Beekeepers Expect "Worst Year For Bees, We’re Facing The Extinction Of A Species.”

reply to post by Plotus

You will probably find foundation sheets the easiest for constructing frames. They are plastic with imprinted octagon depressions the bees follow in their comb construction, and sanitation is also much better with these plastic sheets.

Using foundation is not good for the bees either. Let the bees decide what size their cells will be they have been doing it for millions of years. Frames in the hives also make it harder for the bees to keep the hive at the proper temperature. All this stuff is to make it easier to steal their honey and feed them sugar water in place of it.

Let the bees do what they do naturally and they will be healthier and leave them enough of their own honey to over winter...

My bees have the foundations that are plastic. Much thought has been put into the sizing as you mention, and being that mine are of the Russian variety, they happen to be of small stature, (Italian's are small too) and the basis for the cell size using plastic foundations sufficient. I have yet to harvest honey..... any honey, thus my bees are as close to a natural storehouse as were they living in the wild. They have remained strong and had a large surplus of honey for their survival. So in doing that, they have no need for sugar water. All beekeepers who harvest use a winter supplement such as sugar to keep the honey volume somewhat intact within the hives. But again, they harvest honey from their hives reducing internal content of the food the bees use to winter over on. I find the most harmful pests are moths and birds, specifically mockingbirds. Birds can lunch out and decimate a hive in a couple weeks time eating continuously two to three or more bees a minute. I am a bird lover, but I must go out and wait in hiding and blast a couple birds leaving their bodies around the hive are to discourage further plunder. I really dislike doing so, but Owl decoys seem to be of little value in deterring the birds. My hives are four stories high, and this year I will probably harvest some since they have stockpiled for five years now counting this spring season coming up.

Maybe genetically modified corn in the form of high fructose corn syrup is killing them. A couple of bees get into empty soda cans in the trash and bring back the sweetener to share with the rest of the hive not knowing that 92% of corn in the US is modified to destroy the stomachs of insects.

Just a thought. Does anyone know if the bees are dying off the same way in other countries?

then again if they're giving them sugar water, a percentage of that sugar is probably beet sugar. sugar beets are also GMO

I have been gardening for several years and always had a problem with squash, zucchini and pumpkins. They would start to make fruit, but when still small they would rot and fall off. I also noticed I didn't see many bees around the garden. I found out this is something called "fruit abortion" where the flowers are not being pollinated enough. So I tried doing it myself with a brush and it helped out a lot.

Now this past summer (2012) I noticed bees everywhere. Literally dozens on each plant doing their little bee thing. And I had the best harvest ever. I wonder if someone in the area started keeping bees or something, but whatever it is, I am sure glad to have them. That's my first hand experience with how important those critters are.

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


Thanks Truthx,

As you say, the buildings are for the people....
Well the people need the bees, more than they even know.

I had a larger garden last year, and was very happy to see some bumblebees,
and just a few honeybees. I enjoyed them especially due to knowing how rare,
and special they are becoming.

Originally posted by ChesterJohn
reply to post by burntheships

 

I am sure that GMO plants and modified seeds have a lot to do with this.

I am sorry let me give an example. We put our bee boxes with queens next to a corn field every year as the bees love the corn and other wild flowers around the fields. Not only after drying the corn after harvest the corn would not grow but a few inches then die off. but we noticed the bees too began to die off we lost whole hives.

ChesterJohn,

Thanks for sharing your experience and observations, sorry to hear about your
lost hives!

The bees dont like the GMO pesticide corn, its so toxic, it seems obvious, lets hope
something is done, and soon!

reply to post by Plotus


The man made foundation is still to large a cell size then the bees make naturally. This creates bigger bees who cannot fly as far and are more susceptible to mites and other pests because of it. If you stop using foundation the bees will revert back to their natural size in a year or two. Think about it. There is no foundation for them in the wild no frames etc. they attach their combs directly to the walls of the hive usually a tree hollow or similar. Bees are very resilient and adaptable however it has reached a critical mass with the pesticides, gmo's, forced cell size, frames that cause a draft around the hive making it harder to keep heated, trucking them thousands of miles, mass breeding of queens instead of natural selection, etc etc. It is no wonder they have began dying off.

