Illinois Bill to Ban all Modern Firearms, page 3

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 23 times

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 08:29 AM by cosmicexplorer

reply to post by LuckyLucian

Well there is a lot of subjective language in that bill that will be used however they see fit. Let me give you an example.

In Illinois the A6 dui ticket states that if any amount of drug comes back in your system that is on the list of drugs you can't be driving with it then you can be charged with DUI. So guess what my department did...they wanted us to start asking suspected pot smokers if they had smoked pot in the last week. Most of them were honest and would state "yes". Well then we had guys making a dui arrest even the person wasnt impaired...under the law it said they had cannabis in their system. Now different prosecutors have viewed the law different ways. Some say you need impairment while others think you don't. DUI generate revenue so you have people pushing the limits of the law on it and its absolutely awful in my opinion of what they are doing.

How hard do you think it would be to get a search warrant into someone's house because they had a possible illegal gun? Thus "police coming to confiscate it". Bet that would generate some money. And the descriptions of assault weapons are pretty open. And just wait til the tax on firearms comes out.

So my reply to you is this...When you aren't part of the law...you don't see how they squeeze the life out of words to make things fit their needs, which is understandable. But when you are part of the law and work with laws written just like this one...you can see where it is going. I can name numerous examples like the DUI law above.

At the same time as this stuff is coming out Illinois is starting to make loads of money of gambling machines in bars....only in bars though...can't have em anywhere else. Its all about money.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 08:38 AM by cosmicexplorer

Originally posted by WaterBottle
ATS; the place where "patriots" pretend to be into politics but do not care enough to read the actual bill in question.

I wrote a more detailed post responding to people's concerns of not reading the bill above, but I'll summarize again.

Laws are written to contain some gray which leaves flexibility for prosecutors. Above a mentions a horrible take that some departments do to charge people with DUI when the suspect isn't even impaired.

Ill give another example. In Illinois if you get into a fight and its in a "public" place it is aggravated battery instead of battery. So in theory every bar fight...is a felony. So lets say I show up to a bar fight between you and another guy and your 5 friends say he started it and his 5 friends say you started it. I could arrest both of you for felony aggravated battery because hey...i have 5 witnesses on each side saying you both started it and its in a public place. 2 lives potentially ruined over a freaking bar fight.

Now most officers have the understanding and compassion to just make sure no one is hurt and get everyone home with nothing more than a little ass chewing...in same cases we do make arrests..but where Im at we have 10 bar fights a night on thursday, friday, and saturday night. That could be 30 felons a weekend!

When you give cops tools like this...gray subjective laws...they will use them. Administrators will see dollar signs, the state will see dollar signs, some cops will think of creative ways to arrest people they are problems with society. Not all of this is bad, but law enforcement is turning into a business instead of enforcing laws with understanding and compassion.

So...what I'm saying is from my end...I can see where this is going and I can read between the lines. Perhaps if you yourself have experience in law I would say ok...bring the debate to the table. But if you don't...I wouldn't expect you to see the things I see.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 08:45 AM by marg6043

reply to post by beezzer

And that is the one million question and the answer that anti gunners love to flip flop because of their agenda that after all comes in different packages, ones with just an agenda from God, second an agenda from criminals, third agendas from the government and last agendas from those that have not clue what their agenda is, as long as goes along with somebody else agenda

Got to love the sheeple, the followers, the fundamentalist, the flip flappers and the simple brain death in America.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 08:59 AM by cosmicexplorer

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by cosmicexplorer

How will Illinois be "safer"?

Only criminals will have weapons if there is a ban.

*shakes head*

You are exactly right...

A cops response time to some parts of town is 5 minutes....in 5 minutes someone can break into your house shoot you take your crap and leave before we even get there. That is really the only reason I like having a gun outside of sport...is to defend my home.

