Masonry is not Real Enlightenment

reply to post by mykingdomforthetruth


I could buy that.....

Although, like you said.... perhaps the meaning gets lost over time....

If you had a choice and were properly informed, I doubt anyone on Earth would choose the Devil unless he was already somewhat possessed by something prior....

reply to post by Onewhoknowsjesus


You know.... there's not much more that needs to be said, is there?

Maybe there is just a little more...

But that's probably hard to say.

But what is wrong with being an animal?

My dog is an animal... and she isn't going to overcome her animal nature...

So is that 100 percent accurate?

Do we NEED to do much of anything but be simple minded?

Nothing but true self-discovery is in fact true enlightenment.

Really all I've done here is opened up an argument between those who are for one thing and against it, like always.

Originally posted by PnezakYahakotima
Masons... you are being misled. All esotericists, you are being misled.

Definitely the truth.

Now, if you understand that then why do you state so openly your faith in 'god'? You should understand enough that the bible is full of THEIR symbolism.. So much so to provide evidence that the Abrahamic religions are ENTIRELY THEIR CREATION! In my opinion you need to break off that, because in the end it connects you to the manipulation without your knowledge..

I find it funny when Masons come here to post how all this information is incorrect. In a way it's like they are saying "it's a secret society and I cannot tell you anything about it unless you become a member, but none of what's stated here is true". How very convincing, I look forward to the day Masonry is no longer a 'secret' towards the entire masses.

reply to post by indigothefish


God is kind of a haughty name for what I refer to as God.

The symbolism of the Trinity is quite solid....

But it's so simple and ordinary that people might not even recognize or LIKE it if they experienced God

People like to be complicated.

They complicate and distort a very simple concept. Something simple, but not nihilistic or self-centered.

They turn it into something complicated with what amounts to a "gate with no door", a very simple geometric pattern... with seemingly no way out.

It might matter as to the order in which these things occur.

The symbolism of Jahbulon.... it suggests a spider's web with a monster in the center....

The symbolism of the spider and the spider's web also suggests that the web "catches" you in it, and there's no escape.

Now.... mykingdomforthetruth and others who can definitely make a convincing argument as to the indifference of Masonry towards good or evil.... represented by the chessboard floor tiles

The "choice" between good or evil....

Like I said before.... from darkness into light, right?

You choose where you wish to be and what you wish to become?

Free Will...

However, having pondered a bit on your response, kingdom, I must repeat that both seem to me like a lie.

Ultimate Good... does it choose sides?

Or is that where Masonry has its limits?

Choose or die?

Choose between the right or the left?

It seems as though that is confusing the natural forces of nature with the human psyche....

In nature, things don't choose sides.... life gives way to death in a perpetual and consistent flow....

The desire to "help" VS the desire to "hurt".... it's all still desire. It's all self-aggrandizing, just in two opposing directions. They don't intermix and "dance". They just butt heads and break each other's toys.

This seems to be the erroneous dialectic happening within the inner philosophy of Freemasonry and other esoteric schools....

Is that Man can intentionally mimick God.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima


In response to that I would say that it is masonry's openly stated numer one requirement in order to join "Belief in a single god" "higher power" or as they call it, I believe, 'the architect'.. Not only can we find the same alchemical evidences linking masonry to these concepts but we find that all alchemical/esoteric/mystery school were entirely influenced by mason members to begin with. In conclusion, it is the primary focus here to mention the prevalent desire not to include anyone in any higher discussion who does not accept a higher power, an all-knowing, being that is more powerful than the individual and whose will comes first and the individual's will comes second - if that is not the death of the free ego / false enlightenment then I don't know what is!

Thanks for sharing this thread, and I did not mean to come off argumentative, Peace

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

If Love WAS the only law (as Thelema claims it stands for), then I guess you could call that a law.... a loose kind of one....

Again, the mirror holds the reflection. Thelma is based on , 'do what thou wilt.' Jesus said, do unto others. Each claims this to be the whole of the law. To know, test it against the will to give and receive over the will to take for self. Thelma fails the test, as do all others that are based on the reflection of truth. We are in an image of God. As such, we are backwards.

1 Corinthians 13

12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is Love.

How does God see Himself? In our image. Same goes for us. Light reveals what it hits. Light cannot be seen.

Originally posted by Onewhoknowsjesus
Nothing but true self-discovery is in fact true enlightenment.

Light is not seen. It only reveals what it hits. We have the power to alter the reflection back to God.

There seems to be so much misinformation and ranting on ATS about the freemasonry that it is attracting people here to preach to the ill informed like PnezakYahakotima is here all the while claiming to not be "anti-Mason"

It's almost like you are giving us a sermon on what freemasonry is doing wrong, all based on nonsense and rumours, it's actually quite, offensive.
You clearly have no idea what freemasonry is about in the slightest, what is your point to these posts?

Is this just your way of passing time trolling an organisation you neither understand or have any interest in finding anything about?

Originally posted by indigothefish
reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

 

In response to that I would say that it is masonry's openly stated numer one requirement in order to join "Belief in a single god" "higher power" or as they call it, I believe, 'the architect'.. Not only can we find the same alchemical evidences linking masonry to these concepts but we find that all alchemical/esoteric/mystery school were entirely influenced by mason members to begin with. In conclusion, it is the primary focus here to mention the prevalent desire not to include anyone in any higher discussion who does not accept a higher power, an all-knowing, being that is more powerful than the individual and whose will comes first and the individual's will comes second - if that is not the death of the free ego / false enlightenment then I don't know what is!

