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Indian Women Turn to Guns After Gang Rape Outcry

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posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 03:54 PM
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I'm Scottish too...
thats 3 now! you picked a bad day to slag us off.

We are not ruled by English we basically have our own government and if Alex Salmond gets his way we will be independent very soon too, (though I'm moving to Liverpool for business reasons
)
edit on 2-1-2013 by roughycannon because: (no reason given)
edit on 2-1-2013 by roughycannon because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by MDDoxs


So gun grabbers. Do you support the rape and murder of these innocent women? Do you, in your self-righteousness, deny them the ability to defend themselves? What about your own daughters, sisters, mothers? Would you prefer they be brutally raped and beaten to death instead of having the right and ability to defend themselves?


Straw man much?

Your claim is shameful.

Better policing and deal with the laxity when it comes to crimes victimizing women in this country would be a good start, compared to giving every one a gun.
edit on 2-1-2013 by MDDoxs because: (no reason given)
Better policing?
Be serious; "when seconds count, the police are just minutes away". If and when they do show up, they might shoot you or your dog. They might go to the wrong address and shoot your neighbor. No thanks. It is better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.


Better policing works in Europe. We have low incidents of rape, you know.

It's not about seconds or minutes, if the right laws are in place and the police are relatively competent, the incidence of rape plummets as rapists are more likely to fear being caught. They don't have to be stopped in the act to be rumbled later on.

Here's a thought. Rape in America, higher than rape in most European countries. Gun count in America, higher than in most European countries. Hmmmm, I wonder.... wonder... I wonder..



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by GrandStrategy

Originally posted by GuidedKill
reply to post by GrandStrategy
 


Haven't you ever heard "don't bring a knife to a gun fight"?

I am not for taking away anyone's right to defend themselves either gun or knife. Do you really think the criminals who are setting out to commit crimes such as rape, battery, etc are fine with breaking those laws but in no way are going to break a firearm law?

What kind of logic are you working with exactly?


Oh sure I've heard that. I also heard of about 95% of Americas pro-gun posters crying from the roof tops that knifes are deadly as guns, that guns shouldn't be banned because people can kill just as many and just as easily with a knife.

I guess suddenly everyone's changed their mind now seeing as there hasn't been a mass murder in America for a week or two. Now we're back to 'guns are much more deadly than knives, knives aren't a good deterrent because they're useless'!?!!?!?

it's just funny to me that people hold polar opposite opinions and interchange them to suit the situation. When some American kid shoots up a school next year, I guarantee we'll be hearing again how knives are super deadly, and that by getting rid of guns the crime won't drop, because people will do the same with knives, and we'll see all these stories about "look, someone in china on a knife rampage!"

i'm just wondering, for my own sanity. Are guns significantly more dangerous and effective than knives or are they not? because i think i'm going mad seeing all the republicans on ATS flip-flopping around


Well lets look at the definition of Deadly shall we....

1dead·ly adjective \ˈded-lē\
dead·li·erdead·li·est

Definition of DEADLY

1
: likely to cause or capable of producing death
2
a : aiming to kill or destroy : implacable
b : highly effective
c : unerring
d : marked by determination or extreme seriousness
3
a : tending to deprive of force or vitality
b : suggestive of death especially in dullness or lack of animation
4
: very great : extreme
— dead·li·ness noun

Well by definition they are equal...They both are capable of the same thing so I wouldn't say one is worse then the other since both can cause harm and death...I can get you the definition of both "harm" and "death" if you don't know what they mean.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 03:56 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by MDDoxs


So gun grabbers. Do you support the rape and murder of these innocent women? Do you, in your self-righteousness, deny them the ability to defend themselves? What about your own daughters, sisters, mothers? Would you prefer they be brutally raped and beaten to death instead of having the right and ability to defend themselves?


Straw man much?

Your claim is shameful.

