Originally posted by mwood
I agree fully.

I conceal carry and if in a position to save someones life I will not even ask their political views before doing so.

Your welcome libs.....

Ugh...by "libs", you probably mean Democrats, even though "liberal" and "conservative" have been so grossly twisted out of their meaning. For example, "conservatives" should be the ones pushing government to stay out of the way of gays who want to marry, and pushing the government to stay out of foreign wars. They should also be low-spenders of taxpayer money.

Anyhow, my gripe is that these broad brushes only serve the scum in power. You, obviously, think Democrat-voting citizens are anti-gun. Myself, and most of the people I know, vote Democrat in most cases, but myself, and probably 90+% of my circle of friends and family, are either gun-owners, or planning to be as soon as they can afford it. We're not irrationally scared that the "big bad libs" are going to take our guns away, despite the Constitution. That kind of thinking only serves to hurt the cause, as you assume a huge number of pro-2nd Amendment citizens are anti-2nd amendment.

Now, if you're a Rep politician, it works in your favor. Republican voters are highly motivated by their fears, and will often vote against their own self-interests, as well as against the interests of the nation, and in most cases, against Constitutional principals, mainly because thry believe false fears like "Libs dun gonna take yer guns away!" or "gay marriage is gonna male my marriage fall apart!"

This isn't all Republicans, but a large enough voting bloc is gullible and cowardly enough to think that way. Unfortunately, there's a large coalition of what you call "libs" who are pro-2nd amendment. We're not all Hollywood actors.

Originally posted by Paschar0
Maintaining an armed citizenry allows us to defend against and give pause to tyrannical governments that would just as soon strip you of all power, privacy and resources for any given reason at any given time. History is full of examples of how disarming the population is a crucial step in gaining control.

I would be interested in having a constructive debate about guns because I respect your opinion. About myself, having lived in several countries I am biased, let’s say, differently than people who have lived their whole lives in one country.

1) If you use a gun to protect yourself from the government you will be treated the way that most people will say you should be treated, like a distraught animal.

2) If the government is allowed to use drones and military to kill and arrest you without trial and the media will announce whatever “facts” the government dictates them, then I would suggest that they have already stripped you of all power and privacy.

In history, when the military had nothing more powerful than guns, guns were a meaningful weapon of defense. But guns are not helpful to defend against drones, FEMA camp barbed wires, armored water canons, etc.

In my opinion, only the Constitution can protect We the People from abuses of the government. The US Constitution is proving incapable of doing so any longer. Which means that we are doomed because guns cannot change this, other than through a bloody revolution.

Originally posted by hellbjorn012

Originally posted by Paschar0


You should know that hunting and self defense are not the reasons we have the 2nd amendment. Maintaining an armed citizenry allows us to defend against and give pause to tyrannical governments that would just as soon strip you of all power, privacy and resources for any given reason at any given time. History is full of examples of how disarming the population is a crucial step in gaining control.

I support the 2nd amendment but the Rambo threads are getting very old on ATS. I'm sure your shotguns, Ar-15s and 40 cals will stop a M1Abrams with a barrage of .50 cal lead headed your way. :/

I stand 100% behind the 2nd amendment!

That being said!! Why do people always brag about owning guns on my Facebook and ATS? You are in America most people have guns. People should stop making comments like lock n loaded and ready or we are cleaning our guns. Owning a gun doesn't make you special or a bad ass. Anyone can own a gun it DOES NOT VERIFY YOUR MANHOOD. But the majority of American citizens cant run a couple of miles or pull themselves over a wall.

People bragging about there arsenals and preparedness just make sane gun owners look like gun crazy John Wayne wannabes


Also while I own a few firearms of the non assault rifle type im just waiting on you guys who are more armed than me with 3-4 Ar15s and a dozen more guns with thousands of rounds to go overthrow this corrupt government. All this talk and no action what ya'll waiting on? Ill be behind you with my lowly 9mm as soon as you Rambos with your over-sized arsenals make the first move on DC

Originally posted by g146541

The strong will survive and the weak probably won't.
Let those who are willing to stand by their "ideas and morals" go ahead and walk into the cattle car.

Buying a gun doesn't verify your manhood nor does it make one strong :/

edit on 27-12-2012 by hellbjorn012 because: (no reason given)

So, how many Arbrams do the Taliban have that are currently holding out strong in Afghanistan or how many Stingers did the Vietcong have as they wolloped the US in guerrilla warfare?? Remind me again how they won?

Oh how we forget that when we declared our freedom from the crown, most the combatants were mere farmers. Many were using garbage weapons. At times, we fired rocks from our muskets. We persevered and the great men that formed this nation wanted to ensure that tyranny could not return without a fight.

If you honestly think such a tyrannical government can't happen again, one must look at Russia. The people had a short period of freedom but now they are once again thrown behind the iron curtain.

You call in Rambo, I call it reality as human greed as proven over a millennium that people given the opportunity, will take your freedom away. The best way to do that is take away your ability to defend your self.

Originally posted by noonebutme

Originally posted by Paschar0
You should know that hunting and self defense are not the reasons we have the 2nd amendment. Maintaining an armed citizenry allows us to defend against and give pause to tyrannical governments that would just as soon strip you of all power, privacy and resources for any given reason at any given time. History is full of examples of how disarming the population is a crucial step in gaining control.

Fascinating.

As a non-American I often read your arguments "for" your 2nd amendmentwith the tyrannical govt and standing up to them.

Let's say things go to pot and the US govt decides, for whatever laughable reason, to "take over" its own citizens by force and round you up into controlled camps. You and your armed beer-swigging buddies say, "Nuh uh, not on my watch" - you grab your assault rifle(s) and...do....what? What do you do?

Please explain how your armed militias/citizens, with their paltry automatic weapons, rifles and handguns, will stand up to your govt using their own Armed Forces, with their tanks, explosives, helicopters, jets, drones, and highly trained soldiers, coordinated by advanced telcomms, satelites and hundreds of other highly advanced bits of kit the citizens DO NOT have.

I always love hearing this argument because, no matter how "noble" or patriotic you aim to be, you will be crushed, instantly, by your govt. For all your armed citizens, you will be nothing against an organised army.

At that point, when you guys are lying face down, you can chant your Heston mantra, "I'll give you my gun when you take it from my cold, dead hands".

edit on 27-12-2012 by noonebutme because: (no reason given)

edit on 27-12-2012 by noonebutme because: (no reason given)

You obviously know nothing about warfare....

Yeah because that superiority has allowed us to CRUSH the insurgents in Afghanistan, as did the Russians...lol, who have less capability than the many former (and current) soldiers in the armed forces.

There are many within the military that will be on the side of the people once the catalyst that sparks a revolution occurs.

The thing that the gov has tried to maintain is the frog in the boiling pot. They have been turning up the heat gradually hoping that the frog won't leap out. If they continue along those lines they may succeed in taking all liberties. I don't think they will. They will get over excited and try to do too much at once.

It isn't the people with AR's that they have to worry about, it's the people period. There are less than 4 million soldiers many of whom are overseas. If even 1/10 of those who are armed in the citizenry stand up, the superior fire power would mean NOTHING. That's if absolutely NONE of the military break off and fight for the people.

Jaden

The people ALWAYS have a fighting chance because the gov. has to keep at least some of the people complacent and accepting. When you don't know who you're up against, you have to either lose or risk losing the hearts and minds of the people you have to oppress in order to find those who are against you. We showed that with some of the farmers that we put in GTMO and released for them to become opposition. I know, I was AT GTMO in military intelligence.

I try to avoid this gun posts, but i have to say i respect your post and your willingness to stand your ground on whats right.