Thanks for sharing this thread, and I did not mean to come off argumentative, Peace

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The book of Enoch states that God taught the partial mystery to Angels, who in turn taught to mankind. It is still partial. Masons are trying to rediscover the lost word, yet it is revealed already in Christ. Their hatred of this fact blinds them to the truth of it.

Christ is The WORD.

Originally posted by moonrunner
There seems to be so much misinformation and ranting on ATS about the freemasonry that it is attracting people here to preach to the ill informed like PnezakYahakotima is here all the while claiming to not be "anti-Mason"

It's almost like you are giving us a sermon on what freemasonry is doing wrong, all based on nonsense and rumours, it's actually quite, offensive.
You clearly have no idea what freemasonry is about in the slightest, what is your point to these posts?

Is this just your way of passing time trolling an organisation you neither understand or have any interest in finding anything about?

Stop hiding the light under a bushel. Let it shine. Secrets are held in darkness. Light reveals what it hits. Nothing will change this.

reply to post by indigothefish


That's true. It's substantially better, in my opinion, to be agnostic.... and simply state that one doesn't know, rather than contriving or brainwashing yourself into the perception of a god who may not really be there...

At least that's more honest. You can't control anyone you don't give false hopes to.

Although, that's not to say there isn't a profound Presence sustaining and maintaining the continuance of life and the existence within which life moves has its being...

reply to post by indigothefish


And no you just came off as having an opinion which is challenging and seemingly from an honest perspective.

Keeps us all honest.

Which is what disturbs me about Freemasonry, again.... is their insistence that they are not dishonest or misleading, or even unawares as to what their own philosophy means. They all insist like they know for sure...

No room for self-reflection, it seems.

"Am I wrong, perhaps?"

That's weird, not to question yourself and your belief structures at all...

Enoch... you seem to be a Stander Within the Presence....

I'd like to confer with you deeper sometime.

Light cannot be seen.... that is solid enough for me.

faith is red, hope is blue, and Love is Invisible Light.

All within the Comfy Holy Kingdom of the Living God.

Good stuff, enoch...

I just wanna snuggle up in God sometimes and go to sleep.

There are two types of 'service' 1. To yourself, feeding the ego. 2. To others, freeing you from ego.

Being in service to all is not a bad thing, it actually allows you to see others as being just as important as you consider yourself to be.
When we talk of ego what are we referring to? If it is the sense of self identity then holding onto it will cause nothing but trauma, especially when our time here draws to a close as we will be stripped back to our true nature, all the things we identify ourselves to be 'ego' will go. We will no longer be a husband, son, father, worker, friend, lover etc as they are things of this world and will no longer be when we pass.

During the death process we cling on to those things that we associate with ego and the pain of separation is extremely traumatic.

Freemasonry is not a religion, I am Buddhist, that is my religion - my mode of transport so to speak, freemasonry allows me to pimp my ride.

But what do I know? I am only a MM and have not been in the fraternity long, so my knowledge is limited and there are many non masons whose knowledge is greater......... Wait a sec...... Eve tempted by knowledge and non masons have more than masons...... Hmmmm the maths don't add up there.

Masonry is not "real" enlightenment? How fascinating, since I don't know of any mason who has claimed that it was enlightenment to begin with.

Originally posted by PnezakYahakotima
First off... I am not anti-Mason (as in the people themselves. I still have at least one Mason friend.). I am also still officially a member of the OTO, a body which indeed uses much of the same symbolism as Freemasonry. Crowley himself HAS INDEED stated basically that any member of the OTO is equal in degree to that of a Freemason. You might have to actually read Crowley in depth to know that. You might also have to understand the symbolism a little better to see that it doesn't really matter anyways, as long as the symbolism is congruent. The OTO might as well be called a much more raw version of Freemasonry. It gets to the point, rather than dancing around polity for the sake of appealing to the masses.

The OTO is not freemasonry, and bears little real semblance to freemasonry except at the most surface level. Crowley would of course state that any member of OTO was "equal in degree" to a Freemason - he came up with the OTO. But he was not a real freemason, so his opinion doesn't really matter. And if you truly believe that OTO is a "more raw" version of freemasonry, then you actually haven't conducted any real study of masonic philosophy.

Originally posted by PnezakYahakotima
The problem lies in this persistent worship of what they call "knowledge". The simple fact is that these types of groups, esoterically obvious or not, encourage the accumulation and use of knowledge, and also encourage what they deceptively refer to as "self-discipline". Knowledge is power, and we all know this to be true. Truly and genuinely good people can accumulate knowledge and hope to use it for good purposes, but they will always be out-done by others who would be willing to do Anything to achieve their goals, no matter what means to an end. Those personality types who would accumulate knowledge solely for the purpose of gaining power and influence over others no matter the cost are referred to as sociopathic/psychopathic. Unfortunately in a knowledge/power dominated society, those personality types ALWAYS win.... in the relative short-run.

Well the problem with all this is there is no worship of anything in freemasonry, including "knowledge." Really we need to go no further in debunking your post, as your initial position bears no resemblance to reality when it comes to actual masonic philosophy.