You'd think especially commercial beekeepers would get a clue when they lose up to 50% of their hives in one season. But no most of them just go on with these practices and even teach it to new beekeepers as the way to do it being so called master beekeepers...

Just let the bees do what they have been doing for millions of years take only the honey they can spare and leave them enough to over winter because that is what they are storing the honey for in the first place and we can save the bees!

i am using what is called a Warre hive now but I am going to build Perone super hive this spring which is a large hive that can accommodate up to 150 thousand bees in my backyard LOL. The larger colony is supposed to be much stronger and resistant to disease etc. The brood chamber is never touched and the bees make 10 times the honey for the same amount of bees as in 5 to ten hives.

reply to post by deometer


Great post, and thank for that video.
Awesome, and loved the beautiful flowers and the bees in the beginning!



Everyone should watch that one!

Can't help but feel this may turn out to be one of the very last nails in the coffin. Been aware of the problem of the collapsing bee colonies for a while, and the possible links to GMO. This is going to lead to dire consequences for us all. The corporations are very much aware that they risk it all. But as long as they continue to make massive profits, What's the problem, greed is good.

If the human race continues along this path. Where profit, greed, and the I want mentality blindls us. Then we will have to just accept our fate. Whatever the outcome!

If the bee was to become extinct, as Einstein predicted, there will be no turning back.

How does man kind die without honey bees? The native Americans lived here just fine without them.
The honeybee was introduced to the east coast in 1622 and 233 years later they made it to the west coast.
That's 1853! Now I'm not saying we should not be concerned but life will not end..

reply to post by burntheships


Thank you for the thread! Just finished watching an excellent documentary (though slightly dated - from 2008) on the subject:

Vanishing of the Bees

I think Queen of the Bees was made more recently. Also, here's an article that was just posted today:

Neonictinoids and Climate Change - Lethal for Bees

I'm a beekeeper. Have been for years.

It's normal to lose 10-20% of your hives, wintering. The claims of 50-70% shows an inept beekeeping company.

Bees aren't going extinct. No way. What is happening is an adaptation effect, and future generations will be more hardy.

The whole problem is that honey production is no longer a profitable endeavor. The honey producers can make more money renting out their hives to pollinate crops, and it's not unusual for them to move crops from California to pollinate the almonds, to Georgia, to pollinate the peaches. That is stress on a hive, and it introduces many pesticides that a non-transitory hive wouldn't experience.

They are insects, folks, with a lifespan of a month. The queen may live for 3-5 years, but no longer than that, and will be replaced when she is no longer laying eggs. During a good year, over 30,000 new bees will be produced by a hive, and wintering a hive takes diligence in making sure your bees have an ample surplus of honey on their hive, to eat during the winter. Commercial beekeepers often strip hives to the bare minimums, and their hives fail.

Their hives aren't failing due to CCD, but they ARE starving to death. Shame on them. A 70% failure rate wintering is ONLY bad beekeeping.

However, the facts of pesticides is true. They ARE killing the bees. Moving hives spreads the pesticides. Very bad for the overall health of your hive.

I see the fact of moving hives to pollinate crops across the country to only exacerbate the problem. We honestly need more beekeepers across the country to maintain stationary hives. The almond growers in California, instead of paying someone to move hives in during the season, should pay an individual instead, to maintain stationary hives throughout the year.

Same with Georgia. Same with the countless thousands of acres of farm land that needs pollinated. A bee can fly 10 miles while foraging. If you don't want the species to die out, get more people raising bees.

The natural genetic resistance to a local is reinforced after every generation. I cannot stress enough that bees should NOT be moved. It messes with their instincts of geolocation, and causes unnecessary hive losses.

Do you know what happens when you have a healthy hive, and you move it? All the foraging bees can't find their way home. They get lost, and die, because they can't find their home. That same bee was born in that hive, and is genetically programmed to recognize the hive it left from. When it's gone, that poor bee flies around where it's hive should have been, and dies of starvation. The more you move hives around, the more bees from that hive that die.

