Obama Orders Pay Raise for Biden, Members of Congress, Federal Workers

Originally posted by marbles87
reply to post by FurvusRexCaeli
They will cut education for our youth this year

Good. Education is not an enumerated power under Article I, Section 8. The states should be funding education, not the Federal government. The sooner we do away with nonsense like Federal interference in education, the sooner we can tackle this deficit, don't you agree?

reply to post by seeker1963


Any idea what percentage that is for those people? I am very curious, because he's not seen fit to offer military personnel a decent raise since he's been in office! How do clowns in Congress, that can't pass a budget in FOUR YEARS, deserve a raise, but military people that risk their lives and sacrifice so much, get almost nothing?

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes

The 2013 raise for the military is 1.7%, and the military has gotten a raise every year. The pay raise in this EO is 0.5%, and it's the first one since 2010.

Explanation: S&F!

So Eric Holder gets a raise after he is found in contempt! :O :shk:

wiki.answers.com...

The Unites States Attorney General is a Cabinet member and therefore has a salary of $191,300 (as of 2008)

Compared with what others get ...

Entry Salaries [justice.gov]



And what he will be getting ... [i.e. Level 1 = $200,700]



Personal Disclosure: All these raises will just be eaten up by the higher taxes imposed due to the 'fiscal cliff' thats just around the corner and so again the federal usa governement gives with one hand and takes away with the other hand.

Originally posted by FurvusRexCaeli
reply to post by LadyGreenEyes

 

The 2013 raise for the military is 1.7%, and the military has gotten a raise every year. The pay raise in this EO is 0.5%, and it's the first one since 2010.

1.7% is a complete joke. After over 20 years in the service, my husband still makes less than the average postal worker (they average about 50K a year). We are a good bit below that. All of the military people I know do their jobs, too. If they don't, they are in serious trouble. Why should a bunch of clowns that can't do their job, half of whom are already rich anyway, get a raise? Every single one of those is WAY above what we get, and he's got 20 years in. Some of them haven't served but a couple of years, and they are supposed to earn MORE? For sitting around arguing, not doing their jobs, and receiving way better benefits, too? Not even close to fair.

Originally posted by Crakeur
reply to post by seeker1963

 

most politicians start out at lower levels and work their way up to higher levels, and federal posts.


As to the cost of the campaigns, yes, they are such that it's far easier for a very wealthy candidate to win a seat.

All that being true, I still firmly believe that a reward based pay schedule might actually result in some better governing. if there was a potential $250,000,000 annual salary for the president, assuming milestones were met, you'd see people with real qualifications tackling the problems these morons are trying to tackle. You'd also eradicate the lobbyist issues as they wouldn't be able to compete with massive rewards and bonuses.

At first I thought you were being sarcastic.
Now I realise you believe what your saying and I am horrified.

Really pay them more to get better quality of people.? Are you flipping kidding me?

We have soldiers right now in afganistan, firefighters in cities all over the US, police officers, correctional officers that work in some of the most dangerous prisons in the country putting their LIVES ON THE LINE making NOT EVEN HALF what these supposedly underpaid FEDERAL empoyees and politicians are making.

This does not even take into consideration the pensions and health care (which in case of the politicians is diamond plated).

Last I checked the federal employees and politcians are paid with taxpayer funds. So as such THE PUBLIC IS THE BOSS.

In the case of politcians it was origionally set up as a civil service NOT A CAREER.

So as a boss myself and quite a few people do NOT WANT TO GIVE THEM RAISES.

If politics and federal jobs are so underpaid or need more pay to get qualified people why is there a proverbial line around the block for the jobs?

Last I checked we had at least 2 people in most elections, primaries for alot of people (irregardless of affilitation) trying for a nomination, there is applications comming into the govrenment for jobs out the wazzo.

If again if so bad or low how come there is no lack of people willing to take those slots?

Lastly I have an idea.

Lets have a national binding referendum asking the taxpayers (you know the ones having their hard earn money taken by the government) if they should get a raise?

Last I checked no politician has EVER ASKED FOR THAT.

So I ask you sir explain to me again how just a politician alone making his first year over 6 X more than an average american worker (presuming they have a job) with insurance plan NOT ONE OF US WOULD EVER GET, with a lifetime retirement after two terms (4 years for congressman and 6 years senator) is being so underpaid?

