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What you need (items) & What you need to learn (for a full collapse)

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posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 11:53 PM
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I lived in the woods for 3 months in the middle of winter. I did not live in a tent or cabin or any proper shelter. I made fire with wood & string (busting) & ate dehydrated foods. This content has probably been done before, but as someone who lived in the middle of the woods without contact with the outside world, without a lighter, etc I think that I may be able to help you out even more.

If you have any additions or questions, just ask/post.

Foods you'll need
High protein foods (dehydrated)
Dehydrated foods (beans, rice, noodles, chicken/tuna packets/cans & dehydrated meat etc)
Fruit & vegetable (this will run out fast, but your first week or so will be nice)
Nuts / "GORP"


For water, carry around a large jug that can be strapped to your back, or chest.
Make sure you carry water purification tablets, and a water purification device (bring 3 or so)
If you run out of tablets & devices you'll need to find drinkable water. The best place to find this is high up on a mountain. The higher you go, the safer it will be. If you ever see a dead animal in the water, move farther up the river. Always check for dead animals.

Items
Regular lighter x 10 (having tons of lighters will bring you fire, or give others the chance of fire)
Zippo lighter x 5
Lighter fluid x 5
Flammable material (this is easily found in wooded areas, but is always good to start off with too)
Large backpack (should hold sleeping bag, food, all materials & tarps strapped as well)
Large tarp (to go over fire/place of residence)
Small tarp (to sleep under)
Extra rope/string (for tarps & other things)
Sleeping bag
Sleeping mat (not heavily padded)
Small bag (to hold foods in. This bag goes in your pack)
25 to 50 foot rope (to hang food bag from trees to avoid animals)
Carving knife (to make tools, especially for making fire)
Compass
Generic map (have all states, landmarks, etc with precise measurement tools on it)
Boots
Snow covers for boots
Many pairs of socks
Few sets of clothes
Secure & fully water resistant bags (for clothing)
One pot, strap this on pack
First aid kit
Axe (wood can be found & broken without one in non-snowy areas, but an axe is good to have)
Small saw
Multi-purpose knife
Hunting / fighting knife

What you should research
First Aid, CPR, Wilderness First Aid
How to make a fire with sticks (busting, which uses a stick (spindle), block of wood, bow)
How to make a fire (using caveman tactics of just one stick and a block of wood)
Building a "nest" to turn an ember into a fire
Navigation via stars
The area you are most likely to go to in a full collapse + 3 other options
Archery (for defense & food)
Trap setting (food)
Net fishing
Information about animals in the area + those in your 3 other options
Information about plants, poisons, weather conditions, etc
How to set up "bear bags" (hanging food bags from trees)

*For fire making, you should practice this and have it 100% mastered BEFORE you need to use it in an actual situation.




posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 12:08 AM
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What in the world will I need 5 zippos for?



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 12:25 AM
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sweet post
i would add a chinese military shovel to such list



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 12:35 AM
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Originally posted by zonetripper2065
What in the world will I need 5 zippos for?

for all the cigarettes youll be smoking on account of the rugged manliness inherent in those living in the woods.
also, flannel jumberjack shirt.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 12:39 AM
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reply to post by dashen
 


I've been using the same zippo for years



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 12:44 AM
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reply to post by Ghostx
 


I agree with the lighters, we need to ensure we can constantly make a fire for months or years on end. But I would add a flint fire stick or 2, the military ones are good for over 25,000 starts and weigh nothing.

Lighters are also excellent for trade.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 01:07 AM
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I'm dubious. I'm sorry if I'm wrong but I spend a substantial amount of time in the wilderness and this doesn't seem like the kind of list that any woodsman I've known about, including myself has ever come up with. It just seems to lack wisdom and practical application expected from someone who knows their way in the wilderness. However, OP, carry on and we'll see how this develops. Perhaps you could explain why you have chosen some of the less likely items over more traditional supplies and share some related experiences of which after 3 months their should be plenty.

