25,000 Year Old Buildings Found In Russia? The Mysterious Dolmens And Megaliths Of The Caucasus

Originally posted by bottleslingguy
reply to post by skalla

 

do you have one as an example? how do you come up with 8,000 max?

i did not, archaeologists did and published it in work that was reviewed for veracity by their peers, if you have any basis at all for not believing that, and would like to suggest another date with some evidence and comparable sites, then go ahead.

seriously, try reading the thread and doing just a tiny bit of examination of the info yourself....

i'll give you a clue, which i have already pointed others to in this thread.

on page one of this thread, punkinworks10's post., which is the last but one on that page. read it, and then follow the link. read that page, expand the text and check the references. then think/process the info!.. you could have done this with the original article from the op, like i highlighted in my first post on this thread, and you would have found that the 25k yr BP date is utterly spurious. but i have been into this already. it's all about reading the thread, see?

i would replicate the link but then you wouldnt read the post as you clearly have not bothered so far.

i'm not going to hold your hand and give you tea and biscuits. stop being lazy

Originally posted by Ophiuchus 13

Originally posted by skalla
reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

 

food storage: the decomposing meat would produce gradually more heat, thus excellerating the process, and while they may be safe from bears.... worms, rodents, insects, and possibly cat/dog sized creatures would have a field day.

After checking out some post in the thread a little further yes you may be correct that at some time these were used as others have stated for locks of some kind to hold spiritual energies +/- or to send data through the Spiritual/time data loops with spirits that would be willing to sit there.

Thing is these are good reasons for these builds and 1 is not denying, but 1 has to ask. If they could build areas for spirits then why they not build their homes in the same structural strength designs?

Originally posted by skalla

hunter/gatherer societies tend to take what they can carry, which would last a long time anyway - observing the behaviour of modern/recent stone age societies back this up. also it is far more efficient to store your meat by hanging it in the roof of your thatched hut/roundhouse, where the smoke from the fire collect before filtering through the thatch, this process will dry and cure/smoke it thereby ensuring it lasts, keeping flies away due to the smoke, and allowing easy access and monitoring of how much you use.

Those EXTRAS (insects/animals) attracted to the site as 1 would call them would be in fact be that extras those (insects/animals) that would try to collect in or near storage units if used AFTER original designed use..

As you state placing food on the roof of your home to smoke

how would you live /sleep in such a burnt roof home especially if smoking like you say the foods on the regular??? Not to mention Large-predator attraction.

Again these may be used originally as best data says they were, but still there could of been other uses as well as further down the time line reuses in different ways continued...

Originally posted by skalla
protection: why trap your self somewhere? as already pointed out fires would smoke you out, or bake you out, and a patient enemy would just out wait you or dig you out (in about 3 hours)

1 feels this depends on the fauna of interest.

Originally posted by skalla
other reasons except a grave: anyone care to consider that we have evidence they were graves? such structures have been broken open world wide, both in the past (well documented) and in very recent and current excavations! human remains, grave goods etc... why the dislike of evidence that amounts to proof?

seriously folks, read the thread, read the links, follow the info - it's archaeology, not brain surgery.

Valid point

,and was not sure if remains were found inside these images shown or others like elsewhere.

NAMASTE*******

edit on 1/29/13 by Ophiuchus 13 because: (no reason given)

these structures actually do not have design strengths as homes. i have built, lived and worked in different types of roundhouses and huts (etc) in woodlands through different times of year (i have also extensively studied archaeology and prehistory as well as practicing ancient crafts) and you really would not want to live in these. firstly you have no option of a second way out in emergency - in a wattle&daub/hurdle constructed dwelling you could just kick and bash your way out if you needed too or exit via the roof. in an emergency you would be trapped and powerless in these.
have you seen the size of the holes? nuff said on door theory
ever built a fire in a small room, or a teepee like structure that is not like 3 metres tall? i actually have, and the smoke will totally fill the place, and i do mean totally. when replicating roundhouse dwellings the roof needs to be about 3 metres high to prevent this, and this allows the smoke to collect like a layer of cloud at the top and filter through the thatch, therefor not bothering those inside. and dont suggest a chimney hole, it's been tried and then the heat from the hearth is natuarally funnelled to the edges of the hole and the thatch catches fire. bye bye home and posessions.
as for storing food there, my statements immediately above on how the smoke collects answers that one, the roof is not burnt - imagine a layer of smoke that starts about 50cm above your head when you stand, and carries on to the top of the roof. hire a tee-pee for a camping holiday, light the fire and see for yourself. large predators would not be attracted to the drying meat as you live in a settlement, and its way easier for a bear to fish for example, than it is for it to fight a village - it's just counterintuitive and the woods were full of food

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


Originally posted by skalla
protection: why trap your self somewhere? as already pointed out fires would smoke you out, or bake you out, and a patient enemy would just out wait you or dig you out (in about 3 hours)


1 feels this depends on the fauna of interest.

i am talking human behavior. re fauna, why take soooo long to build this for protection when as stated earlier, ditches, pallisade walls, fire, pointy sticks, guards, etc achieve the same result far more effectively with less effort.

please never go outside and venture into the wilderness with out a guide. i would fear for your safety..

i'm kinda joking, but i am exasperated by the questions in this thread. if more people read books, followed their thoughts through, and went outside, even just camping without all mod cons.... help me please god

excuse me, please, but i feel i need to write a book and then force people to read it, clockwork orange style

Originally posted by Gorman91
How do you document this? Where is the organic or sedimentary things they carbon dated?