Originally posted by seeker1963
reply to post by Crakeur

 

All that being true, I still firmly believe that a reward based pay schedule might actually result in some better governing. if there was a potential $250,000,000 annual salary for the president, assuming milestones were met, you'd see people with real qualifications tackling the problems these morons are trying to tackle. You'd also eradicate the lobbyist issues as they wouldn't be able to compete with massive rewards and bonuses.

I agree, a reward based system based on performance will always be more beneficial than a person getting a raised based upon how long they have held the position....

Oh they get a performance based benefits for the "job" they are doing.

The problem is it is not the general public they are doing the job.

Want proof you say?

When was the last time you saw a politician that has been in office for anything under one term that was poor?

Nuff said

Originally posted by usernameconspiracy

Originally posted by seeker1963
reply to post by miniatus

 

The pay raises appear to be minimal at best .. $900 per year in most cases.. as much as I want to, I can't find myself angry about this... $75 per month .. $37.50 per pay check .. before taxes mind you.. hell, perhaps this will put them in a better mood so things get done..

We have far more pressing issues than a tiny pay increase

It all adds up does it not? Do you not see they hypocracy that we are expected to sacrifice and suffer, but federal employees (whom get payed by taxpayer money) get raises? Plus when you take the number of all federal employees it adds up quick...

First, I am a Federal employee. Our pay is currently frozen (outside of promotions) so I'm not getting any pay raise. Obama asked for a 0.5% raise for Federal employees but it would be as a part of the budget talks. Obama only suggests. Congress decides if we get a raise or not.

Second: I'm a taxpayer also. I don't really care if you like or want me to get a raise. I haven not gotten on in recent years as it has been frozen since 2010. Federal workers have sacrificed plenty in the past three years so button up on that garbage. I, on the other hand, hope for the best for you out of your employment because I am not an ass with an apparent superiority complex.

We are all people and we are all working our way through life. You walk in your own shoes and get the hell out of mine. My feet are cold!

With all due respect let me play my violin for you and you can cry me a river.



Last I checked unemployment is though the roof and unemployment insurance has been extended for people for a year or more.

The taxpayer if they have a job has (on average) been backsliding on wages for 10 years or more.
Health insurance has been cut if available at all.
Retirement is limited assuming the company has not defaulted on their pensions.
Alot of people DON'T EVEN HAVE A FULL TIME JOB and are working two or three jobs to make ends meet.
As hard as it is for you to believe alot that do have a job are doing the job of two or three people just to keep their job.

If your job is sooooooo bad and underpaid why don't you quit and find another job? I am sure there is a line around the block of people who what your job and would take it in as much time as it would to say "YES".

You do know that the government is running a deficit in the TRILLIONS and that any non-government business would have gone out of business ELIMINATING YOUR JOB?

So again tell me what makes your governmental job so much more deserving of a raise FROM TAXPAYERS with MONEY WE DON'T HAVE?

Originally posted by usernameconspiracy

Originally posted by marbles87
reply to post by scorpiosin

 

Not to mention they all make 4 times or more than the average American wage as it is.

Hogwash. I am a professional with a Bachelor's Degree making 51k a year as a Federal employee. I could easily make 75k right now in the private sector. I chose to serve the American people. And I get a pension, so there's that...

Really you could make more in the private sector than your government job?

Sorry but a bulldozer could not push all the cow natural fertilizer your statement is full of.

Last I checked unemployment is though the roof and there are people with MASTERS AND PHD'S unemployed working whatever jobs they can find.

With colleges pumping out more yearly.

If you can make more in the private sector but now complaining that your making less as a governmental employee and deserve a raise you are a delusional fool.

Your job (listen closely) PAYS WHAT YOU GET.

As us non-governmental people (you know the taxpayer) hear from our employers when we try that logic----

"THERES THE DOOR, DON'T LET IT HIT YOU ON THE WAY OUT"

So if you choose to stay there and not go for that jog YOU CLAIM is out there in the private sector that that is what YOU CHOOSE to do.

To wine about not getting a raise shows your a fool.

Note I genuinely wish we could give everyone a raise be it governmental or private sector..

