The True Essence Of Manhood..

reply to post by Logarock


Yeah.. The others have traded in their brains, heart and courage for a beer and left Dorothy to take care of business..

Originally posted by Raelsatu
I see what you mean. That's the thing though; the spectrum of psychology and genetics is so broad. There might be a man who's feminine, but doesn't live his life harming others. Then there might be a very masculine guy who loves torturing people. Then there's the masculine hero. The not-so-masculine genius. And so on... every possibility exist there in between.

Courage is a good attribute for anyone, whether male or female. Masculine or feminine. Some have the courage to fight for those they love, and to venture into the unknown --- but cannot muster the courage to get past their social anxiety, or addictions.

You have a very negative understanding of masculinity in men. Have you had some bad run with an "alpha male" or something. After reading youre last two post I would say you get youre back up if you are anywhere near a "man".

Originally posted by EvanB
reply to post by Logarock

 

Yeah.. The others have traded in their brains, heart and courage for a beer and left Dorothy to take care of business..

edit on 27-12-2012 by EvanB because: (no reason given)

Hay, I am all man and would love to go on patrol with Dorothy. That the sort of women that joined men out on the frontier in the old days.

reply to post by EvanB


I man should have honor, a sense of duty to self, family and country, respect and should know the art of war (or at least defence) should love the innocence of the childs heart. But not dumb enough to think all men know the same.....(this is true love, not that emotional crap they throw at us now) I get where you are going. What folks don't understand is there is justice in violence and then, just evil violence. Men are no longer allowed to be men. The women now are above being women. And most men are now emotional women. It will for the time being, be a mess. Adapt. Keep the sword hidden. Learn it's spirit, in secret. Someday we will need it again. But for now we can't wear it, to much emotion out there. Nature will not be forever shunned, it can't be. Or it will only get worse.

reply to post by murphy22


That said, wear it for all the world to feel!

reply to post by EvanB


I actually like the way you think.
being a woman who really digs men, and having been responsible in the past for demasculating them, I found it was only so I could find one strong enough to stand me. i'm quite rough, but have always said if she can dish it she can take it, it's the Aussie chick way.

I see the broken connection bewteen fathers and sons and it saddens me, but the testing is individual based on your desire I think, and a little voice like the one where you want to rescue the damsel.
it's all those bloody love stories man, wrecks your heart and your head. but who doesn't love the ultimate love story?
Women test themselves also and are tested.

Something about owning the body you live in springs to mind, even when everything says you don't.

Soft men are just as lovely but perhaps they have more of the spite of women in them also, it's a tricky thing.
I'll catch the rest of your thread later, nice thoughts though op.

Originally posted by murphy22
reply to post by EvanB

 

I man should have honor, a sense of duty to self, family and country, respect and should know the art of war (or at least defence) should love the innocence of the childs heart. But not dumb enough to think all men know the same.....(this is true love, not that emotional crap they throw at us now) I get where you are going. What folks don't understand is there is justice in violence and then, just evil violence. Men are no longer allowed to be men. The women now are above being women. And most men are now emotional women. It will for the time being, be a mess. Adapt. Keep the sword hidden. Learn it's spirit, in secret. Someday we will need it again. But for now we can't wear it, to much emotion out there. Nature will not be forever shunned, it can't be. Or it will only get worse.

edit on 27-12-2012 by murphy22 because: spelling

Yeah.. I am currently estranged from my girl... But last Friday who did she call to rescue her from a nasty guy in the bar she was at who was hassling her? She was with work colleagues.. Some of them were guys and not one of them stood up for her.. I got the call and was there in a flash and sorted it.. There is indeed need for violence sometimes.. Those weak assed wankers would have just stood by.. pfft.. At least it got us talking again..

reply to post by Logarock


I prefer to know I can handle what life brings to me and still be known as a really nice guy. The best of both worlds if you will That is why I keep in fairly good shape and maintain a defensive but respectable mindset all the time, because most people don't want to fight, they want to beat somebody up!

Originally posted by EvanB

Originally posted by rival

But what boy or man EVER wanted to be known as a "nice guy"?

Me....and I am nice guy. Though still fully feral if need be...

That is kind of my point.. But seriously.. Who would you rather be?.. Chuck Norris, The Dark Knight or The Pope?

Well, I'm fifty now and have had alot of fun in my life--my fair share,. I don't need machismo to attract
or excite women anymore--but I understand your perspective as a younger man (I'm assuming)

In my experience acting tough and being tough are separate qualities. But we are living in
a culture of style over substance--so appearing tough is seen as equal to being tough.

Now to your question...you didn't provide enough choices....

Certainly not the Pope, too passive...nor Chuck or Batman either. I would rather just be myself.
If i could have a force-field of protection though...I would take that

Sometimes people think too much.
For instance, using the analogy of a guy in a bar, someone's giving him stick. Not friendly banter, but the kind where they are trying to boost their self esteem by belittling someone else.
Now, type 1 man will work out the probability of winning a fight and thus probably let it slide.
Type 2 will just chin the bloke without any further thought.