Better policing and deal with the laxity when it comes to crimes victimizing women in this country would be a good start, compared to giving every one a gun.
edit on 2-1-2013 by MDDoxs because: (no reason given)
Better policing?
Be serious; "when seconds count, the police are just minutes away". If and when they do show up, they might shoot you or your dog. They might go to the wrong address and shoot your neighbor. No thanks. It is better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.


That argument makes no sense. As many other countries do well enough without guns....

We have enough problems with gun regulation in the west and it would be foolish to assume it would work over seas.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 03:57 PM
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Originally posted by GrandStrategy


i'm just wondering, for my own sanity. Are guns significantly more dangerous and effective than knives or are they not? because i think i'm going mad seeing all the republicans on ATS flip-flopping around
Obviously you lack the capacity to understand, so let me spell it out. unarmed < Knife < gun < group of like minded gun owners. Do you understand now? Or must I simplify it even more?
edit on 2-1-2013 by DarthMuerte because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 03:58 PM
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Originally posted by roughycannon
I'm Scottish too...
thats 3 now! you picked a bad day slag us off.

We are not ruled by English we basically have our own government and if Alex Salmond gets his way we will be independent very soon too, (though I'm moving to Liverpool for business reasons
)
edit on 2-1-2013 by roughycannon because: (no reason given)


Nope still 2... I hail from Lancashire, the better, less inbred version of where Yorkshirelad is from



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 03:59 PM
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Originally posted by MDDoxs

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by MDDoxs


So gun grabbers. Do you support the rape and murder of these innocent women? Do you, in your self-righteousness, deny them the ability to defend themselves? What about your own daughters, sisters, mothers? Would you prefer they be brutally raped and beaten to death instead of having the right and ability to defend themselves?


Straw man much?

Your claim is shameful.

Better policing and deal with the laxity when it comes to crimes victimizing women in this country would be a good start, compared to giving every one a gun.
edit on 2-1-2013 by MDDoxs because: (no reason given)
Better policing?
Be serious; "when seconds count, the police are just minutes away". If and when they do show up, they might shoot you or your dog. They might go to the wrong address and shoot your neighbor. No thanks. It is better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.


That argument makes no sense. As many other countries do well enough without guns....

We have enough problems with gun regulation in the west and it would be foolish to assume it would work over seas.
Really? Did you read the article? This was in India. India is not in America. In America, these women could have defended themselves, in India; not so much. Reading comprehension...it's a wonderful thing.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:01 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by GrandStrategy


i'm just wondering, for my own sanity. Are guns significantly more dangerous and effective than knives or are they not? because i think i'm going mad seeing all the republicans on ATS flip-flopping around
Obviously you lack the capacity to understand, so let me spell it out. unarmed



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:02 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by MDDoxs

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by MDDoxs


So gun grabbers. Do you support the rape and murder of these innocent women? Do you, in your self-righteousness, deny them the ability to defend themselves? What about your own daughters, sisters, mothers? Would you prefer they be brutally raped and beaten to death instead of having the right and ability to defend themselves?


Straw man much?

Your claim is shameful.

Better policing and deal with the laxity when it comes to crimes victimizing women in this country would be a good start, compared to giving every one a gun.
edit on 2-1-2013 by MDDoxs because: (no reason given)
Better policing?
Be serious; "when seconds count, the police are just minutes away". If and when they do show up, they might shoot you or your dog. They might go to the wrong address and shoot your neighbor. No thanks. It is better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.


That argument makes no sense. As many other countries do well enough without guns....

We have enough problems with gun regulation in the west and it would be foolish to assume it would work over seas.
Really? Did you read the article? This was in India. India is not in America. In America, these women could have defended themselves, in India; not so much. Reading comprehension...it's a wonderful thing.


Then why, as his been pointed out twice to you now, does America suffer more rape crimes than most European nations?

