North korea Nuke threat to USA.

reply to post by SplitInfinity


You seem to be very versed at Militarized Space programs . What would be the possibility of a Cargo Ship regestered to a friendly country deploying a Skud missile from it's cargo hold with an EMP weapon 150 miles off of Texas and it reaching altitude for detonation ?

reply to post by jhn7537


Well...that question can be answered by looking at the war over the Falkland Islands between the U.K. and Argentina.

The U.S. had and still has treaties with both countries that stipulate the U.S. will come to the aid of either if they are attacked by another country. Since we had a treaty with both...the U.S. backed the U.K. which the U.S. has greater ties to and a greater history with.

When Argentina invaded the Falkland Islans which are off the coast of Argentina and are a territiory of the U.K. but who's ownership was disputed by Argentina...the U.K. sent the Royal Navy to regain control of the Islands.

At first the U.S. stayed out of it but after Argentinian French made Super-Entendar Fighter Bombers started sinking British Destroyers such as the HMS Sheffield with French made Exocet Missiles as the U.K. lost 2 Destroyers and 2 Frigates 1 LSL Landing ship and 1 LSU Amphibious craft....the U.S. started providing the U.K. with U.S. Satellite Imaging as well as Real Time Satellite Observation...which at the time was highly secretive and not even known to exist...and U.S. Radar Data.

This U.S. suppost was imparitive data needed by the U.K. as it allowed the Royal Navy to know exactly where the Argentinian Airforce were basing their aircraft...when, where and how many Argentinian Aircraft might be attacking British Forces and exactly where Argentinian Navy Ships were IN REAL TIME.

If you think about this was...the U.K. fought a war for MONTHS with Argentina...a Nation that has very little in the way of a Military and the U.K. had great difficulty doing so as well as if it were not for the U.S. providing help in the form of Satallite Imaging and Radar Data...British casualties could have been much higher.

Now that was one of our greatest allies fighting a war against little ol'e Argentina. How would they fare against a larger Military Power such as China? They wouldn't...not without the help of the United States.

Split Infinity

reply to post by SimonPeter


First of all a standard Cargo Container is not anywhere near large enough to hold a SCUD or it's Launcher.

But let's say for arguements sake that a SCUD was launched from a Cargo Ships Hold or perhaps from the modified belly of a Fishing Trawler.

A SCUD is a notoriously inaccurate weapon...even the most modern versions. But let's say that it did what you state.

The problem for those who would launch a Nuclear EMP is that U.S. Satellite Detection can track ANYTHING that is emmitting Neutron Radiation as well as other forms of Radiation...Gamma Rays...etc...that would be emmitted from any Nuclear Weapon.

Then there is the issue of a country being advanced enough to develop a Nuclear Warhead that is both small enough and light enough to be placed atop of such a small missile as besides the U.S., Russia, France and China...I am not mentioning the U.K. as their Missiles tend to be built and purchased from the United States...other Nuclear Nations such as India and Pakistan use much larger and powerful missiles to carry their Nuclear Warheads and since they are neighbors those missiles do not have far to go.

A Non-Nuclear EMP Device could be placed atop a SCUD but such EMP's are of a very High Tech. nature and although Russia has them and a few other countries are working on them...only the U.S. has Non-Nuclear EMP's that are small enough...light enough and extremely powerful enough to be worth using. So besides the U.S...we are not going to see one of these coming from another country.

Now very soon...by the end of the decade...the U.S. Space Command along with the U.S. Navy and Air force will have deployed and fully operational the FEL or Free Electron Laser Anti-Missile Defense Shield. This system will use a combination of Land based and sea based FEL's and possibly some based on Aircraft.

They will be Electric which will be generated by Nuclear Reactors. Discover Magazine reported that using the U.S. Navy Duel Fission Reactor...2 A1B Fission Reactors per Carrier...which will be first installed on CVN-78 Gerald R. Ford and CVN-79 John F. Kennedy...such a Laser will be capable of vaporizing a Hole through 1000 Feet of Solid Steel in Seconds. YES...that is 1000 Feet.

Such a powerful Laser that by design is not disrupted by Atmospheric Conditions...when coupled with Multiple Networked Super Computers and a Mutiple Insect Eye Like Prism Reflective Satellite System for over the Horizon Targeting...will allow simultanious targeting and firing of split beams at multiple targets with a refire sequence of only a second or less. Such a system on a ship can even target and vaporize multiple 50 Cal. rounds that would be possibly fired upon a USN. Ship.