This seems highly fraudulent.

read the articles and comments in this thread and then come back

reply to post by skalla


skalla, you present a reasonable argument for the data observed.

@ times 1 tends to consider the non time accuracy and potential non finds that may be associated with these types of sites and so 1 tends to try and fill in the blanks as best as 1 can from the data I also am viewing from my subjective perspective.

The hope is that in time as more arguments are presented in respectful manners, the FACTS shine through and maybe some missing finds will be located to better describe the times and activities associated with the ancient sites of EA*RTH.

NAMASTE*******

Originally posted by skalla


please never go outside and venture into the wilderness with out a guide. i would fear for your safety..

on my honor I will do my best....... I have been exposed since youth my friend but if sincere 1 appreciates, but don't fear.

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


sorry, but i have presented much of this info earlier in the thread, and feel like i have been banging my head on a brick wall with many people just not reading the thread, and taking information from the op as truth with no examination or critical thinking whatsoever. apologies if my tone came over as overly critical, no genuine offense was intended.

reply to post by skalla


1 knows its never an easy task to LIGHT the way skalla

If it were 26,000 years old it might make a good bunker to hide from whatever the galaxy passing through the 'dark rift' every 26,000 years might through at us.

Originally posted by skalla

Originally posted by Gorman91
How do you document this? Where is the organic or sedimentary things they carbon dated?

This seems highly fraudulent.

read the articles and comments in this thread and then come back

read articles and comments which I posted then you come back.

Originally posted by Angelic Resurrection
Interesting find op
25000 years is not believable

everything is believable........to ignorant mind.

Originally posted by cowgomoo

Originally posted by skalla

Originally posted by Gorman91
How do you document this? Where is the organic or sedimentary things they carbon dated?

This seems highly fraudulent.

read the articles and comments in this thread and then come back

read articles and comments which I posted then you come back.

if you are talking to me, i actually did read your links - which should be clear if you read my posts... i appreciate that english is probably not your mother-tongue, so if there is anything in my posts that you find unclear, i'm happy to discuss it with you.

Originally posted by skalla
i actually did read your links

read it again.

Originally posted by cowgomoo

Originally posted by skalla
i actually did read your links

read it again.

first of all a forum (hobbits of the caucusses) is proof of nothing, and the circassian history article is very interesting, i enjoyed reading it, though it contains only a little info on the time period and monuments that we are discussing...

therefor you must think i am missing out on a vital piece of information, i suggest you copy that information and paste it to a post..... but just saying:
"read it again"
will not do anymore, i have politely replied to your posts, and so far you have been unable to do the same back.... time to put up or shut up.

Originally posted by skalla

Originally posted by cowgomoo

Originally posted by skalla
i actually did read your links

read it again.

first of all a forum (hobbits of the caucusses) is proof of nothing, and the circassian history article is very interesting, i enjoyed reading it, though it contains only a little info on the time period and monuments that we are discussing...

therefor you must think i am missing out on a vital piece of information, i suggest you copy that information and paste it to a post..... but just saying:
"read it again"
will not do anymore, i have politely replied to your posts, and so far you have been unable to do the same back.... time to put up or shut up.

edit on 30-1-2013 by skalla because: typo

edit on 30-1-2013 by skalla because: clarity etc

Gorman91 asked valid question.
Yes you do missing vital piece of information. That is that all sites are near todays coast line of Black sea.

Peace!

reply to post by cowgomoo


i did read that, how does that apply to anything i have posted?

ETA: my point to the poster you mention, is that all the info he required is in the various posts and links (along with their references) provided by all parties. did you miss the bit where i questioned the 25k BP dating?

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by smurfy
Amazingly I was looking at these Russian dolmens a few nights ago because of another thread here about Tiksi, in Northern Russia, and an odd looking dome there, which I think is a pingo, an earth uplift, and not a salt mine.
Some of the texts I found by the way on the dolmens seemed to infer that they were an Indian influence. Maybe any Indian scholars could throw some light on it.

I'm not a scholar, but here's what I have to say - Indo-European cultures carry a heavy dose of cultural heritage from India proper, from thousands of years ago. In particular, Slavic languages (Russian included) have a few words that have been preserved remarkably well from the days of Sanskrit. The Sanskrit word for "the nape of the neck" used to describe a peculiar shape of silver ingots produced in what is now Russia, in the first millenium CE. Nowadays, it's still there, it's the name of the official unit of Ukrainian currency. A similar Russian word is used as a reference to the lion's mane, which is again the back of the neck. And Russian word "Bohg" (God) is cognate of the old Indian "Bhagvan", like in "Bhagavad Gita".

