Chinese Communist Leadership playing with fire.

reply to post by mypan

Maybe you should Wiki the Washington Agreement of June 19 2012.Sounds like you are already knocking on the door.After we walked away fron the ANZUS treaty.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by mypan

 

Really? You don't need us? Do you honestly think that your ability to ship products from your country would be safe without the massive U.S. Naval presence? Does your country have any ability to defend itself?

You believe that without the U.S. that Communist China would just allow you to do as you wish? It would not.

Split Infinity

Protection from who ? China is not going to attack us more than you are going to attack us. Stop putting yourself on a pedestal and be realistic. The world is going to spin around with or without US of A.

Originally posted by rockymcgilicutty
reply to post by mypan

 

Maybe you should Wiki the Washington Agreement of June 19 2012.Sounds like you are already knocking on the door.After we walked away fron the ANZUS treaty.

Yeah, right. Anyone for a Tui beer ?

You bent over backward to accommodate us. Our stance still hasn't change and your ships still barred from our water and may I ask who's knocking on whose door ? You see, our split was over nuclear matter but you had to use your financial might to crush us but we are still around, poorer but prouder.

Fast forward 25 years later and we still barred your ships from our ports and you let us into yours and you called that a win ? No wonder you won in Vietnam.

reply to post by Iwinder

my agenda is to stop this freeking constant war thing

I offer you good luck.There have always been men and women throughout history that have wanted to stop war.

The only problem is mankind ! We are a greedy,violent species.I would love it if we could live dream like eutopia.But do you really see that happening?

reply to post by mypan


Putting myself on a pedestal? I think not.

Your veiw of China is unrealistic. China has no issue using it's Military to kill vast numbers of Student Protesters and disadents.

What makes you think that they would treat people not even of their own nation any better?

Split Infinity

Originally posted by mypan

Originally posted by rockymcgilicutty
reply to post by mypan

 

Maybe you should Wiki the Washington Agreement of June 19 2012.Sounds like you are already knocking on the door.After we walked away fron the ANZUS treaty.

Yeah, right. Anyone for a Tui beer ?

You bent over backward to accommodate us. Our stance still hasn't change and your ships still barred from our water and may I ask who's knocking on whose door ? You see, our split was over nuclear matter but you had to use your financial might to crush us but we are still around, poorer but prouder.

Fast forward 25 years later and we still barred your ships from our ports and you let us into yours and you called that a win ? No wonder you won in Vietnam.

Tui Beer??? never heard of it

All three of your naval ships allowed into our ports?? We probably won't even notice them.
All 7000 troops of you standing army???

Yea we need you.

But keep your pride that's a good trait.But with your vast forces when the SHTF give us a call we will answer.Like we always do.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by mypan

 

Putting myself on a pedestal? I think not.

Your veiw of China is unrealistic. China has no issue using it's Military to kill vast numbers of Student Protesters and disadents.

What makes you think that they would treat people not even of their own nation any better?

Split Infinity

My view of China is, it's their country and they can do whatever they want with it.

I don't see China advocating regime change of any country to anyone.

reply to post by mypan


Of course you will not see China advocating Regime Change as that would be like China throwing bricks in a glass house.

China's leadership is not elected. People there have absolutely no say in their own system of government. I highly doubt you would want to live under those constraints.

Split Infinity

Alexander the Great had to cross a river with an opposing army on the other side waiting to do mortal battle. If he were to cross and engage directly it would had been a bloodbath to his army. So what he did was to order a sizeable amount of his men to ride up and down his side of the river making as much noise and spectacle as possible. Well at first the opposing army was alarmed but after a couple of days of this noise and nothing else they accepted it as such and decided it was harmless.

Meanwhile, during this spectacle/distraction Alexander sent scouts up and down river for a more advantageous location to cross. Sure enough he found it. He planned, timed, crossed, flanked, then directly engaged the opposing army in 2 locations.

