Need help with a bet: Injections of anabolic steroids will NOT increase muscle if you do not exercis, page 1

Pages: << 1 2 3 4 >>
ATS Members have flagged this thread 6 times

Topic started on 1-1-2013 @ 01:35 PM by FlySolo

So I Invited this guy who lives in my building who likes to claim he is in the know about so many things over for some beer the other night. I was slightly annoyed with his arrogance on so many topics but decided to hear him out. Then he went off saying you can inject anabolic steriods, sit on the couch eating potato chips and gain muscle mass.

**coughBullSh!tcough** I said. You will get fat. Noo noo dude, you don't know what you're talking about he said. I placed a bet of $25 and we shook hands. I told him I don't want to see a blog about it and seeing I've been on ATS for so long, I asked for a peer reviewed paper.

So then he sends me this....
American Journal of Physiology

I'm reading it, but to be honest, I can't discern between normal testosterone and anabolic steroids in this paper. I basically need a medical dictionary just to get through it.

My gut feeling about this guy is he's just a big mouth and this morning I get a text "got my 25 bucks?"
So before I get flamed for taking the bet without being knowledgeable on steroids, I had to go with my gut and common sense. Potato chips on the couch without working out will gain mass? C'mon that's too hard to just accept from a complete stranger.

I can seen in this study there are gains, but I need to weed out the half truths in here. Anyone care to take a stab with me?

ETA: this bet will also help me decide if this guy is "friend worthy"

edit on 1-1-2013 by FlySolo because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:43 PM by Chenbo

reply to post by FlySolo

Your correct in what you say. Sitting on your butt all day and gaining muscle is never going to happen.

Muscles get bigger by being damaged/torn and then repairing themselves. If your not doing that then no muscle gain will be achieved. Like you said,,,, you will get fat.

No exercise equals no muscle gain. Steroids or not

edit on 1-1-2013 by Chenbo because: because

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:46 PM by SpaDe_

Actually I think your friend might be right. You can actually be more physically fit just by thinking yourself to be that way. It's a proven scientific study.

Link

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:47 PM by TheDebunkMachine

your friend is 100% right. sorry. testosterone is an androgen, androgens are anabolic. it does not matter if you work out or not, but obviously you will gain much more muscle if you do work out while cycling. This is why men are more muscular than women, even though most men dont work out, its because we have far more testosterone. and the stronger the steroid you take, the more anabolic they are. its fully possible for someone to run anadrol or tren and not work out and gain more muscle then a person working out but not on steroids. these hormones all have anabolic effects, they will increase muscle regardless of exercise. But dont be stupid enough to run a cycle and not work out, because you will still make FAR more gains with working out.

For the study, essentially what its saying is that muscle mass increased proportionally to the amount of test e given. the group who were given 125 mg gained an average of 3.4 kg of muscle mass over 20 weeks, 300 mg gained 5.2 kg, and 600 mg gained 7.9. They also measured increases in strength, hemoglobin (the protein in your blood which carries oxygen to the muscles, essentially a marker for better fitness), Insulin like growth factor 1, which is an anabolic hormone that stimulates growth, like HGH, but is more similar to insulin structurally, and they measured decreases in fat mass

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:47 PM by FlySolo

reply to post by Chenbo

Yes I would think so too, but what does this mean?

The changes in fat-free mass were highly dependent on testosterone dose (P = 0.0001) and correlated with log testosterone concentrations (r = 0.73, P = 0.0001). Changes in leg press strength, leg power, thigh and quadriceps muscle volumes, hemoglobin, and IGF-I were positively correlated with testosterone concentrations, whereas changes in fat mass and plasma high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol were negatively correlated.

I'm still reading the paper but I can't find anywhere yet stating you don't need to be doing anything

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:48 PM by TheDebunkMachine

reply to post by Chenbo

untrue

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:48 PM by tonybotzo

reply to post by SpaDe_

it is not!

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:48 PM by TheDebunkMachine

Originally posted by FlySolo
reply to post by Chenbo

Yes I would think so too, but what does this mean?

The changes in fat-free mass were highly dependent on testosterone dose (P = 0.0001) and correlated with log testosterone concentrations (r = 0.73, P = 0.0001). Changes in leg press strength, leg power, thigh and quadriceps muscle volumes, hemoglobin, and IGF-I were positively correlated with testosterone concentrations, whereas changes in fat mass and plasma high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol were negatively correlated.

I'm still reading the paper but I can't find anywhere yet stating you don't need to be doing anything

Exercise stimulus.
The participants were asked not to undertake strength training or moderate-to-heavy endurance exercise during the study. These instructions were reinforced every 4 wk.

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:49 PM by LittleBlackEagle

with the anabolic levels in steroids, yes you can gain muscle without exercising. you wont gain nearly as much but your lean muscle mass will increase.

