Masonry is not Real Enlightenment

Originally posted by EnochWasRight
Stop hiding the light under a bushel. Let it shine. Secrets are held in darkness. Light reveals what it hits. Nothing will change this.

Indeed. Because as we know from history, the great men and women of the world who have spread enlightenment ideas of liberty, freedom, and democracy all did so out in the light and with no secrecy whatsoever. Like for example the Boston Tea Party organized and executed by the group calling itself the Sons of Liberty, whose membership was during its time kept completely secret.

Oh, wait. Whoops. Thank goodness the people who actually have done great things in history recognized there is a role for secrecy.

Originally posted by moonrunner
There seems to be so much misinformation and ranting on ATS about the freemasonry that it is attracting people here to preach to the ill informed like PnezakYahakotima is here all the while claiming to not be "anti-Mason"

It's almost like you are giving us a sermon on what freemasonry is doing wrong, all based on nonsense and rumours, it's actually quite, offensive.
You clearly have no idea what freemasonry is about in the slightest, what is your point to these posts?

Is this just your way of passing time trolling an organisation you neither understand or have any interest in finding anything about?

Yep, it IS ironic that so many posters here who think they are SO informed about freemasonry and post these sermons for us to read are those who seem to - at a FUNDAMENTAL LEVEL - not understand even the basics.

Its the same story over and over, for the most part. Someone "finds Jesus" and becomes a evangelical Christian, and then everything they associated with or had knowledge about prior to that point becomes part of a vast evil that works against Christ. I dont have any qualms with evangelicals, but its **really** getting old at this point.

Originally posted by thelongjourney

Originally posted by moonrunner
There seems to be so much misinformation and ranting on ATS about the freemasonry that it is attracting people here to preach to the ill informed like PnezakYahakotima is here all the while claiming to not be "anti-Mason"

It's almost like you are giving us a sermon on what freemasonry is doing wrong, all based on nonsense and rumours, it's actually quite, offensive.
You clearly have no idea what freemasonry is about in the slightest, what is your point to these posts?

Is this just your way of passing time trolling an organisation you neither understand or have any interest in finding anything about?

Yep, it IS ironic that so many posters here who think they are SO informed about freemasonry and post these sermons for us to read are those who seem to - at a FUNDAMENTAL LEVEL - not understand even the basics.

Its the same story over and over, for the most part. Someone "finds Jesus" and becomes a evangelical Christian, and then everything they associated with or had knowledge about prior to that point becomes part of a vast evil that works against Christ. I dont have any qualms with evangelicals, but its **really** getting old at this point.

edit on 20-1-2013 by thelongjourney because: (no reason given)

Jesus still heals the blind and deaf.
Masonry and it's fruit are then discerned differently and in His light of Truth.
The biggest hindrance to Masonry is active Faith in Christ and wisdom and understanding from Our Creator. In fact, this can clearly be seen as we see your symbology stamped all over the world today as your influence comes out in the open - a situation that could not have arisen unless your organisations's constant works to destroy the power of the saints hadn't been so effective.
Unlike Freemasonry's "god", our God does not lie. He is leading us to understand the times and to lean on His promises and to do His will. And that will does include snatching branches from the fire, the millions upon millions who unknowingly hold esoteric beliefs taught to them by Masonic control in film, tv and media. Just as in the days of Christ in Judea, the Masons like the Jews know how to gain and maintain control over the populace - by making their converts twice the children of hell.

reply to post by WhoKnows100


Why do people whom share the same view as yourself insist that the God you believe in is different to each masons God, yet as a mason I can believe that the God that you believe in, is the SAME as mine.

Riddle me that.

Originally posted by WhoKnows100
Jesus still heals the blind and deaf.
Masonry and it's fruit are then discerned differently and in His light of Truth.
The biggest hindrance to Masonry is active Faith in Christ and wisdom and understanding from Our Creator. In fact, this can clearly be seen as we see your symbology stamped all over the world today as your influence comes out in the open - a situation that could not have arisen unless your organisations's constant works to destroy the power of the saints hadn't been so effective.
Unlike Freemasonry's "god", our God does not lie. He is leading us to understand the times and to lean on His promises and to do His will. And that will does include snatching branches from the fire, the millions upon millions who unknowingly hold esoteric beliefs taught to them by Masonic control in film, tv and media. Just as in the days of Christ in Judea, the Masons like the Jews know how to gain and maintain control over the populace - by making their converts twice the children of hell.

This is the exact thing I am talking about. An evangelical pompously and self-righteously talking about something he/she knows nothing about. You see Satan in everything you don't understand, and speak with an aura of authority you do not have. In doing so you spend so much time attacking people that are Christian that all you do is provide an example to all of how to act as un-Christ like as possible.