I have some questions too.

Why dozens of fire starting tools of which none are critical if you know how to use a fire drill but only one pair of boots? I'm lucky if I get a few weeks out of my boots. And I can't imaging having to wear my winter boots in the summer and vise-versa.

Why is firewood not available in snowy areas?

How do you intend to carry a bunch of canned food in your pack when you already have dozens of pounds of other gear?

Why only one each of application specific knives when it is by far your most important tool?

Why a carving knife and a hunting knife when pretty much every wilderness living/survival expert in the world suggests a bushcraft knife such as the popular Mora of which every woodsman I know seems to have several?





edit on 28-1-2013 by dainoyfb because: I typo'd.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 01:18 AM
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Also, OP I'm quite surprised that in your list of suggested research topics you don't mention learning about the many uses of wedges, which are arguably the woodsman's most important improvised tool.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 01:28 AM
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i have about a dozen cheapy bic lighters in my sac.
but just make sure to wrap them individually up in saran plastic wrap.
it can help water proof them, but its mostly to prevent them from fuming out over time.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 01:38 AM
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reply to post by dainoyfb
 


I agree lots of these things mentioned do not make sense.. I would only need 1 firestarter if any at all but I would just take my knife with firestarter in the sheath.

I would also take:

a multi-hatchet (hatchet on one side, other side is hammer with nail puller)
Knife sharpener (in fact my knife has knife sharpener build into sheath)
Military mess kit and canteen

I would never go long term into the woods somewhere that is snows so I wouldn't have to worry as much about allot of things, I would carry a small light one person tent.

I would bring a slingshot also (not the cheap one a good one)
Wire for trapping
stainless pot that I would put into my bag then put things into it as to save room, good for boiling water or making food.

I would probably bring like a 5pk of those cheap throw away lighters just to make things easier then using my firestarter, but when they run out I would have my fire starter. Not to much bartering going on in the middle of the woods that I know of so I doubt I would need them for that.

I would also more then likely bring a recurve bow and several bow strings, several arrows that would be the lightest easiest weapon to take down big game rather then using your slingshot for everything (you arent bringing down a deer with a slingshot more then likely)

I would also have a backup knife in my pack.

I would bring a nice warm jacket for when its cold (it gets cold in texas sometimes) probably a bunch of wife beater shirts they would be light and last a while and likely I wouldn't wear a shirt often unless it was cold

Oh and duct tape, lots of duct tape lmao

IDK what else I would bring I would have to think harder about it. I am not sure I agree much with the original list. It really would depend on where I am going, for what reason I am going, climate, weight, ect.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 02:04 AM
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reply to post by Ghostx
 


I have to disagree with some of the items on your list. If you are sheltering in place then you can dispense with most of the wilderness gear. If you are fleeing, then you will not flee far carrying all that junk. Every unnecessary item you carry is a handful of wasted calories and water wasted to sweat.

Here is my revised list:

Regular bic lighters: small, light, cheap, and a hell of a lot easier for firestarting than the caveman methods (which you should also definitely know.) Why not fill up all the spare nooks in your pack with them, couldn't hurt.

Zippo lighters: Between the lighters themselves and all the fluid, No. Just no. Too much bulk, too much weight. I would recommend this instead: go to home depot and get yourself a butane powered soldering iron. Get one that has a built-in ignition switch. They are small, have an open flame, are windproof (unlike zippos) and guaranteed to burn really hot (which zippos don't). Also, it is really hard to light fire with a zippo because if you turn it sideways, it goes out. These soldering irons, I have seen at home depot recently for like, $8, whereas a single zippo will run you $20 easily. Anyone who disagrees with me, let's you and I have a fire lighting contest.


Flammable Material: Yes, absolutely necessary. Difficult to find any dry in the woods though. Difficult to find anywhere when you need it.

