"I think, therefore I am" is NOT an absolute certainty, here's why, and here is a statement that

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posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:24 AM
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Originally posted by IAmD1
My understanding is that existence gives rise to thought that points the thinker back to existence in the form of the thinking I Am. By saying I think, therefore I Am you are opening up for the interpretation and understanding that there is an order in which thought creates the being. However that never sat well with me. By reversing the order and saying ' I Am, therefore I think' the order of the functions become being creates thinking and in thinking 'I Am' I can recognize me as part of being. When I stop thinking I do not automatically stop being but as soon as I stop being thinking can no longer be sustained.

However I do agree that the fact that I think and can formulate the thought 'I think....' is a good proof that there is something in existence that is thinking this of which I am a apart.


Thinking happens. The seeing of the thought happens. No one is doing it - it is all done.
The seeing is primary because without seeing happening no thought could be seen.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.




posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:33 AM
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Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thinking happens. The seeing of the thought happens. No one is doing it - it is all done.
The seeing is primary because without seeing happening no thought could be seen.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.


Thinking happens from the perspective of seeing (I Am (seeing) therefore I think (it happens))?



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:37 AM
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reply to post by arpgme
 


It's much simpler.

You are not your thoughts.

However, you can be aware of your thoughts.

I am aware, therefore I exist, whatever "I" means...



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:37 AM
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Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thinking happens. The seeing of the thought happens. No one is doing it - it is all done.
The seeing is primary because without seeing happening no thought could be seen.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.


Thinking happens from the perspective of seeing (I Am (seeing) therefore I think (it happens))?



Thought is seen and known to be happening.
The seeing of the thought happening.
Seeing is happening.
Awareness is seeing consciousness.

Awareness sees. It is happening and no one is doing it.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:49 AM
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reply to post by trysts
 


You're very welcome

I thoroughly enjoyed them



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:49 AM
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Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thought is seen and known to be happening.
The seeing of the thought happening.
Seeing is happening.
Awareness is seeing consciousness.

Awareness sees. It is happening and no one is doing it.




Seeing and not seeing are both happening, awareness and not awareness are both happening, thinking and not thinking are both happening. However happening and not happening is not happening.

It's only funny when you get it....is getting it happening?


edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:53 AM
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Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thought is seen and known to be happening.
The seeing of the thought happening.
Seeing is happening.
Awareness is seeing consciousness.

Awareness sees. It is happening and no one is doing it.




Seeing and not seeing are both happening, awareness and not awareness are both happening, thinking and not thinking are both happening. However happening and not happening is not happening.

It's only funny when you get it....is getting it happening?


edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)


Seeing never stops happening and that 'seeing' is awareness. It is the one constant.
Sometimes it sees thought happening but thought is not constant.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.
edit on 31-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:55 AM
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I personally would say "I think, so you exist, and everything is a product of my perceptions.. Perception that I own.. And without those perceptions you would not exist"..



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:55 AM
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reply to post by IAmD1
 



Originally posted by IAmD1
awareness and not awareness are both happening,


I disagree, awareness (perceiving) is always happening. Unconsciousness - when you have no dream , you are still aware (because of the emptiness), you are just not aware of your "SELF" being aware of this emptiness.


reply to post by sconner755
 




Originally posted by sconner755
reply to post by arpgme
 


It's much simpler.

You are not your thoughts.

However, you can be aware of your thoughts.

I am aware, therefore I exist, whatever "I" means...



To exist in reality - is to occur as a form in reality (existence = an occuring)

awareness/perceiving happens/occurs

Occurrence/Action/Happenings/Events/Movement (However you want to say it) is the basis of it all.

"All is occurrence".

Name one thing that does not occur? You can't because even if it is just a thought of something - it still occurs as an arising of thought in the mind (so even that is still a form of movement/action/occurrence).



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:57 AM
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reply to post by Itisnowagain
 


Agreeing that it is so.... but feel that there is understanding of this or there is not. When there is not understanding it can be brought about by inquiry - inquiry happens when what is believed is being tested just enough that curiosity is triggered. If the question lies entirely outside of 'ones reality' as understood at any given time it is simply disregarded as nonsense. Seeing is not happening as a result.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:57 AM
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Actually its like this guys, there is just me and the rest of you are illusions of my reality. Im God and everything is being created by me.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:02 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by IAmD1
 



Originally posted by IAmD1
awareness and not awareness are both happening,


I disagree, awareness (perceiving) is always happening. Unconsciousness - when you have no dream , you are still aware (because of the emptiness), you are just not aware of your "SELF" being aware of this emptiness.



Are you aware(perceiving) what I am doing at present? If not then we could say that awareness is not happening of what I am doing at this time. However Awareness is happening in other things all the time.

