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Obama Orders Pay Raise for Biden, Members of Congress, Federal Workers

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posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 12:15 PM
reply to post by scrounger

I think you misunderstand. I already cleared everything up with those I was talking to. I just didn't want to get lumped in with the people that are actually getting raises (Congress and judges). To be clear, I am fine with being frozen for another year. The OP title claims that Federal workers are getting raises and we are definitely not getting raises. I am well aware of the benefits I receive as a civil servant and am grateful for what I get.

Outside of that, I couldn't care less whether you like it or not. I live in Texas, which has a strong economy even now. My job, in the private sector, pays about 25k more per year in salary than I currently make. Again, I don't care if you agree or disagree with that fact. That private sector job also comes with 60 hour weeks instead of 40, and most likely does not include a pension. Depending on which firm, someone with my experience could expect to top out at around 80-100k a year in the private sector in Texas, even now. I will not ever sniff 80k a year as a civil servant, AND I AM PERFECTLY FINE WITH THAT!

I have absolutely nothing to complain about, outside of pointing out that the OP's title is misleading. Federal workers are not getting a raise and have not since 2009-2010.

posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 03:23 PM

Originally posted by Crakeur
They should be paid based on accomplishments. Balance your budget, earn XXX amount. Bring down the deficit, earn XXX amount. Avoid wars, etc.

They'll just change the way they measure all these items.
Commision is always meant to be higher than salary, so you may be describing a massive check.

Also they'll probably create dummy categories, like make industry "C" increase in profit/revenue and job positions.
And that'll open the door to lobbyists.

A wise man once said 99% of the world's problem is money.

posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 04:51 PM
reply to post by usernameconspiracy

I think there is misunderstanding on both sides here.

First I am not against any governmental worker on a personal level.

Nor to I think all are either lazy or hard working. There is a clear mixure of both.

Nor did I suggest there are not some private sector jobs that are doing well with good raises and/or benifits.

Nor did I call all governmental winers.

But be it cost of living adjustments, increases in pensions, increase in benifits, ect myself (and a good majority of taxpayers) are against ANY INCREASES no matter what they are or are called.

Even you would have to admit the majority of the economy is in the tank. Unemployment is at a all time high. The only reason unemployment numbers have been dropping (per the GAO) is due to creative bookeeping, people going off unemployment, and people who have stopped looking for work. NOT an increase in jobs.

You can find places such as ND and parts of TX where the jobs and economy are great.

Where I draw issue is using that limited examples and trying to say it reflects the majority of the country.
That sir is just plain not true.

A broken watch is inaccuate 80 percent of the time and right 20 percent (two times). But it does not make the working the majority. Not a good example but accurate.

I also pointed out if the government was a business (as it SHOULD BE FOR BUDGETING PURPOSES) in no way can you justify any increase in anything. In fact to keep it afloat massive cuts would be callded for (thus saving jobs) or if so bad (as the government is now) go out of business. The later causes loss of jobs, income and in private sector (unfortunately) loss of pensions.

Hence my bethehem steel reference.

I also pointed out greece since that is a government that is doing/did the exact same thing the USA is doing.
It shows what drastic cuts will look like and what we face if we continue down this path.

The only difference is we have a chance (abid shrinking by the month) to avoid it.

But we will NOT BE ABLE TO AVOID IT coninuing to give any increases to anyone/.department/program WITHOUT CUTTING SOMETHNG ELSE. Note there is not enough tax increase to continue without cutting.

In other words money has to be prioritized and guess what....not everyone is gonna get what they want.

So if (for example) if you want your cost of living adjustment then what are you willing to cut to get it. An army unit? Social security? Politician pay? An aircraft carrier (which will cost jobs)?

You see my point.

I take issue with people who take specific , cherry picked facts and try to say the money is there, the economy is better, or that somehow they are justified over any person in the private sector who pays taxes (military not withstanding).

So if it has gotten personal I apologize for my part if it appeared I was targeting you specifically.
I also apolgize for heated rederic that was used.

I will try to stick more with facts and leave out the personal comments. OK?

But in all unless we stop spending 1.60 or every 1.00 government brings in NO ONE is justified in getting any increases.

posted on Dec, 31 2012 @ 06:16 PM
reply to post by scrounger

I am going to once and for all explain to you why you are wrong.