Who's killing the bees? The commercial beekeepers that don't understand the basics. Move a hive for profit, but that's not the way bees roll. They want a single hive, during their lives, and they want to go home to it everyday. A stress free life.

Grrr. I better quit ranting. I tend to be rather passionate about any thread about bees, and have my own beekeeping thread here. Yes, we are screwed if all the bees die, but responsible management will cure the issue. Even though pesticides are to blame for CCD, we need to also address factors that spread contaminates amongst hives.

reply to post by fifththeorem

If the bee was to become extinct, as Einstein predicted, there will be no turning back.

That is a myth, thank you very much, that Einstein every said such a thing. He was a Physicist, not a Entomologist, nor Botanist. Please read this article on Snopes.

However, the statement is true, just improperly attributed. The correction attribution would be the National Union of French Apiculture, circa 1994, I believe.

reply to post by hawkiye


Foundations and frames are for the Apiarist that is planning on extracting honey, and is VERY useful for locating your queen and inspecting for diseases. Careful management of hives is important for their health.

We use both plastic and wax foundations, the plastic being more economocal in the long run because they are re-usable and simpler to create frames. Just snap them into place. The wax foundations are time consuming, because you have to embed the support wire (we extract the surplus! 270 pounds for our fall harvest last year. Not too shabby for 6 hives.), but I do prefer wax foundations overall. It's more work, but more natural.

We also had two supers of wireless comb, which sold like hot cakes. A Dentist bought out the last of our comb honey surplus, paying 20 dollars per 3 pound jar. Why would a Dentist buy so much comb honey? It is good for your teeth! Regardless, spring harvest will be more comb.

For those of you interested in beekeeping, here's the link to my beekeeping thread.

I have a couple of videos on it, one about how to capture a hive, and another about the extraction process. Mind you the videos are from 2011, but it's still informative, and the rest of the thread is Q&As.

reply to post by Druid42

I'm a beekeeper. Have been for years.

It's normal to lose 10-20% of your hives, wintering. The claims of 50-70% shows an inept beekeeping company.

Bees aren't going extinct. No way. What is happening is an adaptation effect, and future generations will be more hardy.

How so? We've lost 50% of the bees already they certainly could go extinct if this keep ups. I doubt they will they will survive in the wild but this is a major problem. I'd certainly like more explanation on this supposed transition and how bees dying off in massive number will make them stronger?

The whole problem is that honey production is no longer a profitable endeavor. The honey producers can make more money renting out their hives to pollinate crops, and it's not unusual for them to move crops from California to pollinate the almonds, to Georgia, to pollinate the peaches. That is stress on a hive, and it introduces many pesticides that a non-transitory hive wouldn't experience.

I couldn't agree more this practice needs to stop

They are insects, folks, with a lifespan of a month. The queen may live for 3-5 years, but no longer than that, and will be replaced when she is no longer laying eggs. During a good year, over 30,000 new bees will be produced by a hive, and wintering a hive takes diligence in making sure your bees have an ample surplus of honey on their hive, to eat during the winter. Commercial beekeepers often strip hives to the bare minimums, and their hives fail.

Agree and they feed them sugar water to supplement which is void of nutrients.

Their hives aren't failing due to CCD, but they ARE starving to death. Shame on them. A 70% failure rate wintering is ONLY bad beekeeping.

I agree to a point however CCD is a major part of the problem with pesticides, commercial bee keeping practices as already mentioned it is just too much even though they are amazing adaptable creatures.

However, the facts of pesticides is true. They ARE killing the bees. Moving hives spreads the pesticides. Very bad for the overall health of your hive.

I see the fact of moving hives to pollinate crops across the country to only exacerbate the problem. We honestly need more beekeepers across the country to maintain stationary hives. The almond growers in California, instead of paying someone to move hives in during the season, should pay an individual instead, to maintain stationary hives throughout the year.

The problem is bees in fixed hives in those areas still cannot survive on the mono-crop orchards and fields. They need a larger variety of flowers and crops. The entire way we farm has to be changed. www.abovetopsecret.com... We are heading for a catastrophic break down in the food supply otherwise.

