Forcing a person to get a flu shot is no different than assult and battery!!!

We have all heard of the problems with vaccines. Recently, several nurses from Indiana were fired because they didn't want someone forcing them to put something they didn't want in their bodies.
Remember, a woman's body is her own, and she can choose to eliminate a baby, just as easily to refuse someone sticking something in her body that she doesn't want. I'm surprised that women's groups aren't up in arms protesting this. More over, many of the vaccines are ineffective to the variety of influenza that are out there. Take the current outbreak, the flu vaccine hasn't helped these suffering people one bit. Forcing a woman to put something in her body is no different than assault and battery!

reply to post by Violater1


Unfortuantley when you were born you mother forcefully vaccinated you with the immunitys gained through her blood.

Of course this is never 100% many babies get sick directly after birth because the natural vaccination they recieved didnt cover every virus.

Dont let logic or facts get in the way of your doomtarding, carry on.

reply to post by Violater1


In a broader scope, it is a central authority dictating to the individual.

You WILL get the shot.
You WILL obey.

What happened to our free society?

SnF

reply to post by Violater1


If you hold someone down and shove a needle in their arm?

I'd agree. But the example you set is far different. They are NURSES. They work around sick people every day. They don't just work with flu victims, they work with people that have weakened immune systems and who will get sick, and die from the same disease they might get the sniffles from.

When you work in the medical field, the decision vaccinate no longer becomes your own. It is not assault and battery to hold someone to not complying with the terms of their employment.

Originally posted by Wertdagf
reply to post by Violater1

 

Unfortuantley (sic) when you were born you mother forcefully vaccinated you with the immunitys(sic) gained through her blood.

Of course this is never 100% many babies get sick directly after birth because the natural vaccination they recieved(sic) didnt(sic) cover every virus.

Dont(sic) let logic or facts get in the way of your doomtarding(sic), carry on.

You couldn't be more wrong.
1. Many babies Do Not get sick directly after birth.
2. The mother passes on Natural immunity through T-cells, it is NOT vaccination.

I'm not sure how you make the correlation between sick babies and women refusing to get something forcefully injected into their bodies. Perhaps if you pay more attention in your high school English class, you'll not only have fewer spelling errors, but you will be able to grasp the topic of something that you just read.

Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by Violater1

 

If you hold someone down and shove a needle in their arm?

I'd agree. But the example you set is far different. They are NURSES. They work around sick people every day. They don't just work with flu victims, they work with people that have weakened immune systems and who will get sick, and die from the same disease they might get the sniffles from.

When you work in the medical field, the decision vaccinate no longer becomes your own. It is not assault and battery to hold someone to not complying with the terms of their employment.

Really, so what is next? If the employer doesn't want them to miss any work related to a pregnancy, will they then force them to take a "day after pill"?
Again, the flu vaccine that is out now is ineffective to the current flu outbreak that the USA is suffering from.

reply to post by Violater1


No one is forcing you...

Thats like saying an employeer is forcing you not to burn crosses on peoples lawns. Getting fired for being crazy isnt a violation of your rights.

Originally posted by Wertdagf
reply to post by Violater1

 

No one is forcing you...

Thats(sic) like saying an employeer(sic) is forcing you not to burn crosses on peoples lawns. Getting fired for being crazy isnt(sic) a violation of your rights.

Again you are wrong. If you don't get the injection, you get fired.
Burn crosses?

Really?

Oh, it's you, Wertgurf!
Gee, last time we crossed paths, I proved you wrong 20 times. That was what, about 2 years ago?
You then quit posting in my OP's.
Amusingly to have you back again
You know, you can have your browser perform spell check. Just click on the box for grammar.

If you don't want a vaccine, that's your right. It's also you're right to work elsewhere.

I'll say this though... If my elderly mother were a patient where she got the flu by a medical employee that was on some little crusade against vaccines? I'd insure she was well taken care of by the settlement on the law suit....and if she didn't survive the infection..I'd be retiring on what I did to the medical facility and that employee as personally as the law could make it for them.

Really.. When working around sick people? Follow the policies or find work elsewhere. It seems a simple thing to me.

