Feminism & The Downfall Of The Traditional Family

InTheLight
I'm not going to play Dear Abby here, sorry, but since I don't have her version of events, I would be unable, in any event, to offer a fair opinion. The only reason I'm posting on this thread is to dispel the misguided notion that feminism is solely responsible for the downfall of the traditional marriage. I believe I have posted studies and information as to some of the factors that feed into this phenomenon and societal trendf, although I left out religion (a biggie).

Action expresses priorities. Mahatma Gandhi

edit on 12-11-2013 by InTheLight because: (no reason given)

What is to know InTheLight??

The question I am asking is ..

Do I have a higher unwritten social and moral obligation to "Flashdance" her through her water heater problems..with my private property..my labor, knowledge of how to do it, and also my monies...which are also my property. She has spent most of her money supporting her daughter and grandchildren for the last year. There is not much safety net remaining now.


Do I have such a higher unwritten moral and ethical obligation with my private property that I must allow her needs to default through at my RISK??? Even though I am also at the same time working 12 hour nights!!



It is that simple. You see!!??


Oh..and while I am at it..I dont really believe that feminism is soley responsible for the downfall of traditional marriage. But feminism has very heavily contributed to it over the years. And they have contributed to it in a manner which their positions are false but have alot of people..male and female deceived.

Todays younger women are not all buying into alot of the older feminist positions.

I became surprised at this when I began some years back to detect that there were a noticeable number of women who were deciding to stay home and raise their children.

They had seen what happened to themselves and their mothers. That the feminist positions had not made their mothers satisfied and happy. That their mothers were growing olde alone and unhappy...not fulfilled by the feminist positions.

When I began to sense this I was a bit surprise after years of the standard feminist drivel.



What alarms me is this business of how they have now morphed feminism, racism, homosexuality and now anti christianity into one program. They have obviously become the thing that they used to detest and speechify against.

And Government is doing this and telling that it is they and their social handlers who have been running all of these socailist groups for and towards a direction.

They have used and misused these cloistered groups towards a goal and in a manner that these groups could be protected from the free market of ideas and thought.

It is obvious to me that their goal is the social, moral, and ethical destruction of western civilization...by chaos principles.

Divide and Conquer...by chaos.

I do not believe these groups have any idea that they are being used and misused towards this chaotic goal. I believe that they are only looking at their individual programs and someone wants it to continue this way.

Gotta make haste now.
Thanks for your post,
Orangetom

orangetom1999

InTheLight
I'm not going to play Dear Abby here, sorry, but since I don't have her version of events, I would be unable, in any event, to offer a fair opinion. The only reason I'm posting on this thread is to dispel the misguided notion that feminism is solely responsible for the downfall of the traditional marriage. I believe I have posted studies and information as to some of the factors that feed into this phenomenon and societal trendf, although I left out religion (a biggie).

Action expresses priorities. Mahatma Gandhi

edit on 12-11-2013 by InTheLight because: (no reason given)

What is to know InTheLight??

The question I am asking is ..

Do I have a higher unwritten social and moral obligation to "Flashdance" her through her water heater problems..with my private property..my labor, knowledge of how to do it, and also my monies...which are also my property. She has spent most of her money supporting her daughter and grandchildren for the last year. There is not much safety net remaining now.


Do I have such a higher unwritten moral and ethical obligation with my private property that I must allow her needs to default through at my RISK??? Even though I am also at the same time working 12 hour nights!!



It is that simple. You see!!??


Oh..and while I am at it..I dont really believe that feminism is soley responsible for the downfall of traditional marriage. But feminism has very heavily contributed to it over the years. And they have contributed to it in a manner which their positions are false but have alot of people..male and female deceived.

Todays younger women are not all buying into alot of the older feminist positions.

I became surprised at this when I began some years back to detect that there were a noticeable number of women who were deciding to stay home and raise their children.