90% of all single gun shot victims survive. A gun doesn't instantly take you down. So if you only have 10 rounds in a magazine and are attempting to shoot an intruder in a complex situation how many rounds do you think are going to hit? Keeping in mind that even 1 hit most likely will not defeat your opponent.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:00 AM by USVET

As a SF and Marine Vet I took an oath to uphold the constitution against all ENEMIES FORIEGN AND DOMESTIC..... an oath I took very serious as well as thousands of my brothers!! I will stand by my convictions as my forefathers did and if necessary will die by those convictions. As for those I love if I fail to stand by those convictions when things get tuff or when tyranny comes knocking at our doors then I do not deserve their respect or love. Our forefathers sacrificed everything for their beliefs and I believe me and all vets in America will do the same... for together we are strong... SEMPER FI!!!

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:02 AM by camaro68ss

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by cosmicexplorer

How will Illinois be "safer"?

Only criminals will have weapons if there is a ban.

*shakes head*

I think its a start of a bigger objective. Illinois will be the first state to condition the people to be exposed to a post constitutional world. you'll see this slowly rollout over all the states. TPTB are running out of time and need to move faster to get there one world government. People are starting to wake up.

Yeah it sounds craz, but the use to be fringe is now turning to reality. We need to take a hard look at what the true agendas are here. Everything is happening at once and it smells fishy

edit on 3-1-2013 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:05 AM by cosmicexplorer

Originally posted by camaro68ss

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by cosmicexplorer

How will Illinois be "safer"?

Only criminals will have weapons if there is a ban.

*shakes head*

I think its a start of a bigger objective. Illinois will be the first state to condition the people to be exposed to a post constitutional world. you'll see this slowly rollout over all the states. TPTB are running out of time and need to move faster to get there one world government. People are starting to wake up

I never thought of it like that...maybe Illinois is just one big experiment to see..."how things go". Great take on it.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:11 AM by marg6043

reply to post by camaro68ss

You should be happy to know that other states that had tried had failed to do so, they can control the type of guns that are allowed to be use or how you can wear you gun, two states have the strictest gun bans, but can not ban privately own guns, DC and California, but been a constitutional issue only the ruling of the Supreme court after a Federal law against guns can change the outcome of the second amendment.

That is never going to happen, the Supreme court most of the time will preserve the constitution and avoid amendments and the 2nd amendment applies to the citizens of the United States regardless of state laws.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:13 AM by camaro68ss

Originally posted by cosmicexplorer

Originally posted by camaro68ss

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by cosmicexplorer

How will Illinois be "safer"?

Only criminals will have weapons if there is a ban.

*shakes head*

I think its a start of a bigger objective. Illinois will be the first state to condition the people to be exposed to a post constitutional world. you'll see this slowly rollout over all the states. TPTB are running out of time and need to move faster to get there one world government. People are starting to wake up

I never thought of it like that...maybe Illinois is just one big experiment to see..."how things go". Great take on it.

Think of it this way, why are we training UN troops on our land on how to police the people?

Once this all goes down and the confiscations start, people will resist. Patriots and federal police will die. I say federal because no local police in their right mind will go house to house in their own town and take guns.

Once the casualties start to rise, the UN is called in to help. “HINT HINT” UN gun treaty anyone??? And eventually you will have UN troops busting down doors and taking guns. You say its crazy, I see it happening, all signs are pointing that way.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:18 AM by camaro68ss

Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by camaro68ss

You should be happy to know that other states that had tried had failed to do so, they can control the type of guns that are allowed to be use or how you can wear you gun, two states have the strictest gun bans, but can not ban privately own guns, DC and California, but been a constitutional issue only the ruling of the Supreme court after a Federal law against guns can change the outcome of the second amendment.

That is never going to happen, the Supreme court most of the time will preserve the constitution and avoid amendments and the 2nd amendment applies to the citizens of the United States regardless of state laws.

I would like to think that but come on. the constitution has been ripped apart in the last 10 years.
Nationwide gun ban
Confiscation
Resistance
Marshal law
UN troops enter to help.
ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT.
As this is all happening the economy will be collapsing

edit on 3-1-2013 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:21 AM by marg6043

reply to post by camaro68ss

But my friend you still have the right to own a gun, that has not changed at all, so the second amendment sitll stand regardless of what states or federal government wants or try to do.