Which is why you should always make sure to dress in layers, of dry, warm, waterproof, durable clothing. I wear leather biker boots (not for hiking, just everyday) because they are very durable, and unlike boots with laces, my feet never feet never get wet no matter how deep or slushy the snow is. That is important, take great care of your feet. You march on your feet and your stomach. Double up on socks to prevent blistering. Good footwear. Get leather. My dad had the same pair of hiking boots for thirty years before they finally wore out, you know why? They were made out of thick, tough, real leather, had quality stitching and tough soles. Don't mess around when choosing your footwear. And take the time to break them in before you need them. Or just switch to more durable footwear for everyday, stop buying a new pair every month of the seemingly disposable-quality shoes that are being made nowadays. Lots of good-quality wool socks. And, and don't skip this one, foot powder.

Backpack: Make sure the straps are comfortable. Get one which fastens around your waist, to help distribute the weight of the pack more evenly across your whole back. Get one which fastens around the upper chest too, helps keep it from chafing, or from slipping and sliding around when you are running. Also, the extra strap across the chest is real handy to attach other equipment to (compass, knife, lighter, etc.)

Water: Always have a full canteen on your hip, and extra water in your bag. You don't want all your water in your bag in case you have to ditch it, or a bear snatches it, or it falls off the side of the boat. Your canteen should be metal, so you can put it over the fire to boil the contents.

Tarp: One tarp is enough. Get one which is lightweight, but not flimsy, and not so large that it takes up all of your space. Think keeping the rain off. If you want more than one tarp, or big tarps, then you might as well just carry a tent.

Sleeping bag: I will bring one, if you will carry it.
If there is severe cold, then yes bring the warmest bag you can get ahold of. Be careful though not to bog yourself down.

Sleeping mat: No. Luxury item. Tough it out.

Rope: Substitute paracord. Lighter, still sufficiently strong, and takes up less space which means you can bring more.

Carving knife: No.
Survival-type knife: Yes. Bring a decent-size fixed blade knife. Make sure it is not of the smooth-handled variety like Buck knives or knives that have a carved-wood handle. Your knife has to have very good traction on the handle, because sooner or later you are going to have to use it wet.

Hand warmers: Have a few chemical-type hand warmers. Be sure to store them waterproof, ziplock bags work. Keep your extremities warm on long hikes when you can't afford to stop. Every little bit of heat helps when the cold is a threat to life and limb.

Compass: don't go cheap. Get a decent compass. If you are planning on fleeing somewhere specific, make sure you know that area very well, and also get a map so you know the area surrounding that area as well. Be sure to mark down on the map: hospitals, clinics, police stations, fire stations, ranger stations, prisons, bases, etc. Anywhere you want to be able to get to (or stay away from) in an emergency.

Rather than a pot, just bring a mess kit. Old-time military style. Smaller profile, more options.

First-aid kit: Absolutely. Do include iodine (can be used to sanitize or be taken to prevent radiation damage to the tyroid). Cont...



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 02:18 AM
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Antibiotics--These can be tough to get ahold of from a doctor. But you can go to a pet store and get fish antibiotics. Better that than nothing. Superglue, or as I call them Ho Chi Minh Stitches. Fishing line (super-fine), curved needles, needlenose pliers to use as sutures, if you can't lay aside a set of the real thing. Sterile gloves. Scalpel (or x-acto knife). Painkillers of course. No-doze if you are on the run. Rubbing alcohol in a mister bottle. Clean bandages and clean rags (for preliminary cleaning of wounds, i.e. wiping the blood off your forehead). Learn how to suture a wound and how to splint a bone.

Woodcutting: An axe is good to have any time you go into the wilderness. But at the very least you should have a lightweight folding saw in your pack. Both is better. Try out your saw before you pack it away, if it is flimsy or breaks when you are trying to cut wood, take it back for a better one. A folding camp shovel is good too, but not something I would run back into a burning building to get rather than leave without.

