Switzerland village shocked as man allegedly opens fire with vintage military rifle, killing 3

reply to post by CJCrawley

maybeeeeees don't count.
history isn't based on a maybe.

maybe you should spend some time reviewing history, then you too can see the future

yes, there was and long before the Constitutional Convention as well.
perhaps you're just mistaken but if not, a good place for you to begin would be a book/movie known as Dances with Wolves

ever hear the phrase "all the Kings men" ??
well, in the beginning, they too were the 'lawmen' or don't they teach that in school anymore ?

in the beginning, it was MANDATED that every household kept a specific amount of arms and powders to use them.

i couldn't conscientiously be a "revenue agent of the state" for any amount of money.
it's ummm, UnAmerican.

And then enjoy a dramatic fall in the murder rate

don't you mean a dramatic increase, like in the UK ??

Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by CJCrawley

 

ever hear the phrase "all the Kings men" ??

Yes, it's from Humpty Dumpty, what of it?

[
in the beginning, it was MANDATED that every household kept a specific amount of arms and powders to use them.

Ah yes, the minutemen.

You have to disabuse yourselves of this 'minutemen mentality'.

Pssst......King George III is dead, guys.

reply to post by CJCrawley

Humpty Dumpty ? how old/young are you ?

uh no, not the minutemen ... they were much earlier.
www.ushistory.org...

Although today Minutemen are thought of as connected to the Revolutionary War in America, their existence was conceived in Massachusetts during the mid-seventeenth century. As early as 1645, men were selected from the militia ranks to be dressed with matchlocks or pikes and accoutrements within half an hour of being warned. In 1689 another type of Minuteman company came into existence. Called Snowshoemen, each was to "provide himself with a good pair of snowshoes, one pair of moggisons, and one hatchet" and to be ready to march on a moment's warning. Minutemen also played a role in the French and Indian War in the 1750's.

and they were not Americans ... like i said, when you learn some history, we'll talk.

psssst ... his offspring aren't

reply to post by Honor93


Honor darling, the phrase "all the king's men" is indeed from Humpty Dumpty.

"All the king's horses and all the king's men..."

Obviously it has been taken from this humble nursery rhyme to refer to something specific...care to enlighten me as to what that is?

My knowledge of American history is admittedly a little flaky, not being American (you will forgive me)

However, I do think my phrase 'minutemen mentality' is apropos, in as much as there is an entrenched culture of gun ownership in your great land which owes more to its historical context than it does to practicability in the modern world.

reply to post by CJCrawley


There certainly are armed police officers in the UK.

But that's the UK. If you want your countrymen disarmed, that's just fine and dandy with me.

As far as American is concerned, why don't you bring your little unarmed sheep arse over here and disarm us.

reply to post by CJCrawley

However, I do think my phrase 'minutemen mentality' is apropos, in as much as there is an entrenched culture of gun ownership in your great land which owes more to its historical context than it does to practicability in the modern world.

Not practical??? Please just stop graphically displaying your utter ignorance on the subject and embarrassing yourself. Armed citizens in America stop more crime then all law enforcement agencies in the entire country combined while gun deaths only account for 1.5% of total deaths. The practicality of guns in stopping and reducing crime and their relative safety in America is a proven fact over and over for centuries to the present day yet fools continue to parrot media propaganda like a monk chanting his mantra...

reply to post by CJCrawley

Crawley dear, i haven't recited a nursery rhyme in nearly 40yrs, so the thought never crossed my mind

however, if you'd like to explore a big boy book, you might try this one ... All the King's Men... or if you fancy poetry, Paradise Lost could get the point across.

the book is by an American author, circa 1946 and the poetry, from the 17th century.

HD has nothing to do with either - topic or point of pvs post

i would totally disagree with your last point.
the practicability of self-defense is eternal.

also, minutemen is not the correct answer to the question, regardless what you 'think'.

so, i'll give ya another chance to provide the correct answer.
are you game or too smug in your own ignorance to learn something ?

the question was ... ever hear the phrase "all the Kings men" ??
in the beginning, they too (king's men) were the 'lawmen' or don't they teach that in school anymore ?
... so, who were these 'king's men' who administered the law before the US was the US ?

i also said ... in the beginning, it was MANDATED that every household kept a specific amount of arms and powders to use them.

you erroneously presumed those ppl were the 'minutemen' and i showed you that is also incorrect. so, who were they ?

