper tantrums right now are the ones that depend the most on the Federal Government...the ones that take more than they pay out.

You would think that your "principles" wouldn't like that...but I guess you have some blind spots.


Texas is most dependent on government??


Prove it!



posted on Jan, 31 2013 @ 12:30 PM
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I love it when Ronald Reagan gets pulled into modern day political discussions. The Ronald Reagan, that while I think was a great President, would be crucified by today's GOP, especially the tea Party minority. When Reagan was President, the Republican Party actually made sense. Now they are slowly becoming a joke as they war with each other in a battle of RINO b.s.





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