I pledged an oath, so what do I do?

Well, Op, you and I both took the same oath. First thing in that oath is to support and defend the constitution, first and foremost. The part about obeying the president pertains to "lawful orders". If an order comes down from the top that is unconstitutional, it is your right to not follow that order. You're a Marine, you've heard the saying "I'd rather be tried by 12, then carried by 6." That applies here as well.

Greetings, iSHRED,

Maybe I missed it, but, in the first 5 pages of replies, the answer hasn't showed up yet, so here it is.

iSHRED, the reply you seek is contained here, in the non-profit Oath Keepers website
Link to the Oathkeepers website

Oath Keepers is a non-partisan association of current and formerly serving military, reserves, National Guard, veterans, Peace Officers, and Fire Fighters who will fulfill the Oath we swore, with the support of like minded citizens who take an Oath to stand with us, to support and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic, so help us God. Our Oath is to the Constitution
Our motto is "Not on our watch!"

reply to post by iSHRED


I would say that if, by giving your word, you gave a contradiction - you would not be doing what is right by keeping your word.

If you know right and wrong, do what you feel is right. Just remember that what you think is right MIGHT have serious consequences from your current employer.

reply to post by mademyself1984

What does interviewing some #bag specialist do to prove anything?

Illustrates the difference between a patriot and a boot licker.
Soldiers like that are just waiting to kiss some ass and advance their careers.

reply to post by iSHRED


Hello iSHREAD,

It bothered my spirit that I didn't recall the scripture about the guy who was faced with the same issue you are faced with and today while reading scripture, I happened upon the lesson of the yokes in Jeremiah 27.


5 I have made the earth, the man and the beast that are upon the ground, by my great power and by my outstretched arm, and have given it unto whom it seemed meet unto me.

6 And now have I given all these lands into the hand of Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon, my servant; and the beasts of the field have I given him also to serve him.

7 And all nations shall serve him, and his son, and his son's son, until the very time of his land come: and then many nations and great kings shall serve themselves of him.

8 And it shall come to pass, that the nation and kingdom which will not serve the same Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon, and that will not put their neck under the yoke of the king of Babylon, that nation will I punish, saith the Lord, with the sword, and with the famine, and with the pestilence, until I have consumed them by his hand.

9 Therefore hearken not ye to your prophets, nor to your diviners, nor to your dreamers, nor to your enchanters, nor to your sorcerers, which speak unto you, saying, Ye shall not serve the king of Babylon:

10 For they prophesy a lie unto you, to remove you far from your land; and that I should drive you out, and ye should perish.

11 But the nations that bring their neck under the yoke of the king of Babylon, and serve him, those will I let remain still in their own land, saith the Lord; and they shall till it, and dwell therein.

12 I spake also to Zedekiah king of Judah according to all these words, saying, Bring your necks under the yoke of the king of Babylon, and serve him and his people, and live.

13 Why will ye die, thou and thy people, by the sword, by the famine, and by the pestilence, as the Lord hath spoken against the nation that will not serve the king of Babylon?

14 Therefore hearken not unto the words of the prophets that speak unto you, saying, Ye shall not serve the king of Babylon: for they prophesy a lie unto you.

15 For I have not sent them, saith the Lord, yet they prophesy a lie in my name; that I might drive you out, and that ye might perish, ye, and the prophets that prophesy unto you.

16 Also I spake to the priests and to all this people, saying, Thus saith the Lord; Hearken not to the words of your prophets that prophesy unto you, saying, Behold, the vessels of the Lord's house shall now shortly be brought again from Babylon: for they prophesy a lie unto you.

17 Hearken not unto them; serve the king of Babylon, and live: wherefore should this city be laid waste?

18 But if they be prophets, and if the word of the Lord be with them, let them now make intercession to the Lord of hosts, that the vessels which are left in the house of the Lord, and in the house of the king of Judah, and at Jerusalem, go not to Babylon.

19 For thus saith the Lord of hosts concerning the pillars, and concerning the sea, and concerning the bases, and concerning the residue of the vessels that remain in this city.

20 Which Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon took not, when he carried away captive Jeconiah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah from Jerusalem to Babylon, and all the nobles of Judah and Jerusalem;

21 Yea, thus saith the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, concerning the vessels that remain in the house of the Lord, and in the house of the king of Judah and of Jerusalem;

22 They shall be carried to Babylon, and there shall they be until the day that I visit them, saith the Lord; then will I bring them up, and restore them to this place.


I hope this clears things up. From my understanding God is fully in control and we ought to have faith in Him even when we might not understand. Peace brother.

Never take the words of the scriptures out of context, is a rule the religious faithfuls must adhere to.

Jeremiah's words concerned an ancient situation in an ancient land based on many circumstances that surround those issues of the day. The hebrews had been warned through the words of the prophet then, sent to help, to fulfil our Creator's manifest destiny for mankind at that epoch and era.

There were many other teachings later that seemed to contridict those words in Jeremiah if one hold onto his words, but in truth, Jeremiah's words were NOT doctrine, but only warnings for that period at that time, and when faced with another situation, it would need another form of actions necessary.

'Pay unto Caesar what belongs to Caesar, but pay unto the kingdom of Heaven that of which belongs to God' so said our Messiah, is far more doctrinal and relevant to our times. While Caesar does not exist today, our world is not an united one but mixed up with many diverse people with differences and ignorances that would have caused much friction if not held in checked by secularism.

We do not live in Utopia, at least not yet, thus while secularism offers the best way for administration of mankind currently now, we only need to pay unto what is required by REPRESENTATIVE secular leaders for the sake of co-existance in a diverse society as a whole and as a personal responsibility, BUT without neglecting to pay unto the Kingdom of Heaven for what is expected of us - higher moral and ethical codes to live by so that we may all progress and evolve.

How will this post be relevant to the OP? The american constitution was created largely by protestant christians and not some document devoid of moral and ethical guidelines. Ultimately, if we are to be honest to ourselves whereby our Creator resides, given free will, let us be guided by Him and His teachings for us all on any situation faced, for within His teachings lay guidelines we can follow to have conscience, answering ourselves and to Him.

Defending ourselves and our loved ones, nation and mankind is not and had never been a sin. But Killing innocents is most certainly an abomination, or wars conducted as the first option to problems equally so. We are no longer living in the barbaric past, but a modern world where logic and reason rules the hearts and minds of mankind, even though sadly, barbarians in suits and religious gear still exists amongst us.

The command to kill is given by a mortal, not a divine being. And we do know all mortals are equal but flawed and prone to errors. However, our actions - to kill, to stab, to pull the trigger, are our own, with a choice we solely are fully responsible and answerable for, to both God and man.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

Defending ourselves and our loved ones, nation and mankind is not and had never been a sin. But Killing innocents is most certainly an abomination, or wars conducted as the first option to problems equally so. We are no longer living in the barbaric past, but a modern world where logic and reason rules the hearts and minds of mankind, even though sadly, barbarians in suits and religious gear still exists amongst us. The command to kill is given by a mortal, not a divine being. And we do know all mortals are equal but flawed and prone to errors. However, our actions - to kill, to stab, to pull the trigger, are our own, with a choice we solely are fully responsible and answerable for, to both God and man.

I completely agree. God's word does although address the issue of vows that never should have been made in the first place but have been made. The scripture I posted was meant to be a continuation of what I have already posted. Forgive me if I authored confusion, that was not my intent. Each of us have to choose of who we will serve God or man.