They had seen what happened to themselves and their mothers. That the feminist positions had not made their mothers satisfied and happy. That their mothers were growing olde alone and unhappy...not fulfilled by the feminist positions.

When I began to sense this I was a bit surprise after years of the standard feminist drivel.



What alarms me is this business of how they have now morphed feminism, racism, homosexuality and now anti christianity into one program. They have obviously become the thing that they used to detest and speechify against.

And Government is doing this and telling that it is they and their social handlers who have been running all of these socailist groups for and towards a direction.

They have used and misused these cloistered groups towards a goal and in a manner that these groups could be protected from the free market of ideas and thought.

It is obvious to me that their goal is the social, moral, and ethical destruction of western civilization...by chaos principles.

Divide and Conquer...by chaos.

I do not believe these groups have any idea that they are being used and misused towards this chaotic goal. I believe that they are only looking at their individual programs and someone wants it to continue this way.

Gotta make haste now.
Thanks for your post,
Orangetom

You need to ask her that question, not a stranger on a forum. Good luck with that.

InTheLight,

That will not be happening as of this morning when I got off work I received a phone call telling me to not bother with helping her.

I got the message. No problem.

While I understand her desire to stand by her family..I do not approve of the method or rationale by which she chooses to accomplish this. The unwritten social sex rules so to speak.

I will not be going back there..even if she changes her mind down the road..which I doubt. She will most likely find someone more programmable...who has a greater desire to run touchdowns.

Gotta make haste now for another long shift,

Thanks,
Orangetom

orangetom1999
InTheLight,

That will not be happening as of this morning when I got off work I received a phone call telling me to not bother with helping her.

I got the message. No problem.

While I understand her desire to stand by her family..I do not approve of the method or rationale by which she chooses to accomplish this. The unwritten social sex rules so to speak.

I will not be going back there..even if she changes her mind down the road..which I doubt. She will most likely find someone more programmable...who has a greater desire to run touchdowns.

Gotta make haste now for another long shift,

Thanks,
Orangetom

I suppose she looked to you as a friend to help and when you were put to the test, you failed.

InTheLight,

I suppose she looked to you as a friend to help and when you were put to the test, you failed.

LOL LOL LOL...surely you jest here InTheLight. THis is humor correct??



I am working 12 hours shifts from 6pm to 6am. I do not work the same schedules for which so many take for granted as day walkers. I am not a daywalker.

Her emergency does not constitute an emergency on my part. This would be inequality would it not?? It would also make my nights at work hazardous to myself and my coworkers when I am running short on sleep and rest.

You see...I am going to be moving a $400,000 tool into place tonight with a crane..following the instructions of one of my co workers into a hole into which I cannot see.but we must work together very closely. This is not a tool one gets at Auto Zone or Home Depot when you need a replacement. It is a one of a kind tool. Only one company manufacturers this tool.
She will not be thinking of this with her..."Emergency." This is why my rest and sleep are important.

None of this inconvenience and emotional devastation on her part is being factored in ..next to the devastation I would be suffering when I am working both schedules to sacrifice for her and the children. Oh..and what about the lack of emotional fulfillment I would also be sacrificing as well from working both schedules?? Good grief..does Dr PHil ever talk about this?? How about Oprah?? Or is only one side ever mentioned??

Remember what I keep trying to tell you...some people are just more socially expendable and disposable?? Because of social roles. Because of friendship. Remember that?? And no one is going to see what we do.

Who is failing who here?? I think equality for one is failing here InTheLIght. This equality stuff sounds so good until one gets boxed into a corner by circumstance to which one is not knowledgeable or experienced. I've been getting at that as well.



I actually never thought of this happening in this manner. I thought it would be more from an auto failing/breakdown as both of the women there are very fast food lane type people. Always going ..always burning up resources. Like mother like daughter.
Just goes to show you...Of mice and men ..and all that stuff.

I have to get ready for another 12 hour shift again. Lots to do before shoving off.