In short, as an old biker mate taught me years ago, if you feel like you should be having a fight, have one. Don't sit around working out whether you'll win while someone disrespects you or your mates, just get in there.

Originally posted by hotel1
An overly simplistic way of explaining what you highlight would be that a feminized male is much easier to control, and therefore much less of a threat to those in power. So to truly understand why that would be what has to asked is what is it about a masculine male that so terrorfies the establishment.

We could start by establishishing when this process of sofenting began, who began it, and why. Once you have answered these questions that explain the shaming of the strong male in the political/media complex the answer becomes glaringly obvious in that as originally stated a feminized (emasculated) male is much easier to control.

This negative feedback loop is so ingrained in liberal thought that you are likely to be flamed, and shamed for even pointing this obvious truth out, and is a large part of the reason why there seems to be so much more wrong with society than there was before this process of turning nature on its head began.

It's their religious belief, and as they are in power now, it will saturate your environment. Their religious ideal is adrogyny, humanity blended as male/female. Their shamans and preists are often feminized men. Watch as they strip the terms "mother/father/husband/wife" from every document and be replaced with "parent 1/parent 2/spouse 1/spouse 2". It has nothing to do with equality and diversity, and everything to do with their belief in "oneness". It's pantheism, the worship of the created instead of the Creator.

The secular and atheistic descendants of Christian forefathers are clueless that their leaders are not secular and atheists. As long as those leaders allow them to wallow in sin and wickedness and keep driving Christ Jesus out of all aspects of society, they don't care to understand that their leaders are just converting their subjects into children twice the children of hell in order to usher in what they fully believe in - their world utopia which will revert humanity to their occult belief in "their primordial sexless Adam".

Little do we fully understand that Jesus is bundling the tares for burning and having the occult do it. God created male and female. Rejecting that ideal and assigned roles is rejecting the Creator and what He established. Feminising men and masculinising women needs to be seen for what it is - the progress of occultism towards their goal of removing duality within gender. This is so easily proven in all of their writings, and the Bible. But today, so many have rejected the truth of God's word and therefore cannot understand how far along beliefs have been indoctrinated to align with occult writings instead. And because they see "no harm" in these movements in society, it just carries onward until the day that God descends to remove out all the ungodly.

I wish we didn't have a government. Life would be much more interesting if we had to directly deal with our survival and not rely on society to take care of things for us. Certain luxuries might be eradicated, but life doesn't need them anyway. If this happened, the weak ones would die and only the strong would survive. That's not necessarily a bad thing. This is the way of the rest of the world. For some reason, we have separated ourselves from our natural selves and bought into materialism and the quest for absolute power.

But, I guess this is natural too. Idk. I would prefer to live in a world where the law was in the hands of the people though. We need our freedom and we're not getting it.

Originally posted by EvanB

Originally posted by rival

But what boy or man EVER wanted to be known as a "nice guy"?

Me....and I am nice guy. Though still fully feral if need be...

That is kind of my point.. But seriously.. Who would you rather be?.. Chuck Norris, The Dark Knight or The Pope?

I would rather be a combination of Buddha and Mel Gibson in the Patriot.

I believe there is a time for being humble and passive, and a time for being astute and aggressive. Balance is good.

I like a woman who stands up for herself, but not so much that she hates men. Just that she loves herself enough to not take crap from anyone. I'm not going to take any crap from anyone, but I will admit when im wrong.

If I'm in a bar and I step on someone's foot, I'm going to say sorry. Then if that person wants to act like an ass, I'm going to stand my ground.

Originally posted by Logarock
I do find this painting or whatever very intriguing.

I think that represents an angle that she knows there's some things only she can do, she learnt from her brothers and sisters to be what ever she needs to be (on her own, with family, and on the fly), and when she needs to do it and to be it.
Don't wait for Romeo sister, get in there and fix it if it's fracked, kind of stuff. Personal interpretation only of course.

Your chick friend op, needs to either keep her mouth shut, control her bodily actions so no confusion is felt, or stay out of pubs without an escort. Simple.

is this the damsel you wish to rescue?
I wonder how much respect she will have from you when you are sick of jumping to assistance, because she has learnt your trick or because there just doesn't seem to be enough gain in it for you anymore.

May I share an afternoon observation?

Not far from us is a beautiful waterfall, seasonal, flows hard in the wet and not so much in the dry.
Sitting on the rounded warm stones of the bank soaking the sun, kids swimming, having a good time, me zoning out and just being.
this young couple came into the water, she was very pretty, dark haired slim, bikini wearing in confidence type a few tatoos, very cute. She was with this big soft white dude, and clearly she wanted to either impress him or test him, on her own local waterfall.
Do you know how i know that?
Because she climbed it like an expert, all the way to the top.
She'd done it before, clearly.
She was the one who encouraged him to climb, showed him the best spots for his hands and his feet as he climbed with her.
It was his legs that shook and his body that quaked, but by her encouragement and coaxing, he got to the top and threw himself off, just after she did it, but she didn't hesitate.
His uphoria was entirely clear unlike the water below.