The opposing army was caught off guard because they were busy admiring the spectacle when they should have been look at the other hand.

I can see China normalizing a spectacle rigt now and we need to be watching their other hand and not admiring the problem that they are presenting to us.

reply to post by 11235813213455


Spot on,If only this generation new how important history was.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by Iwinder

 

The U.S. spent Billions keeping Europe safe for decades. The U.S. had to go into Bosnia as the Europeans could not handle it on their own. As for the other countries mentioned...I wish the U.S. never went into Nam or Iraq but Afghanistan was a must.

You cannot seriously wish to count on China to be in control as China has a very poor history and record whenever their Military is brought to bear.

You could kiss goodbye the majority of your rights including posting on this board. Just ask any Chinese disadent who has rotten in a Chinese prison for decades.

Split Infinity

The U.S. spent Billions keeping Europe safe for decades. The U.S. had to go into Bosnia as the Europeans could not handle it on their own. As for the other countries mentioned...I wish the U.S. never went into Nam or Iraq but Afghanistan was a must.

You cannot seriously wish to count on China to be in control as China has a very poor history and record whenever their Military is brought to bear.

You could kiss goodbye the majority of your rights including posting on this board. Just ask any Chinese disadent who has rotten in a Chinese prison for decades.


I suppose your above statement is quite possible even probable, but I always have had a problem with a one Sheriff town.

If someone has the ultimate power without a counter balance then all is lost.

Look what happened to Rome, Free bread and Circuses to keep the masses happy.

I also like how our Government (Canada) got caught out on trying to buy war birds (F35's) and it turned out they were quoting a price billions below what it would cost......


We really need stealth attack fighters like we need more snow.
Now we are looking to Europe for a new tactical fighter jet...
Hopefully it is a by plane and cheap to run because in all my life time we have never needed a fighter jet in our Country.

Regards, Iwinder

when you look at it, it's a good time to make a move for those disputed islands. Japan is hurting since China restricted trade with them, the Yen is stretching farther than spandex on a fat man and the US is not looking for another drawn out conflict with forces focused in the middle east while the president tries to avoid having the country melt down.

If the US has any kind of mass civil unrest (like some are pointing to over the gun control issue) then best believe China will make another bolder move if not an outright aggressive move to claim those terrestial waters.

reply to post by SplitInfinity

It makes one wonder just exactly what is Chinas goal besides being a thorn in the side of the U.S.?

I have a question, whats America goal and reasoning the need for all those 1000+ bases in Europe?

Originally posted by rockymcgilicutty

As I said if Shtf again where will the world come knocking?

Yes you keep saying "SHTF Again' we get that.

Iwinders point is:

We dont want a "shtf" again, when it seems the World would need to join Forces to take down an Imperialistic USA.

Only the Bad Guys have Changed since 1945, war is still War.

Originally posted by Tw0Sides

Originally posted by rockymcgilicutty

As I said if Shtf again where will the world come knocking?

Yes you keep saying "SHTF Again' we get that.

Iwinders point is:

We dont want a "shtf" again, when it seems the World would need to join Forces to take down an Imperialistic USA.

Only the Bad Guys have Changed since 1945, war is still War.

I will no longer respond to anyone.Who is so ashamed of their country they have to keep it a secret.

We are shifting our attention to the pacific as we speak. We are soon going to render manned tactical flight against US forces an extremely wasteful endeavor. China won't be able to copy this tech and I hope another progressive president won't give it to them like Wild Bill gave them ICBM tech.
Conventional conflict still is all ours.
Thank you for telling the world how we, in fact militarily, won the Viet Nam war.It's too bad the POTUS blew it but, hell I didn't give a crap about France's businesses there anyway.
I would hate to lose WETA but.....you guys have some guns, you can handle an invasion without us anyway,right?
You have ANZAC powers that can easily defeat any aggressor like we can.
I will never understand how ANYONE can be so blind as to say China is OK.
No regime change? Ask Nepal. We are fighting another cold war with them.
I have heard similar sentiments from from GERMANICUS who in fact welcomed them as economic protectors as he fumed about the marines we based there.
He was Austrailian,so I guess you guys are in the same boat.

reply to post by Iwinder


Like you said..."We have never need a Fighter Jet in our country."