For somebody going about attacking everybodies ability to read you aren't half a bit ehhhhhhhhhhhhh



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:03 PM
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Originally posted by GrandStrategy

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by GrandStrategy


i'm just wondering, for my own sanity. Are guns significantly more dangerous and effective than knives or are they not? because i think i'm going mad seeing all the republicans on ATS flip-flopping around
Obviously you lack the capacity to understand, so let me spell it out. unarmed < Knife < gun < group of like minded gun owners. No you understand now? Or must I simplify it even more?


Let me pictorially demonstrate it out for you.

Great, you bring those to a confrontation, and I will bring my guns.
edit on 2-1-2013 by DarthMuerte because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:04 PM
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There is a easy way to settle this IMO...

Prior to the 17th century were there mass murders??
Yes there was.

Post 17th century were there mass murders?
Yes the was.

So before the firearm was invented there were mass killings without the use of firearms. IMO mass murders will always happen with or without firearms.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:05 PM
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It sickens me to see people so adamant about hating an inanimate object that they would actually condone women being violated violently.
A gun is a great equalizer. It puts the victim on par physically with the criminal. But, some people would rather there were victims instead of a serious means of self defense



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:06 PM
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Originally posted by GuidedKill

Originally posted by GrandStrategy

Originally posted by GuidedKill
reply to post by GrandStrategy
 


Haven't you ever heard "don't bring a knife to a gun fight"?

I am not for taking away anyone's right to defend themselves either gun or knife. Do you really think the criminals who are setting out to commit crimes such as rape, battery, etc are fine with breaking those laws but in no way are going to break a firearm law?

What kind of logic are you working with exactly?


Oh sure I've heard that. I also heard of about 95% of Americas pro-gun posters crying from the roof tops that knifes are deadly as guns, that guns shouldn't be banned because people can kill just as many and just as easily with a knife.

I guess suddenly everyone's changed their mind now seeing as there hasn't been a mass murder in America for a week or two. Now we're back to 'guns are much more deadly than knives, knives aren't a good deterrent because they're useless'!?!!?!?

it's just funny to me that people hold polar opposite opinions and interchange them to suit the situation. When some American kid shoots up a school next year, I guarantee we'll be hearing again how knives are super deadly, and that by getting rid of guns the crime won't drop, because people will do the same with knives, and we'll see all these stories about "look, someone in china on a knife rampage!"

i'm just wondering, for my own sanity. Are guns significantly more dangerous and effective than knives or are they not? because i think i'm going mad seeing all the republicans on ATS flip-flopping around


Well lets look at the definition of Deadly shall we....

1dead·ly adjective \ˈded-lē\
dead·li·erdead·li·est

Definition of DEADLY

1
: likely to cause or capable of producing death
2
a : aiming to kill or destroy : implacable
b : highly effective
c : unerring
d : marked by determination or extreme seriousness
3
a : tending to deprive of force or vitality
b : suggestive of death especially in dullness or lack of animation
4
: very great : extreme
— dead·li·ness noun

Well by definition they are equal...They both are capable of the same thing so I wouldn't say one is worse then the other since both can cause harm and death...I can get you the definition of both "harm" and "death" if you don't know what they mean.


I thought I was making myself clear but let me try again.

Today many of ATS gun supporters are and will continue to say that, in relation to this story, knives are useless.

Yet, go back to after any of the recent shootings in America and ATS gun supporters have argued, almost overwhelmingly from my observations(sure some will dispute that) that guns aren't that bad, knives are just as dangerous, no point banning guns, massacres and murder won't drop seeing as people will just use knives instead.

Now if you can't see what I'm scratching at here I don't think I can do much better.

The effectiveness and apparent danger of knives and guns, relative to one another, seems to change depending on what the thread is about. If it's about mass shootings in america, knives are invariably hailed as just as lethal and effective at killing people. Then the topic switches to Indian women being raped, and they must have guns, knives just aren't sufficient

Get it?