Trapping, archery, fishing, all good skills to have. Save as much of your non-perishable food as you can, I mean really ration, and try to pick up whatever wild foods you can find on your way. Trot lines are illegal for amateur fishing, but in a survival situation an overnight trot line can save your life, for sure. Traps and snares, keep it simple until you've found where you are going to settle down. Those things take time and energy to make work. Spears are good for defense, but unwieldy. Take a spearhead with you, why not?

Smaller spears for fishing, if you have the time and patience.

Navigation by stars is essential.

And if you have got the extra strength and stamina to bring a firearm, why not.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 02:34 AM
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What you need, is to stop living for yourself. When this collapse takes place, it is essential that we work together.

If you really want to be a helping hand, and if you really want to survive. Then do this.

Go and buy seeds, any kind of fruits and vegetables, and go and plant those seeds in any park, side of the ditch, any unused government land, near river beds, any area that something will grow without being trampled. Even use your own lawn, turn it into a garden.

Imagine walking down the road and being able to grab an apple, or a tomato, or a head of lettuce. Imagine how much suffering that will alleviate after the collapse. Lets save not just our own lives, but everyones. We cannot live for ourselves any longer, that is what this materialistic society has done to us, its time to break that conditioning.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 02:38 AM
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reply to post by xxshadowfaxx
 


Who is going to water all those plants?

That is a nice idea though, except for the nobody-will-water-them problem. I say save we hold back all those nice organic seeds, and we do your plan together *after* the war has ended...



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 03:22 AM
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reply to post by heyitsok
 


It doesn't matter if they get watered or not, some will grow, some wont. if enough people do it, there is abundance. Rain will water it. Nature has a funny way of surviving without human intervention.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 03:29 AM
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Originally posted by heyitsok
reply to post by xxshadowfaxx
 


Who is going to water all those plants?

That is a nice idea though, except for the nobody-will-water-them problem. I say save we hold back all those nice organic seeds, and we do your plan together *after* the war has ended...




If one was to do like Masanobu Fukuoka taught and make seed balls, it is very possible that many of the plants would survive and even thrive. Just like in nature; if enough seeds are dispersed, the odds of many of them surviving increase.

Masanobu was able to replenish acres and acres of land with rice and other things by making the seeds balls and then placing them all over the place. Seeds balls were made by mixing compost, seeds, and clay, then moistening the ingredients just enough to hold its shape when molded into a ball. There is a technique to making them so that the seeds do not sprout from the wet clay and compost. Just Google it to learn how.

When the seed balls are placed in the areas to be planted, they will remain there until it rains or some other means of moisture is applied. The compost and clay in the ball will keep the seeds moist until they germinate and sprout. Depending on the type of seed, there can easily be many hundreds, if not thousands of seeds within just one ball.

I know this is a bit off subject with this thread, but if somebody did want to find a good location that they can go to, before things actually start happening, it would be a good idea to make a bunch of seed balls with many different vegetable seeds, and disperse them close by their chosen location. That way, when they do have to retreat, they will more than likely have a garden already waiting for them.

I know there is a good chance of deer and other critters finding and eating your vegetables, but plant enough, and some will most likely survive to go to seed and replant themselves over the months or years until you end up going there. It's worth doing, if one is going to prepare for that type of situation anyway. Seeds are cheap (for now!), so why not?

Get only heirloom seeds, of course. If you do not trust any seed retailers, I recommend going to gardening forums and posting that you are looking for heirloom seeds. Most serious gardeners save their own seeds, and will more than likely have done so for many (plant) generations, ensuring a seed that will reproduce true to type. You'd be surprised at how many gardeners are more than happy to mail you some seeds. They usually only ask that you pay for shipping (although I have seen many people who gladly send them at their own expense).
edit on 28-1-2013 by jeramie because: (no reason given)
edit on 28-1-2013 by jeramie because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 03:50 AM
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Multiple lighters & zippos are not only great for emergencies, but also for trade. In a full collapse, you may come along people that need fire. Furthermore, in a full collapse we can assume that the economy has failed and thus barter is the norm.