But the cold reality is there is too much debt and the economy sucks.

It is either pay now or loose it all later.

Originally posted by guohua
reply to post by MrWendal

 

What exactly have they done to deserve a pay raise?

MrWendal, I really wish you would not paint all Government Employees, Current and Retired like myself with the above statement.
I worked for a Government agency for 30+ years and retired. The best part of my employment with our Government was, One, I enjoyed working for you, The American Public in the Federal Law Enforcement Field, Two, I met my wife while working for our Government, if I had been working for another private company, I can truly guaranty you, I would not have met her.

I received my statement today from the United States Office of Personnel Management to explain the reason my pay would be changed.
I am receiving a whole 1.7% pay increase.
I promise you, I earned my pay. Every one I know retired and still in the agency, Earns their pay.

I'm not upset, I'm Angry, You have No right to Point Figures at an entire Government Working Force.

I am taking you at face value and believe you were a hard working governmental employee and earned your pension.

But the problem is this. You are no different than the litterally hundreds of thousands of employees (in the private sector) who worked hard all their careers for their pensions and now either have them reduced or even lost completely when their company went down the tubes,

The truth is the government is BROKE, and running a DEFICIT that would cause ANY PRIVATE SECTOR company to go out of business long before this.

You sir are no different that (for example) all the employees of bethlehem steel who now HAVE LITTLE TO NO PENSION.

Before you think I am unsympathetic or attacking you sir please understand it is not fair for either you or the employee's of the above company I used as an example.

I feel you all are getting screwed.

However, in the same vein you are no better or worse than a non-governmental sector employee in facing economic reality.

The ONLY difference is as a governmental employee you have been sheltered from economic realities that a normal business would face in the deficits run and job performance vs job market (example guarenteed pension).

The cold hard truth is the government debt has gotten so bad your tradition shelter you enjoyed as a governmental employee is NOW GONE.

You have to realize that you are facing the real possibility that greece is now going though. Their governmental employee's were just as guarenteed as you are now. But they are so broke their pensions are SLASHED to only a small fraction of what they were.

This is the cliff you are facing.

You have a reality to face.

Either accept there will be cuts and more cuts down the road if we hope to avoid a complete default on EVERYTHING.

That means keep going the way we are and you wont get ZIP.

Think about it.

Originally posted by miniatus
The pay raises appear to be minimal at best .. $900 per year in most cases.. as much as I want to, I can't find myself angry about this... $75 per month .. $37.50 per pay check .. before taxes mind you.. hell, perhaps this will put them in a better mood so things get done..

We have far more pressing issues than a tiny pay increase

edit on 12/28/2012 by miniatus because: (no reason given)

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Raises have been held back for quite a while now so this really needed to happen. Some people cant take the time to see how little this really amounts to and are so hell bent on hating this adminisatartion that they will hold up anything they find to say he's a bad President. Like the person who started this thread. Apparently this is a big deal to that person. The fiscal cliff doesnt even have anything to do with this at all.

reply to post by Donahue
Its a nothing pay raise. Do you not get cost of living increases from your bosses? No? Did you agree to a certain salary for your entire career and said I never expect a pay raise? If so too bad for you but the real world operates on actual costs of living to determaine salaries and increases happen. Stop the nonsense.

Originally posted by LadyGreenEyes
1.7% is a complete joke. After over 20 years in the service, my husband still makes less than the average postal worker (they average about 50K a year). We are a good bit below that.

The mean compensation of postal workers isn't really illustrative of anything, means are easily skewed. But I'll run with it. Here are the 2012 pay tables. If your husband has 20 years and he's making less than 50k per year, he is probably an E-6 or below. The military is an up or out organization, the pay scale is not designed to encourage people to sit at a given grade forever. You will note that an E-6 with 40 years makes the same as an E-6 with 20 ... the military doesn't want to retain people at that grade after 20 years. It might be time for him to consider retiring, because he will never get a within-grade pay increase at his current rank.

When adding up your husband's compensation, you should also include health care, dental, vision, housing allowance, BAS, clothing allowance, tuition assistance, the GI Bills, and various other things that Federal civilian employees do not receive. I don't know your exact situation, but that can easily be worth over $10k per year, even after the servicemember separates. They don't call him Uncle Sugar for nothing.