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:07 PM
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reply to post by GrandStrategy
 


Because we are WAY bigger than europe.
By the way it isn't as easy as you would think to kill with a blade without training,a gun would be far more effective in defense.
Macho leaves the building when she cocks that gun,in any country.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by GrandStrategy

Women get raped all the time in America. Guns don't stop rape. What stops rape is living in a decent society, a democracy, you know, with liberal laws, healthcare, education, no death penalty, no guns, no conservative assholes with backwards attitudes towards women.



I live in a decent society, a democracy, with liberal laws and education and positive attitudes towards women.

Guess what. Got raped anyway.

If I'd had a gun, would I have used it? Probably not; I was young and terrified.

But if someone tried to hurt me again, he'll yes I'd shoot him.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:10 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by GrandStrategy

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by GrandStrategy


i'm just wondering, for my own sanity. Are guns significantly more dangerous and effective than knives or are they not? because i think i'm going mad seeing all the republicans on ATS flip-flopping around
Obviously you lack the capacity to understand, so let me spell it out. unarmed < Knife < gun < group of like minded gun owners. No you understand now? Or must I simplify it even more?


Let me pictorially demonstrate it out for you.

Great, you bring those to a confrontation, and I will bring my guns.
edit on 2-1-2013 by DarthMuerte because: (no reason given)


ATS's very own Onyx over here, threatening to throw the guns around. Buck buck.

Settle yourself.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:12 PM
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I love how the fools believe police = crime prevention. Police are to there to show up and write up a "police report". Since you know most criminals don't wait around after they commit a crime. You folks from England act as if it was out of the goodness of their hearts the ruling class gave up so much of its power. Nope the gun made all the time and money it took for the training of the epitome of noble power "the knight" useless. One gun vs a guy in armor on horseback, guess who wins. History does repeat itself instead of knights now it is police and military serving the rulers.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:13 PM
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Originally posted by cavtrooper7
reply to post by GrandStrategy
 


Because we are WAY bigger than europe.
By the way it isn't as easy as you would think to kill with a blade without training,a gun would be far more effective in defense.
Macho leaves the building when she cocks that gun,in any country.


It has nothing to do with size, talking about rape on a per head basis.

By the way cav, that was actually my point. I know it's harder to kill with a knife. But after James Holmes shooting what did all the gun advocates say? After Sandy Hook what did all the gun advocates say? They said knives are just as easy to gun on a murder spree with.

So you can see where I'm trying to come from. We've had to put up with so many gun defenders telling us, over and over, that knives are just as easy to kill with. But now the topic changes to rape in India and many of the same people(Muerte) are saying oh no, they need guns, knives won't do the trick.



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:14 PM
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Originally posted by GrandStrategy

Then why, as his been pointed out twice to you now, does America suffer more rape crimes than most European nations?
Because you are either mistaken or lying. I am not sure which, therefore I will give you the benefit of the doubt and go with mistaken and too lazy to research. In rapes per capita, the US did not even make the top 50 countries in 2008(the latest I could find a breakdown for) and in 2009 we were #57 for total number of rapes. I stand ready to receive your apology for such a brazen misstatement of fact.

Link



posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 04:14 PM
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Originally posted by GrandStrategy
Women get raped all the time in America. Guns don't stop rape. What stops rape is living in a decent society, a democracy, you know, with liberal laws, healthcare, education, no death penalty, no guns, no conservative assholes with backwards attitudes towards women....


How does liberal laws affect safety?

The city violent crime rate for San Francisco in 2010 was higher than the national violent crime rate average by 73.93% and the city property crime rate in San Francisco was higher than the national property crime rate average by 34.4%.

In 2010 the city violent crime rate in San Francisco was higher than the violent crime rate in California by 59.35% and the city property crime rate in San Francisco was higher than the property crime rate in California by 50%.

Source.




In 2011, there were nearly 3 times as many rapes as there were murders in San Francisco.
Source

edit on 1/2/2013 by abecedarian because: (no reason given)





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