Once this FEL system is fully installed and operational...it will constitute an Impenatrable Missile Shield as well as a Weapon Capable of Offensive use as such a Laser could be bounced off a Reflective Satellite with Prism Tech...ordinary Optics and Mirrors are Vaporized when attempting to reflect and focus an FEL beam...thus Multiple Prisms are used...could vaporize any target anywhere and will change the face of Warfare as we know it.

Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity


Well that sounds good but anything can be shielded and our record of readiness is exemplary . Case in point Pearl Harbor ,911,the unexplained Missile launch off California not long ago .
I am not sure that we are as prepared as they say we are . If that inaccurate Skud missile was launched , how long would it take for us to see it and decide it is not a test or exercize get confirmation , permissiom and execute a launch or firing to shoot it down?At 3000 miles per hour in 9 minutes it could be over Nebraska at 600 miles above the earth . For a rocket to be fired to catch it would is not likely. For a Lazer system to be powered up to track and fire on it with all the hurdles (safety measures) to deal with say on Sunday morning at 3am , not likely ! We would have to be on the ready , know it was about to happen and have an officer with full authority and not afraid to use it .

reply to post by SimonPeter


It has been whispered that new advanced U.S. Satellite Detection of Radioactive Materials...that were placed into orbit 5 years after 9/11 and then upgraded with new programing many times since...are supposed to be able by a method no one will even talk about...that is capable of detecting some emmision of Uranium or Plutonium even through a heavy lead lined box.

Now I myself have given this a lot of thought and I would have by now dismissed it as fantasy if I had not repeatedly heard talk about it's existence. I think it may be possible that any shielding material that encases such Nuclear Fuel may have it's Vibrationary State of Matter changed by Neutron Bombardment.

It also may be possible for a specific duel frequency broadcast that would reflect of the encasing material and be collected at a ground station...to be able to determine such a change or specific signature that would be consistant with that material being effected by Neutron Decay.

As far as U.S. readiness of Missile Defense...I can see how there might be a delay in chain of command decisions as far as branches of the U.S. Military...but as it goes for U.S. Space Command...this entity would be responsible for the currently small numbers of FEL's that are operational and I believe that they have standing orders to vaporize any oncoming Missile headed toward U.S. Territory.

Split Infinity

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by dogstar23

 

You have not inspected his cabinet or czars have you . Obama was raised by Socialist grandfather . You have also missed the statement that Soros made about Obama was not moving fast enough to make us a socialist nation . Obamas appointment of Cass Sunstein to his cabal of advisers and Sunstein's book Nudge I believe it's called is putting forth the opinion that all it will take is a Nudge to push America into Socialism .
The United Nations / New World Order global governance plan AGENDA 21 is all about a Socialist / Communist government and Obama is their man to move us into that world .
You are sadly mistaken . What Obama says and what he does and what he means are not the same . I don't think he has been stricken with a case of Patriotism since he was elected . I don't know if he has any patriotism for the American way . He is a Globalist sympathiser .

Ok, points taken there, but...George HW Bush (since at least 1980), George W. Bush, and Bill Clinton were globalist sympathizers too. Heck, Senior is one of the main drivers of this agenda, right? I juat haven't seen much progress made toward that goal. Sure, Soros seemsretty tightly linked with Obama, and others, but the same could be said for Carter. In the years since Carter, we have only continued to push further and further away from the extreme of Socialism and more toward the extreme of fascism (please don't take "fascism" the wrong way, it's a legit system, and doesn't just mean Nazi-style, evil fascism, though it has come to be synonymous.) i'm not saying we are or have been near either extreme, just saying we've moved further "right" over the last 35 years than we have "left." that's actual, not the nonsense republican = right / democrats = left many have fallen for.

Anyhow, maybe the pendulum swinging too far is by design, meant as a catalyst. Concentrate as much wealth in as few hands as possible. Compress the middle class inward and downward, until eventually, the breaking point is reached, and the pendulum swings the other way - to Socialism.

Now, if that is the case...I'm still trying to figure out why TDTB (that's The Dbags That Be) want Socialism. How does that benefit them? I've always believed there is some kind of global control conspiracy going on, but the one thing I've never been able to grasp is...why? What good does it do "them?" I guess until I see some actual evidence of us becoming Socialist/Communist, I'm just not going to believe it. The sky has been falling for too many decades for me to buy into it now. So far, the most "socialist" program I can think of (the so-called Obamacare) is, in reality, the most fascist program we have. The government essentially forcing people to purchase a service (health care insurance) from private, for-profit corporations is a classic example of Fascism. Single-payer health coverage, where contributions (taxes) pay in to a government system which then pays all of the healthcare bills in the nation, is Socialized Medicine. The whole healthcare thing is what has many people thinking we're slipping into socialism. Somehow, the fat cats in the insurance industry and big Pharma duped everybody into thinking this is something its not. That way, "blame" can go to the president, instead of to the multi-billionaires who pushed to ensure the world's least efficient healthcare industry became far more inefficient, so that billionaires could become richer.
The President, unfortunately, is all too happy to take the blame and be called a socialist on behalf of his fascist benefactors.