I am a Christian. Most masons I know, in fact, are Christian. Freemasony strengthen the masons belief in whatever religion he believes in - for Christians, it makes their faith stronger. There is no freemasonry symbolism "stamped" around the world, thats your need to find a boogieman in the shadows. There is no freemasonry "god."

However, I will say, as a Christian, that your God is not my God. The Christ of the Bible teaches hope and charity. You follow some other God, who teaches hatred, bigotry, and ignorance. The only thing we have in common is that you think you are a Christian, when in reality people like you are an anathema to everything Jesus Christ taught.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

Oh, don't play that my fraternity is better than yours game. Crowley can have his opinion, but he was not even a real Freemason so his opinion is irrelevant in regards to a comparison of the OTO and Freemasonry.

Freemasonry imparts wisdom on those are ready to receive it.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

You're an expert in what creates a behavior problem? Where'd you get your Psychology degree?

Where were my fellow "brothers" in all of this? Nowhere to be found. I received no help or guidance from anyone who pretended to accept and honor me in the rituals, initiations, and meetings of my Order. Same goes for Masonry, by the way. They don't stick around and help you during your struggle. They blackball you and/or blacklist you, and then cut you off from all further communication. Brotherhood? I thought brothers were asposed ta hug?!

You cannot speak for what Freemasons would or would not do. I've received plenty help from the Brethren when I asked for it.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

Trying to better yourself is tyrannical?! LOL

You just need to be, and to know that God accepts you. God accepts Masons, even though they unknowingly bow to a false god, God accepts the false god himself.

As if you really know who each and every Mason worships.

You really don't know what Freemasonry is about and how we instruct.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

Freemasonry isn't about fear.

"Beat him until he is willing" should be the Masonic motto.... because it is, in reality.

Your interpretation only, not reality

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

So we shouldn't try to cure anything? You seem to have a slothful and slightly barbaric mindset when it comes to God and morality.

There's nothing inherently wrong with secrecy.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

Please name these "victims" of Masonry? Silly rabbit.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

Vampire god?

Lucifer was only a disgraced Babylonian king.

Your religious fanaticism is duly noted.

You call us all sorts of names like "gateway to insanity" and "virus", but you claim to not be an anti-Mason...

You are an anti-Mason. I don't care if you have a friend who is a Mason, you're an anti-Mason.

...perhaps the Masonic Tradition both here on Earth and in the Etheric after-death realms, could cease its constant judgment of souls as if it were their fault they were inept.

What are you talking about? What judgment of souls?

Magic is not forbidden by Christ. He Himself did many magical acts

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

Just because you don't like the culture, doesn't mean its a virus. Such reckless demonization.

If anything of your post, I can say you sound like a false prophet.

How as a non-member have you gone any "Masonic journey", figurative or not. Wizards?! Wow.

reply to post by mykingdomforthetruth

No it's not.

reply to post by indigothefish

Apparently the definition of truth has changed from the "state of being true" and is the total opposite.

I have not just said, "take my word" on anything. I have posted plenty of evidence to counter the lies posted by the anti-Masons.

Why are you against the congregation of people?

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

Freemasonry is not indifferent to evil.

reply to post by WhoKnows100

Many Freemasons believe in Christ as I do, but a Christian faith is not required to join Freemasonry in America. Freemasonry isn't anti-Christianity and the Templar Orders of the York Rite are very Christian. Please do not insult our intelligence by calling us some anti-Christ or NWO organization

reply to post by EnochWasRight


not knowledge, but the knowledge of good and evil.

do you really want knowledge of what it is like to throw another human being into an oven.

you can have knowledge of how to make a rifle, but without the knowledge of evil it wouldn't occur to you to use it against another human being.

there's a big difference.

but since we know the knowledge of evil, it is very hard to think of a world, where a rifle can't be used against another human being, that is where free will comes in.

