The Great Thermite Debate!

reply to post by -PLB-


It's not, though. I always thought the idea was to explain the molten stuff of unknown composition.

Originally posted by ibiubu
Boron is not used in explosive formulations. You want to find sources? There are none.

More "truther" quality research....

onlinelibrary.wiley.com...

Boron-Based High Explosives

and
www.google.com...

A primary explosive composition consisting of a polybasic lead salt of a di- or a tri-nitro- substituted resorcinol containing 3, 4, 5 or 6 atoms of lead per aromatic nucleus in which a minor proportion of finely-divided boron is entrained within, and dispensed throughout, individual crystals of the polybasic lead salt.

and
link.springer.com...

Detonation of explosives containing boron

etc etc etc.

reply to post by hellobruce


My Wiley Big Book 'O Military Explosives shows both boron and barium either in the mix or as a part of the firechain of pretty much every thermite formulation. I used to use barium nitrate mixed with thermite as an initiator for thermite, if I was using raw powder.


to wit:

Thermites can be a diverse class of compositions. Some fuels that can be used are aluminium, magnesium, titanium, zinc, silicon, boron, and others. One commonly used fuel in thermite mixtures is aluminium, because of its high boiling point. The oxidizers can be boron(III) oxide, silicon(IV) oxide, chromium(III) oxide, manganese(IV) oxide, iron(III) oxide, iron(II,III) oxide, copper(II) oxide, and lead(II,III,IV) oxide, and others.[1]

the first non-wikipedia hit...

Boron and barium do not burn as hot as thermite components compared to aluminum, however, they are far easier to ignite. They lower the ignition temperature significantly. Like half. So, you add them to the thermite to lower the ignition temp, and you add in a LOT (like 30%) in the firechain just upstream of the thermite in the prestart stage. Your fuse starts an intermediate compound that ignites the prestart mix that ignites the thermite. You rarely rely on just setting off a pile of thermite. Because a fuse won't do it. Magnesium ribbon won't do it. You can ignite it with an oxybutane torch but you are going to get a faceful of sparks. It's way easier to mix up some barium nitrate starter.

reply to post by ibiubu


Where is Pteridine? Pteridine is reading your posts and is waiting for you to explain how thermite can take down a building with the speed of a gravitational collapse. As has been stated many times, thermite isn't fast enough for controlled demolitions or it would be used commercially. If 100 floors collapsed in 15 seconds, that is 150 milliseconds per floor. How can thermite do that?
Of course, you can't explain it other than to hand wave and say that Jon Cole demonstrated that therm*te can cut steel....something that it was designed to do. Jon is a publicity hound and making videos for the easily-led is the only way he can get it.
As to your comments about DSC, go ahead and try to explain why the Jones gang did it correctly and why the energetics are consistent with therm*te. When you are done, I'll again explain why Jones doesn't understand what he did and why you are wrong.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by Agit8dChop

 

Let me try that again..

Re: Proof of Super High Temperatures and Active Thermitic Material Present

Extremely high temperatures during the World Trade Center destruction

Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe
from www.benthamscience.com...

More @ The Journal of 9/11 Studies

I'd still like the sceptics and debunkers to explain these findings, absent the presence of explosives (of any variety or combination).

reply to post by NewAgeMan


Active Thermitic Material turned out to be paint. The office contents contained much more energy than explosives could have, and thus can generate much more heat. In fact, explosives or thermite in general have a very low energy/volume ratio. I have never seen anyone come with a well supported argument that any type of explosive could theoretically be responsible fot the heat. Explosives in demolitions are not meant to heat anything, but to cut stuff. Its only a very local event. Same goes for thermite, only a very small portion of a column is heated. It just does not have enough energy to heat entire columns to high degrees.

reply to post by -PLB-


actually, the contents in the office produce MINIMAL heat, no where near enough to melt steel.

The man in the video proves that thermite can be used to cut steal, he shows footage from the 911 attacks with very real and proper analaysis of how it could have been used for the desired result.

and while you refer to one mans paper that says the particles found were from paint, I also present a paper authored by many men that state with almost certainty that the particles found are from thermite.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
actually, the contents in the office produce MINIMAL heat, no where near enough to melt steel.

It produces a lot of heat, just over a longer period.

The man in the video proves that thermite can be used to cut steal, he shows footage from the 911 attacks with very real and proper analaysis of how it could have been used for the desired result.

But when the columns are cut, are they red hot glowing? Or will they only be heated very localized?

and while you refer to one mans paper that says the particles found were from paint, I also present a paper authored by many men that state with almost certainty that the particles found are from thermite.

You should stop believing everything you find on the web.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
no where near enough to melt steel.

What has melted steel got to do with 9/11?

The man in the video proves that thermite can be used to cut steal,

So? No one denied that it could cut steel....

he shows footage from the 911 attacks with very real and proper analaysis of how it could have been used for the desired result.

Except he seems to have missed out the bit that no one noticed all the holes punched in the wall to allow the thermite to be placed on the steel....

I also present a paper authored by many men that state with almost certainty that the particles found are from thermite.

Did you actually read it? Why did they have to pay to get it published, and couldnt get it published in a peer reviewed journal?

reply to post by Agit8dChop

The man in the video proves that thermite can be used to cut steal,

I could produve a video showing that midgets with grinders can cut steel. But that doesn't mean midgets brought down the towers.

You need to prove that somehow the steel was cut before you try to prove how it was cut.

Thermite may have been used in the demolition of the towers, but thermite doesnt turn concrete to dust.

The best 'logical' explanation Ive come across so far is www.drjudywood.com... but the real truth/weapon may still be some years away from becoming 'public information'.

reply to post by Nonchalant

Watch this video of Woods and tell me she doesn't have a screw loose.

reply to post by pteridine

Where is Pteridine? Pteridine is reading your posts and is waiting for you to explain how thermite can take down a building with the speed of a gravitational collapse. As has been stated many times, thermite isn't fast enough for controlled demolitions or it would be used commercially. If 100 floors collapsed in 15 seconds, that is 150 milliseconds per floor. How can thermite do that?
Of course, you can't explain it other than to hand wave and say that Jon Cole demonstrated that therm*te can cut steel....something that it was designed to do. Jon is a publicity hound and making videos for the easily-led is the only way he can get it.
As to your comments about DSC, go ahead and try to explain why the Jones gang did it correctly and why the energetics are consistent with therm*te. When you are done, I'll again explain why Jones doesn't understand what he did and why you are wrong.

And Bedlam called you my sock puppet lol

You guys are always on these forums, so you are naturally suspect. No offense intended.

I don't agree with Jones as he is a disinformation agent working for the CIA. DSC is not needed and a post-mortem will never show a signature for thermate or thermite. THE ONLY SIGNATURE IS IN THE steel microstructure on the failed beams. Care to talk about that?

WTC Report Appdx C

Originally posted by ibiubu
reply to post by pteridine

 

And Bedlam called you my sock puppet lol

You guys are always on these forums, so you are naturally suspect. No offense intended.

I don't agree with Jones as he is a disinformation agent working for the CIA. DSC is not needed and a post-mortem will never show a signature for thermate or thermite. THE ONLY SIGNATURE IS IN THE steel microstructure on the failed beams. Care to talk about that?

WTC Report Appdx C

Maybe Bedlam has a hidden sense of humor. Jones wants to be in the limelight and this was a way for him to do it. He started with a conclusion and worked backwards and not very well, at that.
I read the FEMA appendix in the past and am willing to discuss it further. There is still no way that thermite could do anything but start the gravitational collapse as the clearance rates and timing are well beyond the capabilities of thermite.