Thanks for your post,
Orangetom

reply to post by orangetom1999


So these 12 hours shifts go on for how many days straight? Then you get a few days off inbetween, right?

InTheLight

So these 12 hours shifts go on for how many days straight? Then you get a few days off inbetween, right?

Wow!! Must make haste here once again. It was a long one last night and going to be so again tonight. I will be once again going in at 6pm only to get off Saturday morning at 6am.

You are losing me here InTheLight. Your chain of reason escapes me on this. Must make haste now and get a few things sorted out before once again shoving off.

I wont be getting much time off. I will be going over to my elderly parents home on Saturday and raking up their leaves out from under their bushes and then picking up said leaves with the bagging lawnmower..then bagging them to my pick up truck.

After that I have repairs and such around here. Laundry to do..et al. I wont be getting much time off. There is lots to do and no one else to help with it. No one to "Rescue or Flashdance" me through my difficulties.
Somewhere in here there is to be found time for sleep..and rest.

Hence you are losing me in your line of thought.

Gotta make haste once again.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Some thoughts on modern marriages...from the book 'Marriage Confidential'.

Does this book forget a sixth type of marriage?

Are things always wedded bliss? Probably not, but sometimes people get married and decide to work on things because they love the other person (not for the kids, because they’re afraid of being alone, and not because they can save some money). And once in a while, we hear that can work out well.

www.signature9.com...

Yes, this book does forget about that particular type of marriage, perhaps because like most people, the author wants to get her own particular beliefs across without taking all the facts into account.

Been Busy here since the weekend with repairs and also the 12 hour schedule.

Helped my parents with their yard work. This turned out to be a bigger job than I had anticipated and I broke it up into two days but managed to finish and haul off the leaves.
Also did a couple of smaller repairs for them.

Though I did the same here at this home..I did not get to far off my sleep schedule and spent a good portion of the rest of the day and evening sleeping...then up in the middle of the night.

But I did manage to get in a couple of hours at the local gun club trying out some reloads I had made...in the wee hours of the morning.

Other than that ..close to home and doing stuff around here.


Thinking about that article InTheLight...I thought it strange.

I say that because the Author is comparing our lives as a yardstick to these people...who have some claim to fame. I am not interested in measuring my success or failure by these peoples lives.

Some of them live what I call a "Camelot or Mists of Avalon" type life. And they cannot make it??? I think they have it to good..they have to mess it up.

Most of us do not live that kind of life.

I find this kind of thing insulting. Same thing when going through the checkout stands and being bombarded by the lives of the Hollywood people. I am not at all interested in how they do or do not make it. Hence the pulps do not interest me. Same thing with Cosmo magazine and others of that ilk.

I think the author has issues.

Gotta get ready to shove off again,
Thanks for your post,

Orangetom

reply to post by orangetom1999


Yes, so the realization for us all here might be that each couple should define their union and it's obligations and commitment to their very particular needs and not follow anyone else's (or the media's) ideas of how it should be.

InTheLight
reply to post by orangetom1999

 

Yes, so the realization for us all here might be that each couple should define their union and it's obligations and commitment to their very particular needs and not follow anyone else's (or the media's) ideas of how it should be.

InTheLight,

Remember what I stated in one of my early posts about my Friend across the river. Of him and his situation I stated..

As my friend across the river told me when we were comparing notes on women one day...it was quite profound the way he phrased it.

His wife had passed away and he was back on the marketplace.

What he told me was that he discovered what so many women were coming over to his house and for what they were looking. They were looking at his house, swimming pool..land etc etc et al...looking for what they could get access to for themselves and their children. They were not looking at what was missing from his life and what he needed from them...Peace..not just Piece.

Piece was the tool they were willing to use and misuse to keep him blindsided..while leading him down the road to the altar and access to property for them and their children without work and without RISKS.