Originally posted by Wertdagf
reply to post by Violater1

 

No one is forcing you...

Thats like saying an employeer is forcing you not to burn crosses on peoples lawns. Getting fired for being crazy isnt a violation of your rights.

if they are losing their jobs over it, then they're being forced to take it. you are clearly so wound up with your need to contradict violater that logic and common sense seem to have gone out the window.

let it go. violater is right.

Originally posted by Violater1

Originally posted by Wertdagf
reply to post by Violater1

 

No one is forcing you...

Thats(sic) like saying an employeer(sic) is forcing you not to burn crosses on peoples lawns. Getting fired for being crazy isnt(sic) a violation of your rights.

Again you are wrong. If you don't get the injection, you get fired.
Burn crosses?

Really?

Oh, it's you, Wertgurf!
Gee, last time we crossed paths, I proved you wrong 20 times. That was what, about 2 years ago?
You then quit posting in my OP's.
Amusingly to have you back again

You know, you can have your browser perform spell check. Just click on the box for grammar.

edit on 13-1-2013 by Violater1 because: (no reason given)

Getting fired is not a violation of your rights.

Do you have anything to say to that...

reply to post by Violater1

YOU ARE 100% CORRECT-AND YOU ARE BRILLIANT! Can you imagine the backlash if a woman was fired because she chose to have an abortion?!? But they want to fire people for refusing to put that vile sh** into their bodies.An ANTI-LIFE agenda,along with the psychotropic drugs they hand out like Smarties,and ease of obtaining abortions.I could add to that GMO,and the fact that even growing yr owm veggies and collecting rainwater seems to be illegal in parts of America,etc..Its not difficult to see the pattern.

reply to post by Violater1


No, you're making a moronic argument.

They are healthcare providers. Part of their job is to not make their patients worse than when they came in. Not to mention that routine vaccinations are a pre-requisite to any healthcare education program! They should have expected these results, and if they didn't want to take the flu shots they should have sought an exemption. This is also routine practice for the hospital to fire employees who refuse flu shots. It has been for years.

I don't get your pregnancy related argument, since pregnancy is not a communicable disease.

reply to post by Violater1


That facepalm about sums it up

reply to post by Wertdagf

I dont see how the OP is doomtarding.You should not be fired for refusing a flu shot.Its f*cked-up.I would say its WORSE than assault+battery,after being beaten up,your bruises heal.After a flu shot,you're stuck with whatever ingredients went into the shot. I wonder why you would attack the OP like this,for raising a VERY GOOD POINT?

reply to post by Raxoxane


healthcare.

Kind of your job to do what you can to NOT get the common strains of the flu.

Originally posted by Wertdagf

Originally posted by Violater1

Originally posted by Wertdagf
reply to post by Violater1

 

No one is forcing you...

Thats(sic) like saying an employeer(sic) is forcing you not to burn crosses on peoples lawns. Getting fired for being crazy isnt(sic) a violation of your rights.

Again you are wrong. If you don't get the injection, you get fired.
Burn crosses?

Really?

Oh, it's you, Wertgurf!
Gee, last time we crossed paths, I proved you wrong 20 times. That was what, about 2 years ago?
You then quit posting in my OP's.
Amusingly to have you back again

You know, you can have your browser perform spell check. Just click on the box for grammar.

edit on 13-1-2013 by Violater1 because: (no reason given)

Getting fired is not a violation of your rights.

Do you have anything to say to that...

La de da de da! US talks like that a lot. YES, its a violation of your rights to be fired for refusal to have a shot. Medical careers, are trained and its a life long career for most.

Also vaccines make many people sick, so not very conducive to working with the sick, I'd say. I only had a few when I was younger, was sick for weeks after each flu shot.

But being fired is most definitely a violation.

reply to post by Raxoxane

The thing is, we're talking about a nearly universally accepted method of protection from the flu. It normally seems to work, not withstanding screw ups on the guess for strain like this year of course. Now the way to attack vaccines in general, if they need to be attacked, is protest and the law. Fair enough. It's NOT protest inside the facilities sick people come to, IMO.

