Why isn't abortion murder?

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by Superhans

 

Also...a Victory Dance? Really? Especially when debating a topic like this?

YES a DANCE, build me a bridge and get over it so that I can dance across it.

This is the problem with the people who do nothing but villify those who either have an abortion or those who perform one or those who agree they should be legal.

wha wha? all I hear is blah blah blah.
"The problem" as you oh so elegantly put it is that these little monsters up there above me think that postnatal abortion is NOT murder (which it is). I have done nothing to vilify the mommies that could have been. Hell, just the opposite! I have driven many 2 week laters to Doctor Shop-vac, they have always been false alarms but I fully support them the whole way.

You are so concentrated on forcing your beliefs on others that you take no time to think or offer any constructive ideas on how to reduce the number of abortions.

Now you are just being stupid buddy. Sorry, just no other way of putting it. And I say that for a few reasons
1. You are trying to get me to argue a subject im not arguing about. I have not said anything to support the position you are taking against me. You are just making some wild assumption and trying to dump in on me. And you like the others will turn up looking like a fool- YOU JUST DID. ***BOOM*** hammer just came down again, you look foolish for trying to argue for the sake of arguing
and...
2."how to reduce the number of abortions"???? This is the dumbest thing I have heard in a while. If you are for abortion you don't see the cells as life so there is nothing wrong with getting them scraped and vac'd out of a woman. So why would someone that is pro-abortion give two craps about reducing the number of abortions??? THINK McFLY!!!

Death is for those who are dead, albeit perhaps temporarily.
Life is for those who , albeit are are temporarily...alive


Perhaps the war is between life and death.

Think before ye advocate , the acceptance of commonplace execution of the near living.

Lest ye be of the kind, that kills fer the reaper.

Abortion is murder because it's done with intent.

If people, usually women, say "it's not a baby it's a fetus".

I say "It's human, like you were once. If you could snuff out the life of one who might want to live given the choice, why could't I kill you now if you are an inconvenience to me even if you want to live and I don't want you to?....."

.....Because it would be murder.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


Yea but that argument is moot. There are lots of bs laws on the books that send people to jail enmass. And we all know the big crooks walk scot free. Soon people are going to be going to jail for owning guns go figure. More bs. And we all know they want us all to do sometime well mostly. So they would be happy as pie to lock up 1000,s of more people.

Originally posted by Superhans
I have driven many 2 week laters to Doctor Shop-vac

I've never said this to anyone, I'm glad you got the fetus Shop-vac'ed out of the mother.

You are a terrible person.

May karma lay burden on your soul.

Originally posted by litterbaux

Originally posted by Superhans
I have driven many 2 week laters to Doctor Shop-vac

I've never said this to anyone, I'm glad you got the fetus Shop-vac'ed out of the mother.

You are a terrible person.

May karma lay burden on your soul.

WOW, all you really did right there is put on display your emotional knee-jerk reaction and show off how you are the type of person that likes to argue and only sees what they want to see.
If you kept reading with your range blinders off you would have seen that ALL of them were false alarms, no abortion never took place. so yeah... *BOOM*
that is the hammer of GOD commin down he has a message for you...

judge not lest ye be judged

reply to post by neoholographic


Truth be told anyone wanting to bring a kid into this world right now. If you think about how evil nasty and the mental angush that is only getting ready to escalate beyound comprehension for your child to have to endure. I would have to say is basicly sadistic. Unless you got the ability to somehow get them to a place outside of all this hell on earth that i think most on this sight expect to come into play within a few years at most.
just my point of view tho in vietnam captured us soldiers if could where head shoted by there friends they called it mercy killing. I tend to look at abortions nowadays as such. And i will never bring a child into this world till we are done destroying ourselfs and our world for no resion i can come up with other then pure insainty.

reply to post by Superhans


LOL! You certainly know how to dig yourself a hole don't you?

I have no interest in arguing as you state that I do. My only interest is in a good debate as well as possibly offering solutions and ideas that could help someone out.

I have no need to dress you down as you are doing quite well on your own. A person tells you that he is interested in a way to lower the number of abortions and you come back with....That's the stupidest thing you have ever heard? REALLY!?

It would seem the only interest you have is helping yourself to a boatload of controvercy and making statements that neither help women or suggest viable ideas. The only interest you seem to have is condemnation of all those who do not think or believe as you do.

That's just sad.

Split Infinity

reply to post by pacifier2012

If you could snuff out the life of one who might want to live given the choice, why could't I kill you now if you are an inconvenience to me even if you want to live and I don't want you to?....."

But foetii (except maybe late-term) dont even have a higher brain developed, so it is in principle not possible for them to have any feelings, such as to want something. They dont actually want to live.

If someone killed my foetus, I would consider it just as wrong as if someone "contracepted" my fertilisation. That is, not at all.

reply to post by SplitInfinity

LOL! You certainly know how to dig yourself a hole don't you?

Its that a hole of victory? If so, im dancing in it!

I have no interest in arguing as you state that I do. My only interest is in a good debate

Yeah, arguing is the same thing as debating LOOK IT UP
www.thefreedictionary.com...
Yeah, this is me dancing my victory dance, like it???
So yeah, you just want to "debate" for the sake of debating, you didn't even bother to read my other post you just leaped in and started "debating" as soon as you thought you saw something you disagreed with.

A person tells you that he is interested in a way to lower the number of abortions

yeah that is stupid.
You either think that abortion is murder and they are all wrong and they are using the whole "lower the amount of abortions" BS to make them sound more likable to those who think abortion is A-ok. OR, they see nothing wrong with abortion and do the whole less abortions idea to make them sound more acceptable to the Christian Reich. Either way I think its stupid.

It would seem the only interest you have is helping yourself to a boatload of controvercy and making statements that neither help women or suggest viable ideas.