Now look carefully at what you have posted above and then look at what my friend has declared about most of the women he knows.

A smart man and woman looks at the partner to see what is missing from their lives and as to how they can fulfill that need...children or not. Not at what their own needs are and how their partner can be made to fulfill and take on more RISK to help them fulfill their needs, often at great RISK.

In most relationships I have seen the woman dictates the needs and when the going gets tough or even under good times..dictates through the children..through the media...through any and everything by which she has been merchandized ...the male by default must needs run the touchdowns. This is today equality. I dont think so.


A very interesting thing happened the other night in our crew at work. I was a bit astonished again at the tenor of what Mark stated openly in front of the crew. I could not resist my reply though I still believe it went over his head..way over..because of sports condition to run touchdowns..and his wifes conditioning to take advantage of his willingness and ignorance to run touchdowns.

Here from page 22 concerning Mark,

Now Mark..a fellow in my crew..his wife does not work...
But he feels that he has to run her programs to please her..consisting of doing and taking care of the children and doing stuff for his mother in law..and his wife too...In addition to his 12 hour shift. What he does not get ..is a good amount of sleep. His wife does not change her hours..but he does..even if it means lack of sleep. He runs her expected programs in addition to his programs. He adapts to her and the childrens needs...but she does not change her program..and take on his traditional roles...but he takes on her roles.
You see In THe Light..the problem with feminism..is that the males were expected even demanded that they take on so many more traditional female roles..but the females were not willing to take on more traditional male roles. What the females wanted to do is have time for more female stuff.
The males felt that more was expected of them but more was not given to them. Many males now understand that his false paradigm is what passed for equality...it was validity..not truth.

Now Mark finally declared in front of the crew, and to my astonishment, that his wife finally realized the other day ...that he did not get much sleep. Wow!! Astonishing ....Truely Astonishing. An Enchanted moment..a moment of clarity.
His woman has taken 6 to 8 weeks of this 12 hour shifts on Mark's part and spending the monies he earns ..only now to realize he does not get that much sleep.

What world is she living in?? The orange housewives...The Long Island Medium. Whatever it is she is not living in his world...while she spends the monies he earns and often at great RISKS.

His settings on his dial have until now gone unseen..unnoticed..unheard by todays modern intelligent, enlightened, informed woman!! 6 to 8 weeks. What would happen to todays woman working this kind of schedule were this to happen to her???

I looked over at Mark and stated..."Its great to be able to run touchdowns ..is it not??" "Makes you feel like you slayed the dragon..yes!!"

"Keep on running touchdowns with a public school education."

Now Mark hates it when I use the term "Public Education..have you been to public school??"

By Public School education...I am referring to a television and movie edudcation based on instant gratification/entitlement beliefs...ie..feminism. Mark is very feminine..he is sensitive to his woman though it takes her 6 to 8 weeks to catch on to his plight. I love this kind of equality. Not really!! I loath this kind of ignorance on both of their parts.

I'll keep reminding him to continue to run touchdowns. Also to be sure to keep running touchdowns by generous insurance if he passes on first. But never ask himself what is wrong or unequal about this game. Is it even worth playing when the deafult setting is that he comes in last for six or eight weeks...while taking first place...RISKS.

However ..it is His home situation..he is responsible for it and reaps the rewards or deficits.

But Mark illustrates exactly what it is for which I have been describing for so many pages. However..was a bit astonished that he did not think it through before declaring openly to the crew what a domesticated feminized male he was with the RISKS for which he was taken for granted/defaulted that all this was his social moral obligation.
He has no Idea that he has victimized himself and it has taken his woman 6 to 8 weeks to see it. She is not looking out for his needs as she throws more stuff in the wagon for him to pull, in addition to his working 12 hour shifts.
She has made him expendable and disposable...by default. And he has contributed to it in ignorance..by sports conditioning.

Gotta make haste once again.

