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Another gun control rant....

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posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 12:00 AM
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I'm sorry, in advance. I don't rant much, and I try not to rant at all, but I fail. Anyway, here goes.

Gun Control is a big topic these days. And I've been in a lot of the forums on the subject. People keep telling me and others that "the only reason you have guns is fear". For me, that is not true. I own weapons for hunting, also for protection. But I don't fear somebody breaking into my house, I just accept the fact that it may happen, and I would like to be prepared in case it does. I have a jack and a spare tire, not because I'm afraid that I'll have a flat, but because it could happen. To clarify what I am afraid of, here is a list of my "fears".

Spiders, first and foremost, they're terrifying, too many legs, too many eyes, and they're venomous. Got bit by a Brown Recluse once in my sleep.

Clowns, they can't be trusted.

Auto accidents. Every day, I get in a 3,500 lb, 300 horsepower machine and drive 65mph mere feet away from cars going the same speed in the opposite direction. Doesn't stop me from doing it though.

Bears. We don't have a lot of them in the Ozarks, but we do have them, and I don't want to meet one.

Cougars (not the human vareity. They are large animals that are much stronger and faster than myself, also they're pretty aggressive.

Sharks, good thing I don't live anywhere near the ocean.

Jail, which is why I abide by the law.

Well, those are my fears. Just because I have a couple of weeks worth of food doesn't mean that I'm afraid that I'll starve.




posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 12:15 AM
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reply to post by dave_welch
 


I feel you on all of that.. 100%

As far as people saying we have guns because of fear.. I see it as wisdom. Wisdom to learn from history.. All of the anti-gun talkers seem to think dictators and tyrants were some ancient personality type. There are 1000's of would be tyrants that surround us, unfortunately. Also we like to hunt and shoot for fun, too.. Fear is the least of reasons most of us defend our RIGHT.

Cheers!



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 12:33 AM
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reply to post by Startruth144
 


All right here (Thanks to another member for the link)
www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.vcdl.org...

Raging Against Self Defense





How can you communicate with these people who seem to be out of touch with reality and rational thought? One approach to help you deal with anti-gun people is to understand their psychological processes. Once you understand why these people behave so irrationally, you can communicate more effectively with them.



edit on 11-1-2013 by infolurker because: add link



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 12:39 AM
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reply to post by infolurker
 

Thanks for the Link, Checking it out now.



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 12:47 AM
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reply to post by infolurker
 


About halfway done with the article you posted good stuff!



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 12:49 AM
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The reason people like myself say gun owners live in fear is because thats what you guys constantly tell us.

Your scared you might get mugged
Your scared someone might break into your home
Your scared the gov is gonna come and put you in camps

Carrying anything for protection is to live in fear no matter how you dress it up or twist the wording.

I personally dont see an issue with guns for hunting if its for food and not trophies



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 01:02 AM
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Originally posted by IkNOwSTuff
The reason people like myself say gun owners live in fear is because thats what you guys constantly tell us.

Your scared you might get mugged
Your scared someone might break into your home
Your scared the gov is gonna come and put you in camps

Carrying anything for protection is to live in fear no matter how you dress it up or twist the wording.

I personally dont see an issue with guns for hunting if its for food and not trophies



And it begins.

First I will tell you (again) that it is not out of fear, I don't walk down the street terrified that I'll be mugged. I don't lay in bed at night afraid that someone is going to break in. I don't look over my should while posting on ATS out of fear that some armed guy is gonna blast through the door to take my guns. However, I am prepared for if that may happen. It's not like either of those are just something from the movies and don't exist in real life. Those things happen around the world every day. Is preparedness fear? No. I carry a tool kit in my car. Am I afraid that it will break down? No. But, it might, so I may as well be prepared.



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 01:08 AM
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reply to post by dave_welch
 


After yesterday, I am scared of bees. I was driving with my sister with the window down and by pot luck, A bee flew in, straight into my ear and stung me
.. Right now I look like a UFC fighter with the cauliflower ear...



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 01:10 AM
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reply to post by DarknStormy
 


I would recommend not becoming a bee-keeper. That's a trade I've dabbled in once or twice, I have a lot of family that are bee keepers, not for me, got stung in the middle of my brow and looked like a Neanderthal for a few days.




posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 01:45 AM
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reply to post by dave_welch
 


OK so you say you dont live in fear but your 1 out of how many?

Go through any gun debate thread and read the replies, Before I got involved in these types of arguments I assumed you all just had gun fetishes but now after reading what so many have written am convinced it does in fact boil down to fear



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 02:09 AM
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Originally posted by IkNOwSTuff
reply to post by dave_welch
 


OK so you say you dont live in fear but your 1 out of how many?