And if 1.7% is a joke, what does that make 0.5%? An insult? Real pay is still less than it was when pay was frozen, so I feel kind of insulted, but I'm grateful for anything I can get.

All of the military people I know do their jobs, too. If they don't, they are in serious trouble. Why should a bunch of clowns that can't do their job, half of whom are already rich anyway, get a raise? Every single one of those is WAY above what we get, and he's got 20 years in.

Now I can tell you didn't even read the EO, because it covers the entire General Schedule, down to GS-1 step 1. If you think a GS-1 step 1 earns more than an active duty service member with over 20 years, you are in serious need of better information.

Originally posted by stirling


So, the Feds get a smidge more blood money.....thats not so bad you say?
truth is this is LOTALTY MONEY>>>>HUSH MONEY>>>>PSYWAR MONEY
Think the Feds dont play mind games with their own people too?
The amount really doesnt matter.......but in preparation for the comming civil disturbance they plan to create, they want the troops to believe that at least THEIR lives are getting BETTER....that they are being taken care of....
even at the expense of everyone else in the nation.......
LOYALTY to the CORPORATION ON THE UNITED STATES is boght and paid for with your tax dollars....
And who cares of you are unemployed, in bankruptcy or even homeless.....?
You are less than a number to those who are leeching off your labour.....an expendable resource when calculated in sufficient quantity to produce and consume.Both efforts simply to produce more wealth for fewer people.
Never something to be considered on a individual basis.....

When is this planned civil disturbance they plan to create going to happen? I've been sick of hearing about this imminent civil disturbance they plan to create for 30 years now. Are they truly so powerless that it takes them more than 30 years and trillions of dollars that they keep postponing this alleged civil disturbance year after year? They must be the same people who have been creating the imminent collapse of the dollar, resulting in $5,000/oz gold for the past 20 years.

good idea based on solid fundamentals....i'm sure it will trickle down .....

Originally posted by scrounger
reply to post by miniatus

 

With all due respect let me play my violin for you and you can cry me a river.



Last I checked unemployment is though the roof and unemployment insurance has been extended for people for a year or more.

The taxpayer if they have a job has (on average) been backsliding on wages for 10 years or more.
Health insurance has been cut if available at all.
Retirement is limited assuming the company has not defaulted on their pensions.
Alot of people DON'T EVEN HAVE A FULL TIME JOB and are working two or three jobs to make ends meet.
As hard as it is for you to believe alot that do have a job are doing the job of two or three people just to keep their job.

If your job is sooooooo bad and underpaid why don't you quit and find another job? I am sure there is a line around the block of people who what your job and would take it in as much time as it would to say "YES".

You do know that the government is running a deficit in the TRILLIONS and that any non-government business would have gone out of business ELIMINATING YOUR JOB?

So again tell me what makes your governmental job so much more deserving of a raise FROM TAXPAYERS with MONEY WE DON'T HAVE?

Oh please. Get a grip on yourself. Your going to blame income inequality on us, federal workers? It's my fault that you or some other American can't find work? Some people have to work two or three jobs to make ends meet? That's my fault?

FYI - I found a job. I'm a federal worker as well and I totally agree with the guy you are bashing. Nobody's crying here except YOU my friend. Do you know why we aren't happy about not seeing a pay raise since 2010? Because we're on a fixed income federal schedule, and in case you haven't been keeping up cost of living expenses have been on the rise since 2010. Most employers compensate their employees for cost of living expenses. We usually are too, but have not since 2010. Many retirees also have been feeling the pain because they haven't been seeing COLA raises either.

Furthermore, even if we go over the so called "Fiscal Cliff" (which the media whores have been fear mongering for a good couple months now for no reason) very few people will lose their jobs. As you so eloquently stated earlier in your post, the income inequality gap in America is gigantic. CEO's are making MUCH more money than they are paying their workers historically. It's at an all time high. The Republicans LOVE to tout "trick down economics" but that system no longer works because the rich are not playing that game (as evidenced by the income inequality gap).

Tax hikes (more correctly the expiration of the Bush era tax cuts) are the only way to get them to put that money back into circulation. Wealthy business owners will not start laying off workers because of a tax hike. To even insinuate that is nonsense. Why do you think the GOP refuses to discuss any type of tax hike on the wealthy? Because they KNOW the wealthy have no choice but to pay it.