Shovel is a commodity. I spent 3 months digging my holes with one of those giant bean cans. I also used that same type of can to cook food, and warming water (for cleaning myself).

Flint is definitely good, but in some areas you can gather this.

Fire drilling / busting is a good skill to have. If you don't have it, or even if you do a lighter can be a huge help. Starting a fire in the rain, or in the middle of 3 feet of snow can be quite annoying. While you can clear out an area, you'll find that most flammable bark (and other materials) is wet, along with your wood.

Canned food can be good, but I actually would go with packets of food instead of the cans. They weigh much less & are easy to open.

Knives are important, but you can mostly carve the wood you'll need with blunt knives. It sucks, but using a very dull knife I carved my spindles (for making fire), fire boards, and bows. I also used that same blunt knife to carve a large wood spoon and an eating spoon. For the most part though, you can just carve out a little dip in a stick and use that to eat; then ditch it when it gets soggy from eating.

A wedge may be good, but for survival it truly is not necessary. It won't be good for barter and my list is comprised of what you can use to survive and trade when barter becomes a norm.

Don't go with a tent. You can carry a tarp and use it to make an 'A' tent. Or you can make a 'bat cave'. When there's a few feet of snow, a bat cave can be really warm. Snow is a natural insulator. Wind can suck, but the noise is worst than the temperature.

Slingshot/bow/knife, bring weapons for sure. However, unless you are fleeing you will find that you can gather food, eat your own food, and trap animals without many weapons.

Bringing a bow and some arrows is nice, but if you are on the move then killing a 'game animal' is pointless. You'd be much better off just catching a squirrel or rabbit each day than killing a large animal and only eating some of it & leaving the rest. If you're with a group then larger animals makes sense.

Don't bring a ton of duck tape. Just bring enough and use it sparingly. The ducktape should really only be used for tears, especially in your tarps (you'll find that wind can be a deadly tarp-killer).

I included sleeping mat, but yes it is a commodity. I am referring to those 1-2cm mats that really only are good for when there's rocks; that rock just becomes a bump.

====
I survived with my tips in Utah, in the Uinta Mountain range / desert for 3 months.



posted on Jan, 28 2013 @ 01:43 PM
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You know what I want? A guide on how to live in the wilderness with nothing except the clothes you are wearing and a simple pocket and/or swiss army knife. If you can get me that, I'd be much obliged.



posted on Jan, 29 2013 @ 01:14 AM
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reply to post by AbandonedKid
 


That very much depends on what part of the world (habitat) you are expecting to be in but for the forests of the Northern hemisphere It is my opinion that you cannot beat Bushcraft by Mors Kochanski and Primitive Skills And Crafts by Richard Jamison. Both delve deeply into minimalistic, practical survival skills.

You might also want to watch a documentary named Happy People of the Tiaga.



posted on Jan, 29 2013 @ 04:43 AM
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Originally posted by AbandonedKid
You know what I want? A guide on how to live in the wilderness with nothing except the clothes you are wearing and a simple pocket and/or swiss army knife. If you can get me that, I'd be much obliged.


Yes, that depends where you are.
In a warm area though you'll be somewhat okay if you can keep your clothes dry.
If you have your knife you'll be able to use that to make some traps. You could use your shoe laces & get wood to make a fire making set.
Again, it depends where you are, but you might be able to get enough food from the local water, small animals & plants/berries.

For making sure animals don't eat your food or track you, you could probably climb up a tree and hang your food from a LONG branch. It would have to be a branch that extends far from the tree. You could hang it in your clothes/using a shoe lace to keep it closed...However, a bear would be able to either:
a. break the branch
b. climb along the branch, snap it off and fall to their death or injury - but with your food too.

If you're in an area without bears, cats, etc then you could hang your food from a small tree making it difficult for "ground animals to get to your food".

If you were fleeing, you'd want to travel frequently, but if you were simply finding a nice place to stay in the middle of the woods then you could set up a nice base camp if you were in the right area with natural resources.





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