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:53 PM by mee30

reply to post by FlySolo

The study the guy provided does not apply to your bet! Did they sit on the coach eating crisps all day for the study? Nah... They were going about their daily lives and no doubt using their muscles in the process so saw a gain...

As for the bet I would side with you but I will admit that I do not know for sure... I've always been taught muscle needs to be torn to grow...

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:53 PM by FlySolo

Ok, sounds like I've got some paying up to do. However....however...what about fat increase along with the muscle mass? Maybe a 50/50 draw?

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:56 PM by LittleBlackEagle

Originally posted by FlySolo
Ok, sounds like I've got some paying up to do. However....however...what about fat increase along with the muscle mass? Maybe a 50/50 draw?

the higher anabolic levels will reduce fat and increase muscle up to a point. this is why they give anabolic steroids to patients in the hospital who are loosing too much mass, for various reasons.

edit on 1-1-2013 by LittleBlackEagle because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:57 PM by RussianScientists

reply to post by FlySolo

Your correct, and steroids will also make you BALD!!!!!

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 01:58 PM by mee30

reply to post by TheDebunkMachine

They may well have been asked but many daily activities are basically work outs to a degree... Opening a stiff door like at a supermarket, carrying the shopping bags... Bending down to tie your laces... Walking, running for the bus... Climbing the stairs... There are many things... They are not sat on the sofa all day eating crisps... So the study is irrelevant.

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 02:00 PM by Chenbo

reply to post by FlySolo

All i can say is well i'll be fooked. Not sure of the reliability of the source but check this out. If true I stand corrected and have learnt something new today

www.aworkoutroutine.com...

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 02:00 PM by MJZoo

Originally posted by RussianScientists
reply to post by FlySolo

Your correct, and steroids will also make you BALD!!!!!

Not always true. I know more than a couple guys who take large amounts of anabolics and have a full head of thick hair.

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 02:00 PM by FlySolo

Originally posted by mee30
reply to post by FlySolo

The study the guy provided does not apply to your bet! Did they sit on the coach eating crisps all day for the study? Nah... They were going about their daily lives and no doubt using their muscles in the process so saw a gain...

As for the bet I would side with you but I will admit that I do not know for sure... I've always been taught muscle needs to be torn to grow...

I knew there would be a technicality in this bet

The participants were asked not to undertake strength training or moderate-to-heavy endurance exercise during the study.

You're right. it doesn't say anything in the study stating participants should remain still or avoid the most minimal exercise.

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 02:04 PM by TheDebunkMachine

Originally posted by mee30
reply to post by TheDebunkMachine

They may well have been asked but many daily activities are basically work outs to a degree... Opening a stiff door like at a supermarket, carrying the shopping bags... Bending down to tie your laces... Walking, running for the bus... Climbing the stairs... There are many things... They are not sat on the sofa all day eating crisps... So the study is irrelevant.

no, its 100% relevant. The daily tasks people do do not qualify as exercise, we are fully able to do them and they don impact us that much. A guy sitting on a sofa is moving his arms to eat chips, or his hands to change the tv, he walks to go to the kitchen or bathroom. and either way, he would still gain muscle mass, it appears your knowledge of hormones is very underdeveloped. Hormones will bind no matter what, if you are given an anabolic steroid (anabolism: Anabolism (from Greek ana, "upward", and ballein, "to throw") is the set of metabolic pathways that construct molecules from smaller units) you will gain muscle mass, because an anabolic steroid always stimulates anabolism, regardless of activity. How do you think babys grow when they cant even walk or move for up to a year and a half of their life? Its because hormones such as HGH, IGF-1, Testosterone and other growth factor hormones are doing their job, which is anabolism.

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 02:04 PM by BSFC123

Steroids basically up your genetic potential. Your testosterone increase and so yeah, you can do next to nothing and your body will burn more fat, retain and add muscle....yes, if you workout heavy you will blow up, but even sitting around, your body will burn more fat and retain muscle.

You ever seen the guys who can eat two pizzas and drink a twelve pack of beer every few nights, hit the gym twice a week, and still be ripped up? It's genetics. Steroids basically hugely improve your genetics while taking them. Course they also cause cancer, man boobs and once a guy gets off of them it's back to flabby girlie man.

reply posted on 1-1-2013 @ 02:05 PM by FlySolo

Originally posted by Chenbo
reply to post by FlySolo

All i can say is well i'll be fooked. Not sure of the reliability of the source but check this out. If true I stand corrected and have learnt something new today

www.aworkoutroutine.com...

Oyvey I'm fooked too.

Group 2 (no exercise, drug use) was able to build about 7 pounds of muscle. That’s not a typo. The group receiving testosterone injections and NOT working out at all gained 7 pounds of muscle.

I remember him telling me 8 lbs of muscle that night but close enough.

Pages: << 1 2 3 4 >> ^^TOP^^