Will some Government entitlements be affected by the "Fiscal Cliff"? Sure, but it's a GOOD thing. This country has become WAY to entitlement based. We continue to give people unemployment benefits for NOT WORKING? Really!?? Some good charity is in order to help those find a new job after being laid off, but we are going on over a year of extended unemployment benefits. There has to be a line drawn somewhere.

Also, FYI - most of us Federal workers received an email from the Secretary of Defense himself stating that even if the dreaded "Fiscal Cliff" happens, at most we would receive small furloughs. No lay offs.

So please, drop the melodramatic tirade and start denying some ignorance.

Originally posted by FurvusRexCaeli
The mean compensation of postal workers isn't really illustrative of anything, means are easily skewed. But I'll run with it. Here are the 2012 pay tables. If your husband has 20 years and he's making less than 50k per year, he is probably an E-6 or below. The military is an up or out organization, the pay scale is not designed to encourage people to sit at a given grade forever. You will note that an E-6 with 40 years makes the same as an E-6 with 20 ... the military doesn't want to retain people at that grade after 20 years. It might be time for him to consider retiring, because he will never get a within-grade pay increase at his current rank.

He's actually trying to retire. Not just for the crappy pay, but because it's already more than enough time in, and because there have been way too many negative changes in recent years. The military isn't what it used to be. It's also set up, for many, to make promotions difficult to impossible, past a certain point. Well, for some people. He's too "pale" for any special consideration.

Originally posted by FurvusRexCaeli
When adding up your husband's compensation, you should also include health care, dental, vision, housing allowance, BAS, clothing allowance, tuition assistance, the GI Bills, and various other things that Federal civilian employees do not receive. I don't know your exact situation, but that can easily be worth over $10k per year, even after the servicemember separates. They don't call him Uncle Sugar for nothing.

We have to pay monthly for the health insurance. That hasn't been free for a LONG time now. Dental? No, we pay for that, or we get none, and the coverage is crappy. Vision? There isn't any family coverage for that (thanks, Clinton...). Housing and food allowances are not nearly enough, considering the pay, and the cost of living. They tend to sit well below what they are supposed to for any given area. Clothing allowance is a once-yearly thing, that isn't very much at all. Nothing near enough to pay for all the uniforms they need, that are far from cheap! Tuition assistance can be a good thing, but it can also be hard to use. While deployed, half the guys or more had no access to internet, and thus could not take classes. Others got access (so much for equal benefits...), and were able to complete many courses. Mine could not. When in Iraq (2007 time frame), he actually paid for courses (they are supposed to reimburse upon completion), and was unable to take them, because the courses weren't available to him. No one could explain why, and it was only THIS YEAR that we finally got the money back for ONE of them. The program can be good, but it's got a lot of issues, too. I don't know what "various other things" you could mean. We barely get by these days. We could manage, pre-current-administration, on what we made, but with all the increased costs across the board, and the ridiculously low pay raises, we have nothing left over at all. Every time I hear that clown claim he supports the military, I get really annoyed.

Originally posted by FurvusRexCaeli
And if 1.7% is a joke, what does that make 0.5%? An insult? Real pay is still less than it was when pay was frozen, so I feel kind of insulted, but I'm grateful for anything I can get.

I know someone getting federal pay for their work. Old, dear friend, who has been a federal employee for years now. Her pay grade has always been far better than what the military people get. Congress getting a pay raise, and some useless bureaucrats, isn't right. Agencies that waste tax money, and are corrupt, should not get a raise. Congressmen that can't manage to pass a budget should not get a raise.

All of the military people I know do their jobs, too. If they don't, they are in serious trouble. Why should a bunch of clowns that can't do their job, half of whom are already rich anyway, get a raise? Every single one of those is WAY above what we get, and he's got 20 years in.

Now I can tell you didn't even read the EO, because it covers the entire General Schedule, down to GS-1 step 1. If you think a GS-1 step 1 earns more than an active duty service member with over 20 years, you are in serious need of better information.

I am talking about Congressional pay there, not every single low level employee.

reply to post by zeeon


To you also I state there is not a forklift big enough to haul the stones it takes for you to think ANYONE believes, much less sympathises, with your most unbeliavable BS ridden rant.

