Dear British people, wake up!, page 1

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 8 times

Topic started on 26-1-2013 @ 04:12 PM by Heisenberg59

I, as an American, feel it my duty to warn my brothers and sisters across the pond of what should really be a bigger concern than it is as we speak. Now, we can go through a historical lesson here, but I'll save you the speech. The fact is, all this "the queen has no power" crap needs to stop. I wont even argue that point even though I honestly believe the woman has immensely more power than she lets on.

The problem that I see is that, even if the Queen doesn't have any significant power, how many generations will it take? Do you honestly believe that, given the history of royalty, someone won't take the throne and want that power back? The UK is already talking about leaving the EU. Who is going to stop the next tyrant King from bringing his throne back to where it's been historically? The disarmed people of the UK? Where is the resistance to such a move especially with the UK moving away from the EU?

That's really the only point I want to make here. I've spoken to a good amount of Brits and I haven't heard one actually welcome the idea of royalty regaining their true power. The point I make is that the wheels are in motion. The UK is not immune to history and the world really does not need another King George.

Fire is a powerful ally but a dangerous foe and Brits, you're playing with fire.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:19 PM by ObservingYou

reply to post by Heisenberg59

We're awake thank you.

Unfortunately none of our living generation had a say in the guns, so you can't really call us out on that.

Anti-EU movement? UKIP? We all want out, and our Government is aware...Now, have you any useful advice?

As for the royals - They're part of our heritage - some love, some hate - evolution will eventually eradicate royalty, it's all just a waiting game you know.

edit on 26-1-2013 by ObservingYou because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:21 PM by Alien44

I for one have never thought the queen had no power. So thank you, but I don't think we're blind to that fact. The temping answer would be we play with fire, you play with firearms, we're quits.....but let's not go there.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:23 PM by Soloprotocol

The queen and her family can go Fork themselves...there, you heard it from a British citizen....they are powerless...just a tourist attraction like Blackpool or barrow on Furness..

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:23 PM by Heisenberg59

reply to post by ObservingYou

I wasn't attempting to give advice, simply a warning. If you understand the warning, good. I also posed the question what would the UK do if royalty ever did want their power back? I'm not blaming UK citizens for not being armed. That decision was made. The question is, what happens if Charles takes the crown? The man everyone thinks to be a loon? What happens if decrees himself supreme ruler? Where is the resistance?

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:26 PM by skalla

reply to post by Heisenberg59

well if a monarch did decide to do that it would just lead to another "constitutional crisis" and they would lose further privilege, they really are just protecting their back sides and their wealth... and much as i dislike the principle of a monarchy, old liz has done a rather stirling job strangely enough.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:27 PM by Soloprotocol

Originally posted by Heisenberg59
reply to post by ObservingYou

what happens if Charles takes the crown? The man everyone thinks to be a loon? What happens if decrees himself supreme ruler?

He'll get a good kick in the China Dolls and told to behave himself.....

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:27 PM by Heisenberg59

reply to post by skalla

Right and as I said, what happens when Liz is gone? The woman is old. Where does the crown go from there? And what prevents the crown from taking it's power back while the citizens are disarmed and the UK is no longer part of the EU?

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:28 PM by Heisenberg59

Originally posted by Soloprotocol

Originally posted by Heisenberg59
reply to post by ObservingYou

what happens if Charles takes the crown? The man everyone thinks to be a loon? What happens if decrees himself supreme ruler?

He'll get a good kick in the China Dolls and told to behave himself.....

From who? The UK is disarmed. Who is going to tell him to behave himself?

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:28 PM by KilgoreTrout

The Queen, or rather monarchy, is an important buffer between the people and the corporations that can easily manipulate the state. Given our size and limited resources, it is an essential feature. She, the Queen, is the servant of the people, difficult to appreciate what that means unless you study our history, but the Act of Settlement is a good place to start if you really want to understand.

But yeah...we woked up enough, ta very much. We had our revolution, had our republic...realised that we had made a mistake and instead tailored the monarchy to suit our needs...when something better comes along, I am sure we will jump on it...until then...ya know..

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:28 PM by PhoenixOD

I think Americans have enough to worry about with their own failing country / economy / currency etc without worrying about hypothetical situations about our future. We have been around for a very long time and im sure we will be ok in the future.

I mean i know Americans like to think they can tell everyone how they should be running their own countries and how they should be living their lives based on their own culture that has only been around for a few hundred years but its not really needed here. Thanks for the concern

edit on 26-1-2013 by PhoenixOD because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:28 PM by OtherSideOfTheCoin

The Queen (or future King) does not have to take any power back because the head of state, that is to say the Queen already has significant power. For example it is the Queen who makes a formal declaration of war and actually decides on the prime minister, however the she has to appoint based on the outcome of the election, however it is her who turns round to the PM and says words to the effect of “my people have said they want you to create a government and lead this country for the next four years, go and do it”. The problem arises when we have a hung parliament where the Queen can actually just say “oi, you, go govern for a while until we sort this out”, it almost happened at the last General election. She is also the one who dissolves government.