First - As a federal employee, I am on the GS pay scale. This scale is a set salary with 10 sub "steps" that, after a certain percentage of time of employment the employee is upgraded another step. You start at step 1, and after 3 years of employment, for instance, you go to step 2 and see a marginal pay increase.
Once you reach step 10, you are at the top, and must either get a new position at a new grade level. If I was a GS-5 step 10 - in order to make more money I'd have to go to GS-6. Keep in mind that a GS-5 step 10 would actually make more money then a GS-6 step 1. The GS scale is about responsibilities, and the steps are about seniority.

Now, why did I explain that to you? Because once you reach step 10, you are basically on a fixed income unless you apply, interview and are accepted for a new position.

This is why federal workers complain about not getting a COLA increase.

This differs from the private sector because, although a lot of companies don't offer straight up COLA increases you do get other benefits, and I quote:

94 percent of employers give promotional increases as the result of result of higher or greater level of job responsibility;
92 percent give merit increases for superior work;
76 percent give market adjustment increases;
64 percent give internal equity adjustments; and,
42 percent have pay differentials (usually related to atypical schedule, hazardous or unsecure work environment, special skill set or responsibilities, etc.).

Federal workers receive NONE of the above benefits. A private sector employer can grant an employee more responsibility and thus higher income - that does not apply in the Federal sector because the EMPLOYEE must compete for a higher position with more responsibility - and that's if the elevated position even exists at all.

Federal employees do not get merit increases for superior work.
Federal employees do not get market adjustment increases.
Federal employees do not get internal equity adjustments.
Federal employees do not get pay differentials. If you work the night shift, you work the night shift.
Federal employees typically can't get overtime. And if we are authorized overtime, you don't actually make more money - you earn extra time off.

Federal employees DO normally get COLA increases.

So yes, while many companies do not give COLA increases, the private sector has many other benefits Federal employees do not have. So quit complaining already.

And, for your information - I was indeed active duty Navy for 13 years. I joined in 1999, was let go September of 2012. The Navy was downsizing and I got caught up in it. I was 7 years away from retirement, medical benefits and all sorts of other benefits that I lost. My job in the Navy was AT (Aviation Electronics Technician). I couldn't find a lot of work as an AT, so I retrained / realigned to the IT sector. Now I work for the Department of the Navy as a civil servant (or Federal employee).

So yes, I do know what's like for millions of other Americans. I was one of them. However, I did what was necessary to keep working. That is why my sympathy for many Americans has simply run out. I did it, why can't you (not *you* but other unemployed Americans).

ETA: And the unemployment rate is NOT as you state at an all time high. Proof again, that you are infact, mistaken. Source

ETA2: Nobody is arguing that Government spending is out of control. But again, I will stress to you that COLA increases are because of inflation. Food prices rises because of inflation, that cost is offset by the increase of COLA. It doesn't result in positive spending, it simply cancels out inflation.
Educate yourself on our Governments spending habits - Federal Spending by the Numbers - 2012
edit on 31-12-2012 by zeeon because: (no reason given)

posted on Jan, 1 2013 @ 02:04 PM
A pay raise?
If they had solved the debt problem I coulds see it but....

posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 09:42 AM
I obviously need to bow out from these threads. Sorry for any misunderstandings. I am a staunch defender of my fellow civil servants, who for the most part, are used as toilet paper by politicians, the press, and society in general all too often.

posted on Jan, 2 2013 @ 09:56 AM

Originally posted by miniatus
The pay raises appear to be minimal at best .. $900 per year in most cases.. as much as I want to, I can't find myself angry about this... $75 per month .. $37.50 per pay check .. before taxes mind you.. hell, perhaps this will put them in a better mood so things get done..

We have far more pressing issues than a tiny pay increase


maybe you have a point... the miniscule raises are only for the minions in the bureaucracy system, but not for the pay grades 12 or higher---those raises are substantial in a system where Government workers are presently paid MORE than private sector jobs already...!!!

i say that any pay increases should be tied to what the retired/disabled receive... this year we got a 1.7% increase

just how does that measley 1.7% for SocialSecurity compare to the millions of Federal Workers wage increases?
we know full well the fixed income elderly pay near 11% more for required goods/services because of inflation
and the COLA was limited by Congress to 1.7% forever - or until the law changes

this ain't sour-grapes.... this is the result of the Øbama Populist-Socialist way of implementing
the New- Normal... he is subtily changing the masses behavior & thinking models to his revolutionary communistic paradigm... reward the captive workers/buy their future votes and physical support of things like doing away with guns in general and to rebuking the present hands-off policy in regards to government-v-established religion

sinister and intriguing days are before us in 2013-2016 and one-half
edit on 2-1-2013 by St Udio because: (no reason given)

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