You can make of my story what you wish, but I was impressed by both of them. It was brilliant to watch.
Learning is in the eye of the beholder and I'm glad you have shared your learning experience of becoming a man here. You sound decent.

Oh, and It is entirely possibly to be lady like and liverpool kiss like a pro........just so you know x a

reply to post by EvanB


I had an idea about a book, that was going to be a metaphor for todays treatment of men, and male instincts in society. My idea was going to be about a world where men are forced to remain indoors after dark, have to wear tracking devices, can not consume alcohol, cigarettes, any drugs(same anywhere just added it in). Men would be selected at birth for job programming, physical labor, security, military, but with little or no freedoms. Basically drones.

I know today, certain aspects of the male personality are cherished. The world wants men to be providers, to be in good physical shape(does come easier to a greater number of men than women, not trying to pick sides but teenage boys will become muscularly fit doing nothing but eating right.) Our ability to act and think under pressure is also cherished, but this seems to be dissipating in todays society. Men are not men anymore, our natural role is no longer of importance. We live in a world where outside of war, it is no longer a mans job to protect the family, to hunt, to provide. Women(I don't disagree) are just as capable of supporting the family and in many cases do much better in school to land better paying jobs than men. We pay security companies to protect our homes. A man's place is at work, and at home he is not himself, he has to be caring, kind, calm and perfect. Society has changed men, to a degree much of us are lost. We really are, more men are depressed now then ever before. We've lost our place, in a society that is growing exponentially moving towards a world where physical labor, leadership, conflict is no longer a daily necessity men are out of it.

I like to think of myself as a man's man, but I have more troubles with emotion, feeling worthy than I can cope with. I get mad at myself for feeling the things I do, and unfortunately there isn't much I can do about it. My fiance makes more money than I do, I work ten times as hard and twice as long but she does. I love her to death and I appreciate her, but it leads to feelings of unworthiness. The world is changing faster than we are, and it seems outside of mindless grunt jobs we have lost our place. Even raising children, we are not the disciplinarians anymore, children are raised to learn on their own. Which is good, I was brought up to work hard, be honest and fight for what I believe in but I was not outside of the realm of the word " No," or being grounded.

It's a tough world, and unfortunately being a fighter, isn't going to get us far. Sad part is " When the going get's tough, the tough get going," only this time it means somewhere else.


( I'm all for women in the workforce, and equal rights. I do not blame women in any shape or form for the things I've talked about here. I'm not trying to come off that way, and the words I used in some points could be interpreted as such. I am happy to take equal roles in cleaning, and caring for children. Society has changed what a man is supposed to be, not women.)

Question where doe little boys get the ideas of danger, if it innate, or is it conditioned into them from the time they are born?

We are no better than monkeys, hence the term "monkey see, monkey do".

People be they boys, or girls will mimic their environment.

The main problem is our Ego's, they never know what they want, or who they are.

Originally posted by EvanB
A stick in the hands of a little boy becomes a sword, a rock is a grenade, the games boys play always have a fierce nature.. Playing at killing the evil giant.. Getting into trouble, climbing trees and been drawn to danger like a moth to a flame..

This is of course natural.. Why?.. So when the boy becomes a man he has the tools to be a man and have what it takes..

The true heart of a man is one that yearns for the wild.. To have adventure.. To rescue his fair maiden.. To be her hero..

reply to post by EvanB


Hi Mate,

I think you are on the right track. We are very similar. What your girls needs to understand that you intend to continue being a MAN. That does not mean that you are a sexist, misogynist or a (god forbid) wife beater. I really hope that you will be true to yourself and just get on with it.

It is not very often that heterosexual men actually raise a discussion about what it means to be a man. The feminists seemed to have monopolised what it means to be a man and have focused on the negative areas and the sociopathic aspects which is fine but we also need to have discussions about what we mean as men. Self defination is important.

Kind regards

Tiger5

reply to post by Thurisaz


Yeah that fair maiden crap made me nauseous.

That's okay buddy, we don't need rescuing. We got this.

It's funny, men now are starting to feel like women always have, trapped in a society that puts limitations on who we are and who we ought to be.

I don't think people really understand how soul destroying capitalist society is for people, mental illness and suicide amongst has grown hand in hand with it, especially for men. It's hard to come to terms with being a worthless commodity to be bought and sold.

don't think it's only men feeling this way, women more than anything know what it's like to be strangled and subdued by society

But what boy or man EVER wanted to be known as a "nice guy"?

reply to post by EvanB

Most would rather be known as "dangerous"

What is it in you that is concerned with how others see you?

To rescue his fair maiden.. To be her hero..

What is it in you that fantasizes about being a "hero"?

I think what you are saying here is that we need to be more natural and not simply behave the way others tell us to and i completely agree with that but its not just "others" who tell you how to be but your own mind is doing this also. Your mind comes up with a certain image and says- "this is how you should be". This is just as unnatural as if someone else were telling you how to act. So until you drop all ideas of how a "man" should be you are not really being natural and therefore are not really a man.