Originally posted by randomname
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

not knowledge, but the knowledge of good and evil.

do you really want knowledge of what it is like to throw another human being into an oven.

you can have knowledge of how to make a rifle, but without the knowledge of evil it wouldn't occur to you to use it against another human being.

there's a big difference.

but since we know the knowledge of evil, it is very hard to think of a world, where a rifle can't be used against another human being, that is where free will comes in.

edit on 20-1-2013 by randomname because: (no reason given)

I agree somewhat. Both good and evil are intent and not knowledge. Knowledge can never be evil. Intent is intention by design. Intention can produce rotten fruit. This is the dilemma we find ourselves in today. Our world is built on rotten fruit. The fruit itself is neither good or evil, just as the gun, by itself, is neither good or evil. God's will is to give and receive only. When evil comes into the heart, the will to take overrides the will to give.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus
reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

 

So you found Jesus and are happy to tell us.

is jesus a mushroom?

in freemasonry, someone has something on everyone (especially those in the upper echelons).

you either go with it and prosper, or resist and lose everything.

murder, abuse etc. is most difficult on the first occasion. after that....well.


this is not the way to go. if you were alone and a stranger in a strange land, you would yearn
to meet someone who spoke the same language as you, regardless of sex/colour/looks/personality.

we are all strangers in strange lands. we are all equally yearning.
we are all equally deserving.

face yourself. forgive yourself.

go from there.

peace.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima


Aww, this thread is like a little Fanatical Christian love in. Almost like a group of people on the verge of either starting or joining the Branch Dividians.

I think the OP is a bit confused. It just seems a bit wrong to give advice to a group you have never been a part of.

Just our of curiosity, why aren't you harping on the OTO? Aren't they just as misguided as masons since you claim they are like Masonry on steroids? Oh well, another bad pecan in the nut bowl of life.

Yes, the OTO is the exact same thing as masonry, although a bit more blatant.

I have never officially parted from them, I guess. Laziness? Probably.

I still get the Agape newsletters every couple of months.

Will my soul be damned? Nah.

It's not that important, I guess.

Do what you want. No one can make you see anything you won't see on your own.

reply to post by OutonaLimb


To masons (in the general term referring to all esoteric initiatory bodies), Jesus might be a mushroom CLOUD.

They've got the gun to their own heads, and we're all being taken for a death ride with them.

We all die, but I don't want to die like that.

Why is it that anti-masons and fundamentalist religious fanatics never start their posts with:
"In my opinion...,"?

It would lead to discussions that are just so much more interesting.

reply to post by Saurus


In my opinion, unless one has been a mason, they know not what form of enlightenment, or illumination they may have...




Besides, the fraternity is not enlightenment its self, but more of a trade school for building the foundation. Masonry is the corner stone to which one builds upon.

And people listen to you, and you are a success at what you do, and that's wonderful...

But Jesus, man.... look at yourself. You're like one big schizoid hive mind.

Opinions are like anuses, as they say...

Transcend opinions.

At the very end of the Matrix Trilogy, the Grand Architect was even wrong...

He had been convinced that the destruction of Zion would repeat, perhaps endlessly, and he had grown rather disinterested and callous.... rather convinced of his own omnipotence....

Think about that one...

Originally posted by PnezakYahakotima
At the very end of the Matrix Trilogy, the Grand Architect was even wrong...

Exactly!

Why, then, do anti-masons and fundamental religious fanatics pass their opinions off as fact?

P.S. Look at my signature. It says: "Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it."

The central theme of your signature seems to be one of mistrust.

I've trusted a lot of horrible people, and will probably continue to do so.

Why? Because I'm gullible, maybe.... or perhaps I want to see the best in people.

Gullible is probably the same thing. But lies are silly. I trust horrible people because they are silly.

This.... for some reason doesn't fit with the rest of what I'm gunna say.....

Oh okay I get what I wrote....

There is no lie or relative truth which will bring about the most important changes.

Why do you not trust someone who claims the truth?

Do you want to stay in a world ordered by chaos?

Do you want the lid pulled over your eyes forever, so you can go on believing in relative truths and trying to avoid nihilism?

You've heard of Hegelian dialectic before, right?

That's one of the principles of Freemasonry.

The checkered floor meaning the interplay between light and darkness.

It has occurred to me that this seeming dialectic, light versus dark presided over by a metaphorical worshipful master, the principle of three..... is a contrived one. Mimicking God, but not actually God.... and that's why the dialectic falls apart into pure chaos at the end. That's why there's always a limit, and then it all destroys itself. It's not eternal. It is entirely mortal, afraid of its own limits, entirely blind to its own demise, and therefore cannot be capable of being a rational system of ordered living.

Freemasonry is a contrived dialectic. That's what I'm saying.

Originally posted by PnezakYahakotima

Freemasonry is a contrived dialectic. That's what I'm saying.

Call it what you will, clearly your mind is made up.

I just want to point out, that others, may see it more as an inspirational, recreation.

It may not be authentic, if that is what your getting at, but for those who have been apart of it. It is very real.

The traditions of that fraternity, at least in the USofA, goes all the way back to the Founding, and includes some of the Fathers. It is steeped in American history, whether you and others like it, or not.

So you're not of the opinion that Masonry is anything other than a traditional fraternity?