A nurse's right to protest a vaccination comes to a screeching halt at the line I arrive at a hospital or other medical facility expecting the best care they can offer.....not protesting staff putting me at even more potential risk.

After all, a nurse is facing nothing LIKE a normal risk of infection themselves. They work where infected people come.....then work around people that don't WANT that themselves. Get the shot or quit. Simple enough.

Ok now one could argue that by the rules we seem to accept as a society
towards those in the medical profession that the care of the patient comes
above all else, even their own desires, now my real question to that logic
can only be, why do we allow doctors to be paid so much if this is the case?
why do we allow prices for necessary drugs and operations to be so high?

If it really is all about the patients in the system then its obvious that those
things need to change as well, those things effect the level of care people
receive far more than anything else does, those nurses and doctors get
paid so much in fact it leads to shortages of staff in many areas hence
creating an even bigger problem for care overall, and if this is the case
then we need to ensure those working in that field receive enough sleep
as well, i know fatigue is the cause of many bad things, also they should
not be allowed to drink caffeine at work, that can cause issues as well,
id rather my doc and nurses have steady hands, to me this issue
is really ridiculous.

There is so much more wrong with our healthcare
system than a few nurses who refuse a vaccination that has very
little chance to help anyone, as has already been pointed out,
the flu isn't one strain and not only that but that vaccine isn't 100%
effective, therefore even IF someone does get it, and that someone
is lucky enough to not get sick from that single strain AND they are
lucky enough to not have contaminated themselves in a way the
vaccine cannot help with at all (IE on their clothes, a candy wrapper that
got thrown away afterward but not before someone touched it and
touched a pillow or door knob), then the vaccine helped? and that's worth
someone loosing their job over? i dunno, im a bit dubious of that.....

While i do agree precaution is necessary there are limits to the reality
we face, and that reality is that so far perfection is out of our reach in
this area as of yet, complete decontamination is very difficult and costly,
not only that but its a war of attrition and those are so very hard to fight.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
If you don't want a vaccine, that's your right. It's also you're right to work elsewhere.

I'll say this though... If my elderly mother were a patient where she got the flu by a medical employee that was on some little crusade against vaccines? I'd insure she was well taken care of by the settlement on the law suit....and if she didn't survive the infection..I'd be retiring on what I did to the medical facility and that employee as personally as the law could make it for them.

Really.. When working around sick people? Follow the policies or find work elsewhere. It seems a simple thing to me.

I'm sorry to say, that if your mom dies from getting the flu, she has a lot worse things going wrong in her co-morbidity. Unfortunately, Uhbama's new healthcare plan will dictate what type of therapy she will receive.
Back on topic. If the employer states that you need to loose weight, will you now be forced to swallow tablets to do so? Or if you have asthma, will they say you can't actuate your inhaler because it makes you jittery? The list goes on and on, and the slope gets steeper and steeper.
From the CDC www.cdc.gov...

"The 2012-2013 influenza vaccine is made from the following three viruses:

an A/California/7/2009 (H1N1)pdm09-like virus;
an A/Victoria/361/2011 (H3N2)-like virus;
a B/Wisconsin/1/2010-like virus (from the B/Yamagata lineage of viruses).

CDC has received reports of some people who were vaccinated against influenza becoming ill and testing positive for influenza...Unfortunately, some people can get infected with an influenza virus that is included in the vaccine despite getting vaccinated." The flu does change and changes quickly.
"Antigenic shift is an abrupt, major change in the influenza A viruses, resulting in new hemagglutinin and/or new hemagglutinin and neuraminidase proteins in influenza viruses that infect humans. Such a “shift” occurred in the spring of 2009, when a new H1N1 virus with a new combination of genes emerged to infect people and quickly spread, causing a pandemic. When shift happens, most people have little or no protection against the new virus."
The current flu type is H3N2v
www.flu.gov...
" and is a variant of H3N2 influenza virus that infected 321 people in the United States in 2011 and 2012. When this virus occurs in pigs, it is called “swine influenza.” The virus does not usually infect people or spread among people. It is very different from human seasonal H3N2 viruses.

307 of the cases occurred from July-November 2012.
Symptoms of H3N2v are similar to seasonal flu symptoms."