This one quote shows your self righous ingorance.

QUOTE

"Because we're on a fixed income federal schedule, and in case you haven't been keeping up cost of living expenses have been on the rise since 2010. Most employers compensate their employees for cost of living expenses. We usually are too, but have not since 2010"

WHAT RELAITY ARE YOU LIVING IN?

Many people who work in the private sector (listen closely you delusional governmental toad) HAVE NOT GOTTEN ANY COST OF LIVING RAISES.

MOST WELL BEFORE 2010 HAVE LOST THEIR JOBS.
Let me repeat MOST HAVE LOST THEIR JOBS WELL BEFORE 2008.

So By your own words up to 2010 as most workers lost their jobs, had their pay cut, lost or had health benifits cut, and lost pensions (when their companies went belly up) YOU WERE GETTING RAISES.

You self important governmental worker (or supporter whatever is true) got better than the taxpayers (AKA YOUR BOSSES) who pay YOUR SALARY.

Again I challenge you what MAKES YOU SO ABOVE THE TAXPAYER that you come here and justify you getting raises when well over 100 people would take your job in a read hot minute and not CRY ABOUT THE SALARY.


You do realise that if you worked IN A PRIVATE SECTOR JOB your employer would have gone out of business before the first 100 million (much less than 8 trillion) in debt.

Thus YOU WOULD HAVE BEEN UNEMPLOYED.

Lastly if your job is sooooooooooo bad (or the people your supporting) why do you stay there and not go for the better job you claim is out there for you?

Tell you what, why dont you get out from infrront of your keyboard and pitch your BS to a crowd of unemployed steel workers and see how far you get or what sympathy you recieve.

If you try that,,,,,,,,wear good running shoes.

Originally posted by scrounger
reply to post by zeeon

 

To you also I state there is not a forklift big enough to haul the stones it takes for you to think ANYONE believes, much less sympathises, with your most unbeliavable BS ridden rant.

This one quote shows your self righous ingorance.

QUOTE

"Because we're on a fixed income federal schedule, and in case you haven't been keeping up cost of living expenses have been on the rise since 2010. Most employers compensate their employees for cost of living expenses. We usually are too, but have not since 2010"

WHAT RELAITY ARE YOU LIVING IN?

Many people who work in the private sector (listen closely you delusional governmental toad) HAVE NOT GOTTEN ANY COST OF LIVING RAISES.

MOST WELL BEFORE 2010 HAVE LOST THEIR JOBS.
Let me repeat MOST HAVE LOST THEIR JOBS WELL BEFORE 2008.

So By your own words up to 2010 as most workers lost their jobs, had their pay cut, lost or had health benifits cut, and lost pensions (when their companies went belly up) YOU WERE GETTING RAISES.

You self important governmental worker (or supporter whatever is true) got better than the taxpayers (AKA YOUR BOSSES) who pay YOUR SALARY.

Again I challenge you what MAKES YOU SO ABOVE THE TAXPAYER that you come here and justify you getting raises when well over 100 people would take your job in a read hot minute and not CRY ABOUT THE SALARY.


You do realise that if you worked IN A PRIVATE SECTOR JOB your employer would have gone out of business before the first 100 million (much less than 8 trillion) in debt.

Thus YOU WOULD HAVE BEEN UNEMPLOYED.

Lastly if your job is sooooooooooo bad (or the people your supporting) why do you stay there and not go for the better job you claim is out there for you?

Tell you what, why dont you get out from infrront of your keyboard and pitch your BS to a crowd of unemployed steel workers and see how far you get or what sympathy you recieve.

If you try that,,,,,,,,wear good running shoes.

I don't even know where to begin to address this incoherent rant.

First off, do not call me a toad. I served my country honorably for 13 years in the United States Navy. I was "let go" due to a reduction in force, or what you civilians call "laid off". So don't talk to me about people losing their jobs you self righteous prick. I sacrificed more then you can fathom to defend your right to sit there and slander me. You're welcome.

Secondly, I already explained the concept behind cost of living adjustments. If you can't grasp this simple concept, then I have nothing further to discuss with you.