So awareness is constant what awareness' focus is is not. Hence awareness and not awareness are both happening.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:03 AM
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Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thought is seen and known to be happening.
The seeing of the thought happening.
Seeing is happening.
Awareness is seeing consciousness.

Awareness sees. It is happening and no one is doing it.




Seeing and not seeing are both happening, awareness and not awareness are both happening, thinking and not thinking are both happening. However happening and not happening is not happening.

It's only funny when you get it....is getting it happening?


edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)


Seeing never stops happening and that 'seeing' is awareness. It is the one constant.
Sometimes it sees thought happening but thought is not constant.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.
edit on 31-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)


Are you aware(seeing) what I am doing at present? If not then we could say that awareness (seeing) is not happening of what I am doing at this time. However Awareness is happening in other things all the time.

So awareness is constant what awareness' focus is is not. Hence awareness(seeing) and not awareness(seeing) are both happening.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:16 AM
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Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thought is seen and known to be happening.
The seeing of the thought happening.
Seeing is happening.
Awareness is seeing consciousness.

Awareness sees. It is happening and no one is doing it.




Seeing and not seeing are both happening, awareness and not awareness are both happening, thinking and not thinking are both happening. However happening and not happening is not happening.

It's only funny when you get it....is getting it happening?


edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)


Seeing never stops happening and that 'seeing' is awareness. It is the one constant.
Sometimes it sees thought happening but thought is not constant.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.
edit on 31-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)


Are you aware(seeing) what I am doing at present? If not then we could say that awareness (seeing) is not happening of what I am doing at this time. However Awareness is happening in other things all the time.

So awareness is constant what awareness' focus is is not. Hence awareness(seeing) and not awareness(seeing) are both happening.


I am aware always. I am aware of all that is hapening presently. Awareness is aware always of 'something' unless it is in deep sleep were it is not seeing 'any thing'.

It seems you believe in other.
edit on 31-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:23 AM
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Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thought is seen and known to be happening.
The seeing of the thought happening.
Seeing is happening.
Awareness is seeing consciousness.

Awareness sees. It is happening and no one is doing it.




Seeing and not seeing are both happening, awareness and not awareness are both happening, thinking and not thinking are both happening. However happening and not happening is not happening.

It's only funny when you get it....is getting it happening?


edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)


Seeing never stops happening and that 'seeing' is awareness. It is the one constant.
Sometimes it sees thought happening but thought is not constant.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.
edit on 31-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)


Are you aware(seeing) what I am doing at present? If not then we could say that awareness (seeing) is not happening of what I am doing at this time. However Awareness is happening in other things all the time.

So awareness is constant what awareness' focus is is not. Hence awareness(seeing) and not awareness(seeing) are both happening.


I am aware always. I am aware of all that is hapening presently.

It seems you believe in other.


It seems that question proves that you are not although I Am always aware. Hence awareness and not awareness are both happening.

A question for you...what is important?
edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:25 AM
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Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by IAmD1

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Thought is seen and known to be happening.
The seeing of the thought happening.
Seeing is happening.
Awareness is seeing consciousness.

Awareness sees. It is happening and no one is doing it.




Seeing and not seeing are both happening, awareness and not awareness are both happening, thinking and not thinking are both happening. However happening and not happening is not happening.

It's only funny when you get it....is getting it happening?


edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)


Seeing never stops happening and that 'seeing' is awareness. It is the one constant.
Sometimes it sees thought happening but thought is not constant.

All seeing, all knowing and everpresent.
edit on 31-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)


Are you aware(seeing) what I am doing at present? If not then we could say that awareness (seeing) is not happening of what I am doing at this time. However Awareness is happening in other things all the time.

So awareness is constant what awareness' focus is is not. Hence awareness(seeing) and not awareness(seeing) are both happening.


I am aware always. I am aware of all that is hapening presently.

It seems you believe in other.


It seems that question proves that you are not although I Am always aware. Hence awareness and not awareness are both happening.


Firstly, what 'question' proves what?

Awareness is aware - that's what it does - it is seeing.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:26 AM
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Originally posted by IAmD1

A question for you...what is important?
edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)


Nothing is important. Finding nothing is the best.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:38 AM
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Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by IAmD1

A question for you...what is important?
edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)


Nothing is important. Finding nothing is the best.


How do you find nothing?


edit on 31/12/2012 by IAmD1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:40 AM
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reply to post by IAmD1
 





How do you find nothing?


Its a lot harder than it looks. Sit in a chair, dont move and dont think. Ideally be staring at blank wall.



posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 05:41 AM
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reply to post by IAmD1
 


This is nothing but it looks like something.
The something is seen by the nothing.
Nothing is the awareness that is aware of somethingness (consciousness).

Nothing exists (stands out) and looks like this.





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