ETA - consider this, before the US Constitution was ratified sometime in 1788 (12ys post 1776/independence) the colonies governed themselves via the Articles of Confederation (in case you've never read them, you should)

in them, you will find the following ...

usgovinfo.about.com...
No vessel of war shall be kept up in time of peace by any State, except such number only, as shall be deemed necessary by the United States in Congress assembled, for the defense of such State, or its trade; nor shall any body of forces be kept up by any State in time of peace, except such number only, as in the judgement of the United States in Congress assembled, shall be deemed requisite to garrison the forts necessary for the defense of such State; but every State shall always keep up a well-regulated and disciplined militia, sufficiently armed and accoutered, and shall provide and constantly have ready for use, in public stores, a due number of filed pieces and tents, and a proper quantity of arms, ammunition and camp equipage.

from the very beginning, even while the process was developing and finalizing, firearms were considered a vital asset and part of every day life.

adding to that the population explosions ever since, firearms are as much a vital asset today as they were then.

reply to post by hawkiye

Not practical???

no, that's not what was typed.
not practice/able and i believe i understand what was meant but you might want to ask for clarification.

i took the short route ... self-defense not practicable ?
well, i think everyone knows the answer to that question.

self-defense is practiced eternally
(externally too but that wasn't what i meant )

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by CJCrawley

 

There certainly are armed police officers in the UK.

Yes, that's correct. But they are a specialist unit that only responds in emergencies where people's lives are at grave risk, ie siege and terrorist situations...mercifully rare.

I have only ever once in my life seen an armed police officer; that was about 9 years ago in the departure lounge of Manchester Airport.

Regular police don't carry weapons - I know, I live here.

But that's the UK. If you want your countrymen disarmed, that's just fine and dandy with me.

I do and they are. Thanks.

As far as American is concerned, why don't you bring your little unarmed sheep arse over here and disarm us.

I'm just offering advice, I don't expect you to take it, much less have any desire to want to change things in a country 3000 miles away.

I fully expect to read about regular cases of mass homicide in the US for the rest of my life - just as I have been doing these last 52 years.

edit on 6-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: The post wasn't printed as planned in the preview

Originally posted by hawkiye
reply to post by CJCrawley

 

However, I do think my phrase 'minutemen mentality' is apropos, in as much as there is an entrenched culture of gun ownership in your great land which owes more to its historical context than it does to practicability in the modern world.

Armed citizens in America stop more crime then all law enforcement agencies in the entire country combined while gun deaths only account for 1.5% of total deaths.

edit on 6-1-2013 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

I rather doubt it.

Do tell me the erudite publication you gleaned this fascinating factoid from.....the NRA newsletter?

reply to post by CJCrawley

who needs statistics ??
that my friend, is called common sense.

police RESPOND to a crime, they don't stop or prevent crime as we know it.
yes, special task forces seem to break some crime groups but for every one they intercept, 10 more begin.

crime in progress isn't something street cops generally encounter.
they are the 'clean up' crew.
so yes, based on reports from numerous sources, gun owners prevent more crime than any cop could hope to in his/her lifetime.

besides, what does this have to do with Switzerland anyway ?

reply to post by Honor93


I thank you Honor93 for the free lesson on American history.

Still unclear why you feel the need to carry a pistol around.....but then again, if I was over there I'd most likely do the same. After all, paranoia is contagious.

Self defence is natural and healthy and, so far as I am aware, isn't prohibited by anyone anywhere on the planet.

It's funny though, the last thing that comes to mind is blowing someone's brains out.

But then I've never needed to.

reply to post by CJCrawley

you're welcome and i hope it helped.

speaking purely for myself here - following 3 rapes, multiple assaults and a home invasion, i have finally taken responsibility for my own defense.
given the above, wouldn't you ?

i don't have a carry permit, yet.
and i don't consider anyone who does, paranoid simply because they do, why would you ?

don't you folks have 'girl scouts' or 'boy scouts' over there ?
here, we were taught from a very young age, be prepared.
hope for the best and prepare for the worst ... one day, it will save your life.

can't say i've ever needed to either but i have discharged my gun and wounded a person, intentionally. it really isn't that difficult given the right circumstances.

i don't relish the experience or wish to repeat it, however, i am glad to know i can and would, should it ever become necessary.

Originally posted by 800lbsGorilla
reply to post by Telos

 

This seems a bit convenient, after all the times I have seen the Swiss gun ownership model mentioned in response to the sandy Hook shooting in the last couple of weeks.

Could just be a coincidence but still.

In fact someone mentioned all the old WWI and WWII weapons in Europe hidden or not that are kept by folks to this day. Creepy man.

Originally posted by CJCrawley

Originally posted by hawkiye
reply to post by CJCrawley

 

However, I do think my phrase 'minutemen mentality' is apropos, in as much as there is an entrenched culture of gun ownership in your great land which owes more to its historical context than it does to practicability in the modern world.

Armed citizens in America stop more crime then all law enforcement agencies in the entire country combined while gun deaths only account for 1.5% of total deaths.

edit on 6-1-2013 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

I rather doubt it.

Do tell me the erudite publication you gleaned this fascinating factoid from.....the NRA newsletter?

The civil authorities publish info about crime rate drops in areas where C&C permits are issued. Or any moron can get the independent figures and do the math. And yea the NRA trumpets these figures thats what there thing is and why members pay them.