Same with Georgia. Same with the countless thousands of acres of farm land that needs pollinated. A bee can fly 10 miles while foraging. If you don't want the species to die out, get more people raising bees

The natural genetic resistance to a local is reinforced after every generation. I cannot stress enough that bees should NOT be moved. It messes with their instincts of geolocation, and causes unnecessary hive losses..

Couldn't agree more!

Do you know what happens when you have a healthy hive, and you move it? All the foraging bees can't find their way home. They get lost, and die, because they can't find their home. That same bee was born in that hive, and is genetically programmed to recognize the hive it left from. When it's gone, that poor bee flies around where it's hive should have been, and dies of starvation. The more you move hives around, the more bees from that hive that die.

I agree somewhat but it depends on when and how they are moved. The hive has to be closed up at night when all the foragers are in the hive. Then they will reorient when they are moved. But moving them all the time definitely stresses them

Who's killing the bees? The commercial beekeepers that don't understand the basics. Move a hive for profit, but that's not the way bees roll. They want a single hive, during their lives, and they want to go home to it everyday. A stress free life.

Grrr. I better quit ranting. I tend to be rather passionate about any thread about bees, and have my own beekeeping thread here. Yes, we are screwed if all the bees die, but responsible management will cure the issue. Even though pesticides are to blame for CCD, we need to also address factors that spread contaminates amongst hives.

That and pesticides. I am passionate about bees also and yes we have to change how we do things. Humans will not go extinct if we lose the bees but billions will die of starvation as food supplies dwindle to a trickle.

Good post by the way!

reply to post by Druid42

Foundations and frames are for the Apiarist that is planning on extracting honey, and is VERY useful for locating your queen and inspecting for diseases. Careful management of hives is important for their health.

This is conventional thinking yes but its wrong because it's not good for the bees its only good for the beekeeper and very hard on the bees. its not that much more work to extract honey from fixed comb hives and the practice of frames an foundation is contributing to stressing the bees making them more susceptible to diseases and CCD etc. Natural bee keepers are having none of the problems that people using conventional methods are having. The proof is in the pudding.

We use both plastic and wax foundations, the plastic being more economocal in the long run because they are re-usable and simpler to create frames. Just snap them into place. The wax foundations are time consuming, because you have to embed the support wire (we extract the surplus! 270 pounds for our fall harvest last year. Not too shabby for 6 hives.), but I do prefer wax foundations overall. It's more work, but more natural.

Man made foundation fixes the size of the cells bigger then the bees naturally make them this makes larger bees that cannot fly as far and susceptible to mites and disease etc. Bees hate plastic too. Why not consider letting the bees do it their way as they have been for millions of years instead of thinking you need to manage them? The management of them is what causes most of the problems. I can get 300 pounds of honey out of 2 natural hives. And a single Perone hive can yield up to 1000 pounds all by leaving the bees alone all year to do what they do best. You really should look into natural beekeeping,

We also had two supers of wireless comb, which sold like hot cakes. A Dentist bought out the last of our comb honey surplus, paying 20 dollars per 3 pound jar. Why would a Dentist buy so much comb honey? It is good for your teeth! Regardless, spring harvest will be more comb.

That's pretty cool. Yes raw honey from healthy hives has all sorts of benefits health wise.

Hi Druid,

Thanks for your comments and sharing you knowledge about beekeeping.

Originally posted by Druid42

However, the facts of pesticides is true. They ARE killing the bees. Moving hives spreads the pesticides. Very bad for the overall health of your hive.

Yes, they are, and CCD has been replicated, using just GMO corn syrup.
I can appreciate your thoughts about the resilence of the bees, however its not just
honeybees, also Bumblebees, which are important pollinators.

I think its conclusive that the pesticides, especially the ones transgenically
inserted into the vegetables have to go.

In any case, its good to know your having success.

reply to post by hawkiye


Wanted to say to you too Hawkiye how much I have enjoyed your posts,
and thanks for sharing your beekeeping knowledge too.

Between you and a few other beekeepers, you all have me very interested
in pursuit of this.