Go through any gun debate thread and read the replies, Before I got involved in these types of arguments I assumed you all just had gun fetishes but now after reading what so many have written am convinced it does in fact boil down to fear


Speaking of being convinced and making pronouncements .... youve been compelled to post in almost every gun thread with almost the same exact "talking points", condescending attitude and utter childishness lashing out when you arent given the attention you seek. Have you ever heard of projection? You should consider that you are the one who is paralyzed with fear and project it onto those who you feel are doing you some fantasy wrong. Whereas many of us wish to speak on certain topics and communicate with anti-gun folks like adults, many of your posts have simply seethed with hatred.. irrational hatred because no one here has done anything to you. There are many gun owners here with opinions I strongly disagree with, even though I own firearms, but to have this kind of hatefulness toward them and fear of them.. its just tedious and annoying to read in every thread. Have you ever considered that you have some obsession with gun owners, an irrational fear of firearms, and live in abject fear yourself by frenetically posting your every waking hour on every gun thread? I have literally seen you post back to back on several gun threads only and I had just logged on not too long ago and looked into recent posts. I had been ignoring you for days now and even this last 45 minutes of your frenetic posting, but this is getting to be more than annoying when you troll poster after poster in an attempt to derail conversations. You arent even really contributing to any topic, just babbling.. fear.. guns.. fear.. gun nuts.. fear.. like you have some profound thought that you must compulsively repeat.. ad nauseum.

Its just very bizarre behavior and you dont seen to be able to see it or even reign yourself in. I personally dont care what you have convinced yourself of because you have no impact on my life and no meaning whatsoever to me, but your behavior is most annoying and does a disservice to those who are against guns/for regulation that have well thought out arguments and can converse with others.



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 02:46 AM
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Speaking of being convinced and making pronouncements .... youve been compelled to post in almost every gun thread with almost the same exact "talking points", condescending attitude and utter childishness lashing out when you arent given the attention you seek.


Almost every gun thread is a bit of a stretch but yeah Ive posted in quite a few and if my talking points are the same its only because the arguments are the same.
A tiny bit hypocritical to call me condescending and then type out the post you just have.



Have you ever heard of projection? You should consider that you are the one who is paralyzed with fear and project it onto those who you feel are doing you some fantasy wrong.


Ive heard of it but can tell you it doesnt apply to me. I dont fear muggins or home invasions etc etc. I walk the streets at all hours without concern, Ive confronted a burglar in my backyard. I dont feel anyone has done me any wrong and since your familiar with so many of my posts maybe you could link to one that I implied I thought anything even remotely like that.
Ive stated many times Im not American and the issue at the end of the day has no impact on my life but since its a discussion forum Ill offer my opinion on any topic I like.



Whereas many of us wish to speak on certain topics and communicate with anti-gun folks like adults, many of your posts have simply seethed with hatred.. irrational hatred because no one here has done anything to you.


Seethed with hatred? you mean like your post does?
Ive admitted when Ive gotten worked up and have apologised in thread and via U2Us. I normally only get worked up when Im attacked personally. I enjoy discussion and debate so have no issues with being challenged on my views. Ive mahaged to have many Adult like conversations and have even made friends on your side of this debate because of it



There are many gun owners here with opinions I strongly disagree with, even though I own firearms, but to have this kind of hatefulness toward them and fear of them.. its just tedious and annoying to read in every thread.


How did my posts on this thread come across as hateful? many people post on lots of gun threads are their posts tedious and annoying or is it just me who doesnt agree with you thats annoying?



Have you ever considered that you have some obsession with gun owners, an irrational fear of firearms, and live in abject fear yourself by frenetically posting your every waking hour on every gun thread?


Have you ever considered your country has an irrational obsession with guns? I dont fear firearms because they are so rare where I am its not an issue. I dont post on EVERY gun thread only the ones I feel need to be challenged



have literally seen you post back to back on several gun threads only and I had just logged on not too long ago and looked into recent posts


Yeah when replying to people, how is that a problem? some might even call it courteous to respond to people who take the time to address your points



I had been ignoring you for days now and even this last 45 minutes of your frenetic posting, but this is getting to be more than annoying when you troll poster after poster in an attempt to derail conversations


Ignoring me, poor me
frenetic posting
Ill make a point and when its responded to Ill reply, maybe its seems frenetic because so many gun nuts want a piece of me.
Ive trolled once on a thread and that was today and the thread got no attention at all till I made the first post 8 hrs after it was written. And even then I only posted after a U2U from the OP of the thread requested me too.
Ive never derailed any other threads and would love to see 1 example of me doing so.
OInce again kind of hypocritical since you didnt address my points or the OP but instead chose to attack me personally, you could have done this via U2U but in your selfishness have chosen to derail the thread over a personal issue you have with my posts.