What kind of stupid chauvinist crap are your trying to spew? How do women need your help? What in the world did I possible say to make you think that I was interested in helping women?

Originally posted by windword

And who ever who kills a pregnant woman with more than 4 age ,

Do you mean "whoever kills a pregnant woman who is past her 4th month.......?

Yes.

heshe should pay two Dia to his related one.

What is a Dia? Is it monetary or a penance?

Dia is some kinds of penance that some body who is guilty of doing damage to other people's body should pay. Also sometime that some body kills another human , heshe has to pay particular money to hisher relative.

So , if somebody kills a pregnant woman who is past her 4th month , should pay the amount of money for two people........or e killed twice. ( heshe should survive twice in hisher execution to stay alive)

BTW , nice picture

not just nice. it is a miracle.

reply to post by Superhans


It is obvious by you post that you have no interest in helping women at all...and you say as much in your above post. Man that is just sad. Really...sad.

Do you have so little empathy that you prefer to spend your time condeming those who need others the most as well as their love and understanding?

You are proffessing that all that is important to you is winning the debate and doing a victory dance as you state that Victory Dance is what is important to you not the women who are effected by this topic and you seem to care less about discussing ideas of how to lower the number of abortions...as you state I am just stupid to think this has any merit.

What in the World happened to you to screw you up so bad as well as why do you hate women so? You would call them Murderers if they are faced with a terrible choice of whether or not to abort the fetus they carry?

Ladies...if I were one of you I would make sure for certain that this Man would never be allowed a willing Female Partner to have sex...EVER again. I have found that in these matters...Women can be very creative and resourseful and to tell you the truth...I would NOT want to be you right now.

Split Infinity

I have one question in mind.

Despite all the long live liberalism that many Americans are advocating today , how are you people arguing of legality and legitimacy of abortion ?

There are many adult people being killed by those people day and night.

Liberals say "we kill while we can . It is freedom"

If you advocate liberals , you should know that everything is allowed in liberalism.

And if you don't advocate them , there are many more important issues to discuss.

It is just my opinion.

reply to post by SplitInfinity


You might want to stop wasting your time responding. He's been posting that dimwitted tripe as bait, and you've been biting. Don't take it seriously.

reply to post by Raelsatu


I was interested in just how deep a hole he would dig for himself.

It was much deeper than I ever would have imagined. LOL!

Split Infinity

I am for comprehensive abortion laws that take into account information that is not available to us at the moment: the science of the soul and when it enters the human host.

The core reasons for abortion being legal are probably quite dark, to be very honest. Other politicians then used the issue to help promote their agendas and put a positive spin on it, and now it's an issue that can be used to secure votes fairly effectively.

I would guess (and have read) that the original intention of abortions was population control, and increasing the amount of deaths in poor areas to help keep the lower classes in check.

The core reasons have nothing to do with what you read in the news, that is the fluff to be argued about in order to distract. That is why the core tenet of abortion (killing human beings) doesn't make sense when considering what you would expect the overall Liberal agenda to be.

Originally posted by windword

Originally posted by GmoS719
reply to post by windword

 

You can't give "human being" any definition that you see fit.
You said the fertilized egg was human well I have news for you.
There is no difference between human and human being.

A human being is a sovereign person, with thoughts, emotions hope and dreams and fears. Every cell within your body is human, but a fertilized egg is not a person. It's not a human being.

A person born with severe brain deformity may still be able to survive unaided, but be completely without thoughts, emotions, dreams and fears.

They're still considered human beings.

Its more than thinking that makes humans.

reply to post by SplitInfinity

I think education can help much,yes,but that education should first be aimed at teaching THE SANCTITY OF LIFE. Young people,and especially girls of course,should be taught that sex does Not equal love.This should be taught from a young age,also that abortion is not a quickfix.The fix,and this cannot be emphasized enough,is that sex is not a way to alleviate emotional pain,loneliness,etc and that to sleep around,is a disrespect to yourself,a way to devalue yourself,MOST especially in the emotionally vulnerable teenage years,but really applicable to All ages.The economic implications should be discussed at length too,of course.Already most people are aware,surely,of the availability of female birth control(the Depo-Provera injection is the most reliable imo,from personal experience)and the morning-after pill.The education should be aimed at making sure women,especially younger ones Care enough to avail themselves of preventative measures,but more importantly,to address the issues of low self-esteem,which is a Massive contributing factor in especially younger women having sex with basically the first guy that comes along and pays them attention or a few compliments. Women should have access to free birth control, but if there's no interest or will to avail themselves of it,it would by itself make little difference to the issue of unwanted pregnancies.Respect for LIFE,and for themselves,would imo,be the factors that would galvanise women who don't want a pregnancy,to prevent it rather than using abortion as an after the fact contraceptive or quickfix.Btw,it is my personal belief that life starts the moment the egg is fertilised.

Originally posted by winofiend

A person born with severe brain deformity may still be able to survive unaided, but be completely without thoughts, emotions, dreams and fears.

They're still considered human beings.

Its more than thinking that makes humans.

Are they? Such cases are rare because most of them die during birth, however if they survive there is no consensus they are even persons, and usualy arent actively resuscitated or treated. I personally dont believe they are persons. Its similar to persistent vegetative state, there is also no consensus that these are persons, and PVS patients still have more brain activity and structure than an early foetus.

Thinking is indeed what makes us humans.

In another thread, which was funny, called "you know you've spent too much time on ATS when...."
A member posted the best comment for me which was; "you know you've spent too much time on ATS, when you're arguing for three pages and you realize you don't bloody know what you're talking about".

Abortion is not murder - fact.
Women's right to choose - fact.

Most of you are either 15 years old or haven't got kids. I've read every comment on this thread and seriously, it's made me laugh.