Just remember that, only a supreme court ruling after a Federal law passing against guns can change the second amendment.

and is not going to happen at least no in our life time.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:32 AM by USVET

If this is the secret agenda of our gov'nt ( one world order) then it will be up to the american resistance to uphold our constitution...

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:35 AM by camaro68ss

Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by camaro68ss

But my friend you still have the right to own a gun, that has not changed at all, so the second amendment sitll stand regardless of what states or federal government wants or try to do.

Just remember that, only a supreme court ruling after a Federal law passing against guns can change the second amendment.

and is not going to happen at least no in our life time.

for our sake I hope your right.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 09:56 AM by lolita64

reply to post by marg6043

Just remember that, only a supreme court ruling after a Federal law passing against guns can change the second amendment.

and is not going to happen at least no in our life time.

You're about to die or??

Unless there's a real pro-gun president next time around, the few left at SCOTUS who still support the 2nd amendment will be replaced by hardcore anti-gunners like Sotomayor and Kagan. I say at the latest, 2017-2018, SCOTUS will be packed with anti-gunners.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 12:05 PM by dogstar23

reply to post by cosmicexplorer

In a way, I kind of hope such a bill passes. It would open the door for the courts to COMPLETELY reverse it and make all guns which are federally legal, legal in Illinois. Much the way the concealed carry ban in Illinois ended up just recently being turned around by the courts into IL becoming a full concealed-carry state, this could easily backfire on the politicians. It may take time, but the courts will flip this thing right on its back.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 12:23 PM by dogstar23

Originally posted by lolita64
reply to post by marg6043

Just remember that, only a supreme court ruling after a Federal law passing against guns can change the second amendment.

and is not going to happen at least no in our life time.

You're about to die or??

Unless there's a real pro-gun president next time around, the few left at SCOTUS who still support the 2nd amendment will be replaced by hardcore anti-gunners like Sotomayor and Kagan. I say at the latest, 2017-2018, SCOTUS will be packed with anti-gunners.

Are you saying you expect several of the Supreme Court Justices to die over the next 4-5 years? Right now it is looking highly doubtful that the Supreme Court would turn toward supporting gun bans anytime in the near future. The Republican party is looking like it may have a very difficult time winning the presidency for a very long time, but that doesn't mean any appointees of future presidents will be automatically confirmed by Congress.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 12:32 PM by woogleuk

The Second Amendment (Amendment II) to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights that protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms. It was adopted on December 15, 1791

The StG 44, the first true assault rifle, was adopted by the Wehrmacht in 1944.

Personally I don't see the problem with banning assault rifles, not like they are called defense rifles right? Given the fact they didn't exist when the 2nd amendment was put into place it should be a non-issue.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 12:40 PM by Zer0megAlpha

Damn, this is bad. I live in Chicago so I guess everyone here is in a bad situation. Only criminals will have guns... We're screwed...

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 12:46 PM by beezzer

reply to post by cosmicexplorer

Please, this in no way is meant as disrespect . . .

If the government takes away our weapons then we will be reliant on the "state" to protect us.

Police, (state, local, federal) will be the "nannies" to keep us safe instead of people taking personal responsibility for their own safety.

reply posted on 3-1-2013 @ 12:46 PM by NavyDoc

Originally posted by woogleuk

The Second Amendment (Amendment II) to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights that protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms. It was adopted on December 15, 1791

The StG 44, the first true assault rifle, was adopted by the Wehrmacht in 1944.

Personally I don't see the problem with banning assault rifles, not like they are called defense rifles right? Given the fact they didn't exist when the 2nd amendment was put into place it should be a non-issue.

Neither did the typewriter exist when the first amendment was drafted.

Assault weapons are alredy banned without special liscensing in the US since 1934, but you already knew that, right?

edit on 3-1-2013 by NavyDoc because: (no reason given)

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