Orangtom

Orangetom, once again you have missed my message and go back to the same old rhetoric or misguided beliefs, as well as citing examples that don't address the real issues. But, hey, if you need to cling onto to those misguided beliefs and continually fail at relationships and blame all women, then get ready for a long-term relationship of one (just you).

As for this thread which is just a blaming and generalization game.

Respect, like trust, is a two-way street. If you're not willing to give it, then you definitely don't deserve it.

and

In a relationship it's not 50/50 percent, it's 100/100 percent.

InTheLight
Orangetom, once again you have missed my message and go back to the same old rhetoric or misguided beliefs, as well as citing examples that don't address the real issues. But, hey, if you need to cling onto to those misguided beliefs and continually fail at relationships and blame all women, then get ready for a long-term relationship of one (just you).

As for this thread which is just a blaming and generalization game.

Respect, like trust, is a two-way street. If you're not willing to give it, then you definitely don't deserve it.

and

In a relationship it's not 50/50 percent, it's 100/100 percent.

Actually InTheLight..Mark's situation is quite specific and not general. So too was my friend across the river. To him it was quite specific and not general. Not misguided but real.

Marks situation is quite real and specific ..not general.. when he makes it clear that he is coming in second or third place while running several shifts and going short on sleep and rest.
However what surprises me is that he does not see the pattern of what is happening. He "tries out" for approval..even with his life and safety...also with the lives and safety of those with whom he works...takes RISK.

This is what I am getting at with "Sports Conditioning " to run touchdowns without thinking about the real nature of the game being played.

As I keep stating by real examples..the male is the most expendable and disposable sex out here.

Even our military is getting on this Expendability and Disposability bandwagon with guilt programming and guilt conditioning of the same variety the womens groups and others have used for years now

www.theblaze.com...
It gets predictable and wolfie InTheLight..and people are beginning to catch on to it...with disgust.

It is the same olde tired one liners about a male dominated society and other ersatz belief systems.

You know InTheLight..speaking of equality...I just saw this one today or yesterday coming across the web and bookmarked it.

news.yahoo.com...

I verily like all this belief in equality stuff..dont you? Equal RISK yes??
Their chance to come to a man for love only!! The very thing so many women claim is missing from their lives.

This is about progressive women...yes??? Same olde misguided beliefs among them..nothing changed while they try to put the onus off on a male dominate society.
Here is their chance to take RISKS!! But will they??

And also InTheLight..respect is not the same thing as equality. Respect is often earned. Equality today is to often politically defaulted through...not earned. Equaliity today is often not equal nor something which can be respected.



Thanks for your post,
Orangetom

As per your article Orangetom, I thought you didn't go with studies and statistics? This is a baffling turnaround. LOL

InTheLight
As per your article Orangetom, I thought you didn't go with studies and statistics? This is a baffling turnaround. LOL

Excellent point InTheLight. This probably means the premise of the article means that women do not agree or fit in with what is said..that it is flawed...that they as a whole would rather or do not have a problem going out on a date men who do not have a job.

That todays woman or women are that progressive that they would take on a High or Higher maintenance man and all his baggage...as a career. You know..a strong woman!!??

That today's strong progressive woman believes in this much equality....verses todays mens or males "misguided" beliefs.

Hence the premise of the article is very flawed.
Progressive women of today not bound by their mothers and grandmothers olde values and would indeed take on men or males who do not have employment...as a career opportunity.



Would you not agree!! Any such study posted by a male..obviously is misguided/flawed and has no basis in Truth.. or the real issues...or even validity. It has to be biased.

Thanks,
Orangetom

I was asking why you suddenly turned around and used studies (well only one study) ... oh, wait, because it suits your argument...nevermind.

I wouldn't say women are necessarily strong who reject potential slackers, moochers, and/or unmotivated men, rather I'd say smart...very smart because it takes two pay checks to only live a somewhat decent lifestyle - then throw a couple of kids and pets in there, then the costs start climbing dramatically.