You arent even really contributing to any topic, just babbling.. fear.. guns.. fear.. gun nuts.. fear.. like you have some profound thought that you must compulsively repeat.. ad nauseum.


I see

And your post adds to the topic and adult conversation how exactly. Seems like you read alot of gun threads, you must be obsessed with guns like me I guess




Its just very bizarre behavior and you dont seen to be able to see it or even reign yourself in.


I actually agree with you here, I do see it and have many times restrained myself from posting but other times my need to refute obvious idiocy gets the better of me and I get sucked in. Speaking with most gun nuts is like bangin your head against a brick wall only less productive

I guess since I have no impact or meaning on your life Im flattered you took the time to write me a nice big attack


All the best



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 04:58 AM
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reply to post by IkNOwSTuff
 

Sorry, but you do post in nearly every gun control thread. Every one that's made the front page at least. You also like to insult people and blow them off when they've shown that you were wrong. I've seen you tell people to "grow a brain" I don't know how many times. You even tried to call BS on me when I said I'd been to Kuala Limpur, the city you live in, and didn't find it to be the peaceful utopia you tend to think it is. Some times we must take a look at ourselves from the outside to see our faults. I recommend that you give that a shot, before you reply. Also, ask yourself: What is idiocy? I have seen you call people out for being idiotic and lacking common sense, when you are the one flaunting those faults. Take a step back, think critically. Do not try to instantly reply to somebody with a snarky remark, try and respond intelligently. Do not put blanket judgements on an entire nation. Surely you don't think that several hundred thousand people are all sociopaths? Think about it.



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 12:45 PM
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reply to post by dave_welch
 


I waited a long time and read the post several times before responding.

yes I have blown people off and have insulted people, when it has been unwarranted Ive apologised, not just pro gunners but also religious types and Israel can do no wrong types.

I never said KL was a utopia all I said was Ive never seen a violent crime take place, you say you were here for a week and saw 3 which I still find hard to believe. maybe if you were here 10+ yrs ago its believable but in the current climate that would be a massive statistical anomaly.

As for looking outside ourselves and our current situation to try and see it objectively I totally agree, maybe many of you with your pro gun outlook should do the same.
The problem is many of you take it as a personal attack when anyone let alone a non Yank says anything anti gun, the only reason we even bother is because we see having guns everywhere as completely self defeating and contradictory to what it is you all want them for. Making guns easily available to basically every citizen who wants them just means there are more guns available for criminals and crazies to get their hands on. It puzzles many of us you dont see this.

Ive called many people idiots but those people and many many others have called me much worse, once again when its been out of line I have apologised. I have not had the same courtesy returned to me.
And you just called me an idiot, its OK I dont expect an apology

I dont think every gun owner, all 100+ million of you, are sociopaths but I do think (and so does the vast majority of the civilised world) that wanting and owning a gun is either sick, fearful or a case of keeping up with the jones's as in everyone else has one so I better get armed to.

Back to your OP

Did you go through any other threads and read peoples justifications for gun ownership?
Would you not agree that apart from those who said hunting pretty much all other justifications were based on fear?


.



posted on Jan, 11 2013 @ 07:47 PM
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Thanks for doing what I suggested. Isn't civilized debate much better?

And yes, there are those who own them out of fear, but it is with good reason. We are speaking from experience. Chicago, Illinois has the nations highest gun control, it's basically impossible to own a gun there. They also have the highest murder rate. Coincidence? No.

I understand where you're getting your opinion. However, even if someone owns a firearm out of fear, would you not say they have good reason? Sometimes you have to live in an area that isn't so safe. Usually it's because they can't afford to move to a better neighborhood. The point is, in some cities, you will be assaulted in some way. How many women have been raped because they couldn't defend themselves? Why should we allow that to happen? We know the Police won't always be there. Producing a gun doesn't mean you're going to kill them. Think about it, if you were a violent person, obviously you're not, but if you were, and you meant to attack somebody, if they produced a gun, would you continue, or would you flee? I know if it were me, I would flee. Then, the violent person has failed in his task, the police have been notified, and his victim is not a victim.

If there was a way to wave a wand or whatever and make all guns and knowledge of them disappear, I'd do it. As that is impossible, and there are people who may want to take what you have, and possibly take your life to get it, would it not be prudent to take a little extra precaution to prevent that? Doesn't everybody do things out of fear in your opinion?

What people fail to realize is the sheer size of the United States geographically. When you see murder statistics for the entire country, it is an alarming number. When you realize the majority of those statistics come from places like Chicago, Los Angeles, and New York city, places with the strictest gun control laws, what does that tell you?









 
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