So that connection does not surprise me at all.

Thanks for that, much better and informative than the other trashy reply I had. What info I had was secondary to what I was looking for at the time, but it is just as interesting a subject. I'm not familiar with Ukraine's currency, so do you mean Hryvnia?

Originally posted by bigdohbeatdown
EDIT:


Sonic sounds plausible.. so do aliens.. or giants..
Admittedly so does a whole bunch of dudes with ropes, and hammers..

edit on 28-1-2013 by bigdohbeatdown because: (no reason given)

To me the question is: why work with stones that big?

How did they lift them and, more importantly - why?

Any dwelling or security type of container could have been built with easier to manage, smaller stones, or with wood. Why work with bigass stones that take a hundred men to lift (or even ten).

You choose a building material based on many factors, and one of the factors is the tools you have available to work with. In fact, the tools most often define what is possible and therefore what the builder wants to accomplish. For example, I do not know how to weld, so I never consider building anything that requires welding.

So, ipso facto, these people could lift bigass stones and make relatively intricate carving in them.

Imagine the conversation:

Bleph: "Hoy Zorg. Let's build a hut from those giant rocks over there."
Zorg: "Qua? How we lifts them?" (obviously, their native language is LOLcat).
Bleph: "Don't be a pussy. We'll figure something out. We'll use rope and block-and-tackle."
Zorg: "Block and what?"
Bleph: "Tackle. It means a pulley, a wheel on an axle suspended by a rope/hook. It is a mechanical device that increases our leverage."
Zorg: "Oh. What is 'rope'?"
Bleph: facepalm


Sorry. It doesn't compute. Someone find me a 26000 year old metal axle that would work on a block and tackle setup capable of holding that much weight (and some rope. did they have rope 26000 years ago?)

And my questions assume "standard" historical tools and not any "lost technology" (which is, by the way, the thing I think was used for all the megalithic construction around the world. Slaves simply did not construct Puma Punku and Cheops. No freaking way.

Google "Tablets of Shamash" and you will see an obvious "giant" working a machine for the benefit of the regular-sized humans (dressed as priests, which ancient "engineers" probably would have been since they worked with ancient alien technology that appeared to them to be mystical/magical and therefore within the priestly realm).

No farther fetched than hammer and chisel and block-and-tackle, IMO.

It's all speculation and, like the guy said in "Life of Pi", "which story do you prefer?"

Originally posted by Byrd

Originally posted by ImpactoR
Excellent find, So by how many years is the human civilization pushed back as opposed to what textbooks were saying several years ago?

None. They're around 3,000 years old. Human civilization right now is dated to around 8,000 years old (meaning: lived in large permanent villages/towns.)

What did it say, the first neanderthals and such were 10,000 years ago around and after the last Ice Age,

Check Wikipedia: (Neanderthals) Our history and science books say that Neanderthals emerged over 300,000 years ago and died off about 33,000 years ago.

how sad, if mainstream science doesn't admit they can be wrong even about things already discovered

I think your references may be older ones. Check Wikipedia for the most recent thought (science and history.)

You can push the age back a bit, Spanish dolmens, and those in Guernsey are thought to be dated back to 4000 BC.
Their use is not so clear, regardless of the accepted idea of burial tombs, it's not always the case that remains are found there. In Russia there are the Kurgans, which are burial mounds, as well as the well made dolmens.

www.ancient-wisdom.co.uk...

From that link,

"It is often assumed that dolmens were constructed for a funerary purpose. However, the lack of human remains in several prominent dolmens, combined with certain construction features suggests that this can no longer be considered a definitive theory."

Originally posted by smurfy

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by smurfy
Amazingly I was looking at these Russian dolmens a few nights ago because of another thread here about Tiksi, in Northern Russia, and an odd looking dome there, which I think is a pingo, an earth uplift, and not a salt mine.
Some of the texts I found by the way on the dolmens seemed to infer that they were an Indian influence. Maybe any Indian scholars could throw some light on it.

I'm not a scholar, but here's what I have to say - Indo-European cultures carry a heavy dose of cultural heritage from India proper, from thousands of years ago. In particular, Slavic languages (Russian included) have a few words that have been preserved remarkably well from the days of Sanskrit. The Sanskrit word for "the nape of the neck" used to describe a peculiar shape of silver ingots produced in what is now Russia, in the first millenium CE. Nowadays, it's still there, it's the name of the official unit of Ukrainian currency. A similar Russian word is used as a reference to the lion's mane, which is again the back of the neck. And Russian word "Bohg" (God) is cognate of the old Indian "Bhagvan", like in "Bhagavad Gita".

So that connection does not surprise me at all.

Thanks for that, much better and informative than the other trashy reply I had. What info I had was secondary to what I was looking for at the time, but it is just as interesting a subject. I'm not familiar with Ukraine's currency, so do you mean Hryvnia?

Yes, it's "Hryvna", the Sanskrit name for the "nape" is "Hryva", the Russian word of a similar meaning is "Gryva".