Why do little dogs bark/yap so much?

To make up for what they do not have?

And Im supposed to just sit there and let it chew on my pant leg?

reply to post by dogstar23


Although I am sure no one from the States would want to live in a Communist System such as North Korea or China...for people to actually think that the current...Republican Planned Health Care System...as this current plan is not Obamas Plan or even a Democratic Plan...it is a plan developed by at the time Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney and his Best in the Business Experts.

I have this plan as I live in Massachusetts where EVERYONE has Health Care. The best part of the whole thing is I am WEALTHY and on occasion help run several Family Owned Companies...and not only is it now cheaper to cover our employees but MY PERSONAL HEATH CARE PAYMENTS HAVE GONE DOWN!

That's right...a Republican Governor along with the Mass. Republican Party and a team of experts that Romney hired developed this plan and since it works...Obama and the Democratic Party want to use it Nationaly.

The plan is simple. EVERYONE must have Health Care. If you are poor and can't afford it...you either pay a small amount each month that you can afford or it is FREE. If you have Health Care already your payments will go down because since evryone has coverage the State no longer has to pay Billions of Dollars in Emergency Room Costs to Hospitals to cover those who do not pay because they are poor.

This savings is astronamical and since Insurance Companies are taking in more money because everyone must be covered...overall coverage costs go down.

You DO ARE NOT FORCED TO HAVE STATE COVERAGE. If you are covered by an Insurance Plan that you like...you can keep it. State Business Insurance Plans are not only less expensive for small businesses that cover employees they also allow for a person to choose whatever Doctor they wish.

Because everyone participates in this plan...Co-Pays are very inexpensive as most RX's cost $12 for a 90 day supply as well as certain large superstores are charging only $5 for a 90 day supply of well used RX's. Ambulance co-pay is $50 and Emergency Room visits are $100. Doctors visit is $35.

Point is...for those who are screaming about a Democratic/Obama Communist Health Care Plan...the Republicans developed it and Massacusetts has Universal Health Care Coverage for EVERYONE!

It costs ME less money and I still go to the same Doctor I have always gone to and IT WORKS!

Split Infinity

reply to post by SimonPeter
Yes that is one of many points to bring up many do not or will not admit to the capability of N Korea or China they just think they N Korea and china are back water 3rd world countries with no real threat , they will learn when they N Korea and China do strike. it is now a matter of when, not if.

reply to post by bekod


If you could...please explain just how and by what means North Korea and China will strike the U.S. as you have stated such a strike is immenent?

Since neither North Korea or China has any capability to Force Project their Troops in any meaningful way other than in Asia and the Asian Pacific Rim...and that if North Korea was to attack the South this would result in a massive U.S. Military counterstrike that the North could not survive...you will have to explain to me how either of these countries would have any ability to strike directly at the U.S. without being completely obliterated?

Split Infinity

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by Adaluncatif

 

The U.S. has several times given Aid to North Korea in the form of Food, Oil and Medical. The North has signed...on multiple occasions...several treaties to dismantle their Nuclear Program...treaties to which the North has broken...EVERY ONE!

You are blaming the U.S.?

It is not the United States' responsibility to feed North Korea...a Country we were at WAR with and a Country that REFUSES to sign the agreement TO END THE KOREAN WAR.

China is the North's benefactor as it was China that was defending the North against the U.N. and U.S. Forces that were fighting North Korea AFTER it INVADED THE SOUTH.

Here is a Country that has created it's own problems...killed MILLIONS of South Koreans and killed MILLIONS of it's own people as well as the FACT that North Korea is responsible for the Korean War as it was the North that started hostilities by invading the South.

For you or ANYONE to defend a Regime that teaches it's children that it's leader is a LIVING GOD and it is an HONOR to STARVE TO DEATH for that leader as it is his plan and wisdom that you should die so in an overall effort to battle the South and the United States...well then you really don't know what you are talking about.