Now why do you think that is so? Perhaps being an ally as well as neighbor and we both know the two countries relationship goes much deeper than that. We have families that live in both...Millions of people who are part of both countries.

The other world powers know this. How do you think a country who is thinking about doing some form of Military action or perhaps taking advantage of Canada in some form or another? They are thinking about what the United States will do if they do anything.

Split Infinity

Originally posted by Agent_USA_Supporter
reply to post by SplitInfinity

 

It makes one wonder just exactly what is Chinas goal besides being a thorn in the side of the U.S.?

I have a question, whats America goal and reasoning the need for all those 1000+ bases in Europe?

Answer...to make sure we never have another War like WWI and WWII. The United States tried desperately to get the European Nations that impossed drastic and unreasonable War Reparations upon Post WWI Germany. The U.S. did all it could telling the European Victors that to do this would only force Germany to rebuild and create another war.

Well....another War is what we all got. Europeans could not even come to an agreement on how to stop Genocide in Bosnia.

That's why all those bases are there.

Split Infinity

reply to post by rockymcgilicutty


Imperialistic U.S.A. he said...LOL! Your right...the younger generation has forgotten or perhaps does not wish to study or understand HISTORY.

In early 1941 the United States and it's people were so sick of European Wars that the entire country was Isolationist. Roosevelt in an attempt to warn the American Public that World Politics and the at that time Nazi Leaderships drive to destroy the U.K. as it had already invaded Poland, Austria and others...Roosevelt still had an almost impossible task of garnishing any support what so ever from the American Public to fight either the Nazi's or the Japanese.

It took Pearl Harbor to force the American Public to go to war. The U.S. was anything but Imperialistic.

Now after two World Wars and after preventing the Soviets from Invading the Middle East and Europe as well as preventing a Nuclear War the United States finds itself strapped for cash after spending so much to keep so many safe.

The U.S. also finds itself as still the Worlds Largest Economy and this is all the more impressive in that only about 300 Million People live in the U.S. and that the close to 2 BILLION PEOPLE that live and work in the Worlds Second Largest Economy...China...has a population that is almost 7 TIMES that of the United States. This is astounding and even though the U.S. is just coming out of an economic downturn and has an enormous amount of debt it has been calculated that a 7% increase over the next 15 years in economic growth will generate enough tax revenue to drastically cut that deficit if spending can be placed under constraints.

The U.S. Military Budget is less than 6% of the total U.S. GNP which given the enormous size of the U.S. Military shows just how large the actual U.S. Economy is in fact. Compare this the theCold War Era Soviet Union where the Soviet Defense Budget was over 60% of their GNP.

The point is that the U.S. is even more of an Economic Superpower than a Military Superpower and that should China start screwing around with our allies as Japan is they run the risk of non Military actions such as the U.S. ceasing all purchases of goods from China. This would be even more devastating then say sinking the entire Chinese Navy.

Chinas economy in One Dimensional. It has been designed to provide cheap non strategic goods to the U.S. There is not a single item that the United States purchases from China that is necessary in any way. Add to this that if China was to attack Japan the U.S. could both stop all imports of Chinese Goods as well as stop payments upon U.S. Debt.

The combination of both these actions would absolutely destroy the Chinese Economy. Even just stopping Imports to the U.S. would bring China to it's knees as the Chinese have short sightedly based their entire economic system upon U.S. Demads for cheap goods. Without U.S. Purchases...the Chinese Economy would collapse in very short order.

Split Infinity

reply to post by HenryNorris


Chinese propagandist alert!