So your thread actually fails because you don’t understand the role of the Monarchy. They do already have the type of power that you are talking about however in practice it isn’t used, it is sometimes also called the “Royal prerogative” she delegates it to Her Majesties Government. The Monarchy have a lot more power than what people think, it is the Queen who signs new legislation into law for example.

What is really good about our system of government is that the Monarchy and Parliament keep each other in check. The Queen can tell the Government to get lost if they turn tyrannical and the government would probably to a lesser extend have the same power of the monarchy. Our constitutional order is actually way superior to that of the United States in that sense.

So yeah, thanks for the warning, but we don’t need it.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:30 PM by KilgoreTrout

Originally posted by Heisenberg59
reply to post by ObservingYou

I wasn't attempting to give advice, simply a warning. If you understand the warning, good. I also posed the question what would the UK do if royalty ever did want their power back? I'm not blaming UK citizens for not being armed. That decision was made. The question is, what happens if Charles takes the crown? The man everyone thinks to be a loon? What happens if decrees himself supreme ruler? Where is the resistance?

It can't happen. Legally, and physically impossible.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:34 PM by AngryCymraeg

Oh fer flips sake... The Queen has next to no power - quite a lot of people died to make that so over the past few centuries. As for UKIP, they are currently at around 10% in the polls and the only reason why Cameronbumble has caved in and agreed to a referendum is because he's afraid of the scum on the right wing of his party who have been frothing mindlessly at the mouth about this for years. As for guns, if I want one I can go out and buy one, if I wanted to and I had a permit. No-one would stop me (as I don't have a criminal record), apart from my wife, who comes from Oregon and who hates guns passionately.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:34 PM by Heisenberg59

reply to post by KilgoreTrout

How so? Explain. Just because it's not legal does not protect the people. You can see that today in America with the second amendment.

Honestly, I love how many Brits wants to jump on the anti gun wagon against Americans, but the second an American has an opinion on the crown I "simply don't understand".

I want someone to answer the question of how a tyrant King can be stopped with a disarmed UK that is moving away from the EU. I don't need to be told I'm a stupid American and I don't understand. Just answer the question.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:34 PM by ResistTreason

There is no getting through to them.

They accept every damned thing that they are told.

I think that it will end though, when they are one day informed that alcohol is to be banned. Then the testicles will start appearing on the male population there.

Hopefully.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:36 PM by AngryCymraeg

Oh and as for German Charlie, if he ever reaches the throne he'll be derided, laughed at and generally scorned. Man's an idiot.

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:38 PM by skalla

reply to post by Heisenberg59

you really misunderstand the relationship between parliament, people and monarchy, but i see others have covered that in this thread, as well as other uk gun threads covering this and the innaccuracies of saying the uk is disarmed - i'll not go into that simply as i am tired of covering the same ground over and over..
as i said earlier, i disagree with a monarchy in principle.. however, i expect that many would agree that in the states you effectively have a group of families who run everything and are raised and educated for that ruling position, the uk is no different except with it being one family there really is an onus on them to fulfil their role in a responsible manner lest they lose it, which is a real possibility.

i guess all political sytems are pretty much a bunch of crud and and have the dice loaded in favour of those who set them up (it could be argued that the US has this down to a fine art) - in the uk we have at least had the benefit of a good few hundreds of years to "fiddle around with it" and remove or mitigate some of the problems

edit on 26-1-2013 by skalla because: there not their

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:39 PM by KilgoreTrout

Originally posted by Heisenberg59
reply to post by KilgoreTrout

How so? Explain. Just because it's not legal does not protect the people. You can see that today in America with the second amendment.

Honestly, I love how many Brits wants to jump on the anti gun wagon against Americans, but the second an American has an opinion on the crown I "simply don't understand".

I want someone to answer the question of how a tyrant King can be stopped with a disarmed UK that is moving away from the EU. I don't need to be told I'm a stupid American and I don't understand. Just answer the question.

Guns have absolutely nothing to do it. Our army would never turn on us. They are us. Why would they? We beheaded one King, nothing to stop us doing the same again if necessary...we may not have guns, but we have kitchen implements... Where there is a will there is a way.... That is what being British is ALL about. Don't you know?

reply posted on 26-1-2013 @ 04:39 PM by AngryCymraeg

Originally posted by Heisenberg59
reply to post by KilgoreTrout

How so? Explain. Just because it's not legal does not protect the people. You can see that today in America with the second amendment.

Honestly, I love how many Brits wants to jump on the anti gun wagon against Americans, but the second an American has an opinion on the crown I "simply don't understand".

I want someone to answer the question of how a tyrant King can be stopped with a disarmed UK that is moving away from the EU. I don't need to be told I'm a stupid American and I don't understand. Just answer the question.

Because they have no power. Power in the UK goes through Parliament - they write the laws, they pass the laws, they run the Government. The Monarchy does not have its hands on the keys to power any more - they haven't for some time. The PM goes to see the Queen once a week to tell her how things are going to happen, not the other way around. There is no mechanism at all to allow a monarch to take power. It cannot happen. The Civil Service takes it orders from Parliament. Hell, even the House of Lords has next to no power - they haven't even been able to vote on budgets since 1910.

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