Originally posted by Klassified
reply to post by brookster18
I spent decades of my life believing we were all evil, and there was no hope or redemption for us as a species left unto ourselves. So I do understand
what you're saying overrall, even if I may not understand some of your finer points.
Here's my point. No one could have convinced me to look at it with a fresh pair of eyes, though many tried. I couldn't see the "forest for the
trees", and worse, I wasn't really trying to. All I wanted was confirmation of what I already believed was true. And I got it. Because if you look
for something hard enough, you'll probably find it.
Thanks for sharing your views on this topic. I genuinely appreciate the input you've given.
edit on 1/12/2013 by Klassified because: formatting
edit on 1/12/2013 by Klassified because: clarity
I see your the Opening Poster which makes you king of this thread, so respect for that, and apologies if I didnt follow your argument too clearly. I
think you pussy footed around the opening in a way that anyone would, ie you gently introduced the notion instead of diving straight in and calling
humans as evil as a hoard of locusses.
I dont think evil is as clear cut as religion would have us believe.
But, you reffer to one of your premises, we are able to adapt our environment. We can build homes, store food, create tools to make it easier to
survive and flourish. This sets us apart from animals. But instead of helping them we enprison them in fields and murder them to eat. Even when were
not hungary. and far worse.
As such, I would say we are different, and have to be looked at differently, and unlike the locust which is traditionally identified as evil and the
harbinger of doom and worthy of only slaying, we can change, but we dont.
If you are looking at concepts of good and eveil, I think its safe to say our species are not good. If we were good we would ride around on unicorns
and birds would sit on our shoulders. As such, by reasoning that we are not good, we must be evil. But that doesnt mean we go around eating babies and
I think what i was saying before should be taken as ideas, not 'facts'. I dont know if we are evil, its a bizarre concept, but I see us as evil.
Personally, I see men as evil, mainly for the reasons mentioned before.
As you say, we can adapt our environment, that means we have a greater responsibility, but with that we go to war and destroy the earth.
We havnt done much good. Creating national parks is just taking what nature hand and then giving it back at $40 a go.
Man has not invaded countries and aggressivly built water treatment systems and farms and gaurded them with their lives to ensure that other people
wont suffer pain. We havnt done that. We have killed people on a humanitarian pretence for oil and political gain.
Where have we sacrificed beyond reason for animals or wildlife? Even for our own kind?
I think its a hard one to take. People find it hard o see themselves as evil.
Its the basis, I beleive for Lutherian christianity which was a major revolution from Catholicism. It described us all as sinners without scope for
redemption. Nothing we could do would redeem ourselves, nothing, only god could bless us and he was as likely to bless the wicked as readily as the
good. They fought wards over that ideal in Europe.
Im not religious, but it shows accepting ourselves as inherently evil is not new.
Personally, its not a major issue but I do reflect on the fact when I kille a biting insect or a cocroach. Mainly I cant kill anything. How much
aggrevation do i need before im allowed to kill? (insects that is).
I was on the beach, and I always talk to the seagulls and other beach birds. I was lying there the other day and a teenager went past, maybe 19 years
old with a stick, and then he threw it directly at the seagulls. He clearly with intention wanted to strike one for his own pleasure. I stared at him
intensley and he flailed about a bit and then wondered off before finding a sea crab thing which was dead but which he could stab repeatably with his
Oh, only evil in a little way, so its OK. ut thats evil. Its not good.
In fact I describe the British Governemnt as evil all the time so thats a better point of reference. My reasoning there is that good and evil must be
equally balanced, therefore 50% of us are by default evil. We cant all be good, like looks, its all relative. If I do 10 good things and you only do 5
good things, you are more evil than me. So by rationale, some of us must be evil. And evil can be slight. But evil is only the opposite or absence of
good. For example, Landlords are evil as they take other peoples homes and rent them back to them for money. Its not slavery, but its not charity