Thirdly, you incorrectly assume that I have *never* worked in the private sector. I worked many years in the private sector before I joined the military. Yes, private sector employees DO IN FACT receive COLA raises. If your employer (if you are even employed at all) does not give you them, then I suggest you get off your lazy ass and find one that does. Otherwise, you have no leg to stand to complain about us that do get them.

Lastly - again you incorrectly assume that somehow Federal workers were complaining about not getting a COLA increase. That assumption exemplifies just how ignorant you really are. We were attempting to explain to you people that we were not getting something most of America is getting - contrary to whatever personal experiences you may or may not have had.

My sympathy for unemployed America only goes so far. You lost your job? You were a steel worker? GO GET A NEW SET OF SKILLS INSTEAD OF CRYING ABOUT IT. You can sit here, kicking and screaming about how unfair it is, and how we're all federal a-holes and yadda yadda yadda. As you so eloquently said earlier - "Cry me a River".

reply to post by zeeon


First I will take you at face value you served in the navy and thank you for your service.

Next yes I know what cost of living increases are and while not technically a raise baised on the standard of not getting above what increase of living expences are. The cold hard FACT is that it is an increase that at least attempts to make up for increase in expences.

However dispite your feable attempt at deflection the fact is a MAJORITY (you do know what the definition of that word means right?) of working americans did not enjoy even a cost of living adjustment or raise.

Your comment also attemptts to deflect from the fact a great many of people have LOST THEIR JOBS over the time governmental workers got cost of living adjustments. Or have you forgot (deliberately???) the unemployment rates (dispite cooking the books) are though the roof. With underemployment (aka people working part time or multiple part time jobs) figures being conviently ignored by main stream media.

As for incoherant rant just because I call out the govermental worker wining (wihich you are doing) over not getting cost of living increases/raises/loosing increase in retirement benifits does not make your attempt at deflection change the truth.

I used steel workers as an example because it CLEARLY shows how rediculous your arguments for governmental workers being treated differently is.

Are you implying governmental workers (not military BTW) and politicans are somehow above the regular taxpayer (example steel workers) does in some way justify me calling you a governmental toad/troll/whatever discription wont hurt your feelings.

I also call you out for that cheap shot telling steel workers that its their fault they have not found other work or retrained.
I turn that on you and say if you (or governmental workers) are complaining no increase to wages then its your fault for not leaving for a better paying job. Sucks when faced with your own comment isnt it?

As I have stated before I do think if you earned a pension (be it governmental or private sector) that it is a crappy deal getting what was promiced to you cut. I also wish EVERYONE could have a job, raises, and great benifits again be it governmental or private sector.

What I am doing is calling out supporters (such as yourself) putting governmental workers who complain/wine/ect that they are now facing or actually had their reitrement cut, heath benifits threatened, facing cut backs , reduced pensions, loss of pensions, and possible loss of job when the cold hard fact is REGULAR TAXPAYERS AS A MAJORITY have been having this HAPPEN TO THEM for the last 6 years minimum.

You do know that the government is spending 1.60+ for every dollar it takes in right?
You do know that the government is 16.5 TRILLION DOLLARS right?
You do know that most if not all companies would be out of business well before their debt got that high right?

You know if the government was like any other business in the world as a governemtal employee active or retired that you by now would have lost EVERYTHING right?

If you want to see where were headed very soon just look at greece.
They ran their debt though the roof, no one will lend them money untill they make drastic cuts in EVERYTHING, and still they are teadering on total default. Their currency only has not fallen is because they use the euro and the main reason that other governments are still lending them money. They face falling with them.

Note they have SLASHED everything. Social programs, governmental services (both esential and non esential)governmental paychecks and GOVERNMENTAL pensions.



The ONLY difference from them to us is we still have someone buying our debt and our currency has not tanked yet.

BTW for accuracy I always felt the military is getting screwed on pay and benifits and argued for incrases in both.

So keeping it non-personal for my final comment.

Explain to me again how a governmental worker (active or retired) is better than the taxpayer (who provides the cash) and deserves to be sheltered from the same economic hardships they have faced for well over 6+ years?

Note if I somehow made it too personal in comment alone I apologise (everyone gets heated at times).
However if you consider being called out on FACTS countering your argument as personal then I cannot help you there.