InTheLight
I was asking why you suddenly turned around and used studies (well only one study) ... oh, wait, because it suits your argument...nevermind.

I wouldn't say women are necessarily strong who reject potential slackers, moochers, and/or unmotivated men, rather I'd say smart...very smart because it takes two pay checks to only live a somewhat decent lifestyle - then throw a couple of kids and pets in there, then the costs start climbing dramatically.

Very Smart?? Wow. You know InTheLight...this is not good...for I am about to agree with you.

That could be a very dangerous precedent..or trend line. I shall have to watch myself very closely here. I may be agreeing with you entirely to much...Danger Danger Danger!!!!!

I say this because that is how it felt to have someone look to me to flash dance them through a broken water heater...particularly when I am on 12 hour shifts.


Slacker, moocher, and unmotivated. I am very gratified that you were able to clarify and set that position for me.



Thank you,

Orangetom

orangetom1999

InTheLight
I was asking why you suddenly turned around and used studies (well only one study) ... oh, wait, because it suits your argument...nevermind.

I wouldn't say women are necessarily strong who reject potential slackers, moochers, and/or unmotivated men, rather I'd say smart...very smart because it takes two pay checks to only live a somewhat decent lifestyle - then throw a couple of kids and pets in there, then the costs start climbing dramatically.

Very Smart?? Wow. You know InTheLight...this is not good...for I am about to agree with you.

That could be a very dangerous precedent..or trend line. I shall have to watch myself very closely here. I may be agreeing with you entirely to much...Danger Danger Danger!!!!!

I say this because that is how it felt to have someone look to me to flash dance them through a broken water heater...particularly when I am on 12 hour shifts.


Slacker, moocher, and unmotivated. I am very gratified that you were able to clarify and set that position for me.



Thank you,

Orangetom

That trend line I mentioned above is specific to choosing a person to enter into a long-term relationship for the purpose of achieving mutual goals and not be thrown out in the street should one or the other lose their job. As for your lady friend, she simply asked you for a favour, which in no way constitutes, in my mind, her trying to use you for what she can get. That's what loving couples do, they help each other.

InTheLight,

Respect, like trust, is a two-way street. If you're not willing to give it, then you definitely don't deserve it.

That trend line I mentioned above is specific to choosing a person to enter into a long-term relationship for the purpose of achieving mutual goals and not be thrown out in the street should one or the other lose their job. As for your lady friend, she simply asked you for a favour, which in no way constitutes, in my mind, her trying to use you for what she can get. That's what loving couples do, they help each other.

Errrrrr!! I dont think you get it through your rose coloured lenses InTheLight.

I told her that I was not interested in the job of repairing her hot water heater particularly when I am working 12 hour shifts. I was not interested in doing it.."In addition to" working the shift I was so doing. Notice the emphasis on the word "In addition to."

I declared so and she eventually told me not to worry about it..in a type of disappointment. You came back with this jewel.

I suppose she looked to you as a friend to help and when you were put to the test, you failed.

and then this 24 carat one..

So these 12 hours shifts go on for how many days straight? Then you get a few days off inbetween, right?

I was not aware that this ability to do this work for her and her children and grandchildren was a type of trial...trial by fire..trial by default..remember what I keep saying about default settings?? Sort of like in the Navy ..passing muster.
I was not aware that this "Job" was part of the "Relationship or Trust." You know what I keep saying...InTheLight...pulling the wagon while others keep throwing stuff in it to be pulled and no one sees what we do!!?? Remember that one InTheLight??

Remember what I stated from the beginning..about men trying out for approval..running touchdowns..slaying dragons et al??

I was not aware that this was part and parcel of a relationship with todays self sufficient, independent woman, not looking for a man to support her but instead looking to be able to come to a man for love only..you know ..the very thing so many women are missing in life.