Split Infinity

Yes I am blaming the US, and no I am not defending the regime. The US is preventing this country from developing through sanctions. What the US should do is recognize the legitimacy of the government of North Korea just as it recognizes Britain or France or South Korea. The people of a country should not suffer just because the government of the United States does not agree with their political system. The United States had no business being involved in the Korean War in the first place. Same mistake in Viet Nam. Same mistake in Iraq. Those wars had nothing to do with the survival of the United States, and everybody who died in those wars died for nothing. Did America collapse after North Viet Nam won the Viet Nam War(yes, they did win)? The Iranian government should be recognized as the legitimate government as well as the Syrian government. US foreign policy is madness and will lead to the undoing of the United States. North Korea has every right to possess nuclear weapons. So does Iran. The United States is hell bent on controlling the entire world. It will fail miserably. The leaders need to hurry up and realize this, or we are all doomed.

reply to post by Adaluncatif


Last time I checked China was North Korea's pal.

Where is China in all this?

Why are you not screaming at China? They are next door to North Korea and certainly have the wealth to provide it with food, fuel and medical supplies. Yet they do very little...now why do you think that is?

I will tell you why.

Although China supports North Korea to an extent because it is also a Communist System...secretly China would love nothing better than to have the North Korean Government collapse so as to have another system of government and another leadership take power.

China is just as concerned and deeply worried that the North Koreans will do something incredibly STUPID and start a war with the United States. China would just love to see the North's leadership go the way of the dinosaurs!

Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity
Ok scenario 1 N Korea launches a test missile for ICBM capability after they test a Fission bomb, US see this as well as South Korea as major threat, we send in more troops and CV's in the area South goes to full alert. N Korea and China see this as a act of war....N Korea attacks South and from China ICBM's are launched... Japan, HW, and CA are Nuked. www.fas.org... China then launches their new anti ship missiles at the US CV fleet www.bloomberg.com...
Russia says any more aggression by any side they will step in

You decide how we the US west respond

scenario 2 N Korea does their test and it is proved more powerful, at the same time admitting they have more than one, also admitting they have ICBM missiles, the Launch in Dec was a test for their new ICBM, the Sat is really a war head,N Korea also makes the Statement "any attempt to bring it down or any act/ sanction will be an act of war.

Is it a bluff or for real, you make the call.

This is all just a what if.

reply to post by bekod


I will first reply to scenario #1.

It starts as possible but I do not see any circumstance...even if the U.S., South Korea and the North were at war...that China would launch ICBM's.

For China to do this would mean a Nuclear response by the United States. Something that China could not survive but given the current and new U.S. ABM capabilities...the U.S. could mitigate.

For an actual war to break out North Korea would have to either invade the South or attack the Souths Navy in mass or attack the U.S. troops stationed in the South with artillary. If the North did any of these things which would clearly show the North as the agressor...China would most likely Bow Out.

If the South or the U.S. attacked the North...then the Chinese might send troops to also attack but they WOULD NOT launch Nukes.

Split Infinity

reply to post by bekod


Scenario 2.

The U.S. has the Satellite Detection capability to determine if the North Korean Satellite has a Nuke on it or not. If it did...the U.S. would down it with an SM-3 ASAT Missile. The U.S. would not care if the North made threats about downing it or not.

The one treaty that EVERY COUNTRY has abided by is the Nuclear Weapons Space Ban. If the North was determined to have placed a Nuke in Orbit then the U.S. would even have China on it's side as well as the U.N.

This is one thing that the North could never get away with.

Split Infinity

funny how things turn out, for it seems the word was given, stop the testing or... well from the link www.cbsnews.com... from the link

"We judge North Korea by its actions, not its words," he said.

words spoken

U.S. envoy for North Korea Glyn Davies

so now the question remains will N Korea test or not test? from the link

BEIJING | Washington and Beijing have agreed that a nuclear test by North Korea would lead to its further isolation and set back efforts to restart regional talks on its nuclear disarmament, a U.S. envoy said.

If they do test and we do impose more sanctions how will N Korea respond?

reply to post by bekod


Since China has bailed out the North on many occasions...North Korea will respond how the Chinese tell them to respond.

But mark my words...the day the North does not do this is the day China will tell them they are on their own.

Without China...even a reclusive and brutal a Country and Leadership that is North Korea...cannot survive.

Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity
how true China just may have just said "enough of the spoiled brat NKorea... no need to go to war over it , for now it is on its own"

reply to post by bekod


China has it's own internal issues going on as there is currently a split in the Communist Party. One one hand you have the Old Communist Guard that have members who are in their late 80's to early 90's that were actually IN the Korean War.

This group hates anything that has anything to do with the U.S.

Then you have the younger Communist Party that is well aware that if not for the fact China essentially became a Capitalist Nation it would still be in poverty. This group also knows that China needs the U.S. to grow economically and any U.S./Chinese war would be a complete disaster for China.

In the end the Old Guard will die off and at that point you can expect China to cut North Korea loose.

Split Infinity