What I am getting from both her and you is that "trust" is contingent on me performing up to expectations in order to help her maintain the "Appearance" of independence and self sufficiency..but in reality to keep up the maintenance schedule of those not able or willing to learn the process for themselves.
This is not a two way street InTheLight. If this is it, I am happy I failed. ..as if I was ever really on trial or there was even the possibility of a relationship here.
Relationship here is a two way street InTheLight. The only sex trying to define it is you and her. What is the common denominator here??
When my labor , risks, and knowledge is at stake here...I will define it. If that is unsatisfactory...she can handle it all herself. Bon Appetit.
And she is now handling it herself. Kudos to her for indepencence and self sufficiency. That now makes her just like a man. Equal!!

Appearances is not trust...InTheLight. Even a stone aged male like me can see and know that. You know..."Misguided"

I am not asking this woman to make a decision to keep me over her children and grandchildren..but to fit me in there somewhere..particularly if I am expected..even taken for granted .. to give first fruits for which she is not able to do herself. And recognize a first fruit which I cannnot do for myself.

It is quite obvious that with her children and grandchildrens maintenance schedules and requirements this is not going to happen. No problem. But I am not in the marketplace here to give first fruit and get second third or nothing in return. Even todays modern, savvy, enlightened woman is not that dumb. But todays male ..trying out for approval and running touchdowns can easily be that dumb...over and over. Just not me. I dont call that trust, nor respect, or a reliationship..nor independent woman, nor self sufficient.

Does this strike you as a woman I could take up with and turn over my paycheck ...earned often at very high risk...to spend on herself , her children, and grandchildren...and I will be also coming in first place???

She has put me to the roadside in a "relationship" over hotwater heater!!?? No problem by me..but I am glad to know this ..this early..not later.

To put it in a vernacular any woman would understand..someone wants the milk without tending to the cow.

I am not disposable or expendable for her or her children/grandchildren. I say this because I know that there will be another and another and another maintenance incident down the road..

Am I on trial here....?? I dont think so. If I am on trial..the charges are false and the court is a joke.

Now I have no clue if or when the water heater got repaired. I am not really interested. The manner in which the last phone call ended..to me indicated a deeper message was being sent. Once again..no problem by me. I have received worse news and informations before by phone.

I dont get emotionally jerked around by such. I do, however, notice the modus operandi of such and ask about it's origins..the source of such default beliefs. Both her's and your's.
It is the way I think and have learned to think a thing through. Whether the product is that advertised.

The hot water heater is more important than me. No problem. I am glad to know this ahead of time. A man and male needs to know this kind of informations...ahead of time...he definitely does.

By the way ..think this through carefully..this too is not an independent woman..self sufficient..

I wouldn't say women are necessarily strong who reject potential slackers, moochers, and/or unmotivated men, rather I'd say smart...very smart because it takes two pay checks to only live a somewhat decent lifestyle - then throw a couple of kids and pets in there, then the costs start climbing dramatically.

This is more like a woman looking for someone to help subsidize her lifestyle..like if the water heater broke down and she could not afford to get it fixed herself. Glad to know what constitutes a smart woman today.

Lots to do around here..and I am up into the wee hours getting it done so as not to get off my work schedule.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Now I have no clue if or when the water heater got repaired. I am not really interested. The manner in which the last phone call ended..to me indicated a deeper message was being sent. Once again..no problem by me. I have received worse news and informations before by phone.

The deeper message being sent to you was obviously ignored by you because you were really not interested in contributing any effort in that relationship, which she probably realized at last. The act of her phoning you instead of meeting you face-to-face shows significant signs of disconnect between you both. Have you ever thought that you may be a commitment-phobe?

His own negative self-beliefs about commitment, love and relationships will guarantee that this relationship won’t last. He has no intention of making a commitment to her, and now that she is asking for a little more, he’s finding reasons to back away. My best bet is that he will sabotage this relationship fairly soon and it will be over.

psychcentral.com...