Thoughts from a former Christian

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posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 11:59 AM
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reply to post by cantyousee
 


The time came when I had to find out why I believed. The Christian faith hangs or falls on one premise and one premise only. The ressurection. If Jesus of nazareth didn't raise from the dead then it is all a bunch of crap and I don't need Christianity. On the other hand, if he rose from the dead then everyone had better take a scond look at this individual. Did he or didn't he?

That is the crux of the matter.

I've NEVER believed he did. And the Bible tales are all hearsay...and there is ample evidence that he was part of the "mystic" school; there is NO REASON to believe that he wasn't simply "seeming dead"...and because he was so hastily brought off the cross and his legs not broken (it normally takes 3 days to die on the cross) he could have been attended to by his "healing" support circle.

A "resurrected from the dead" person will not be eating or drinking or showing off his hand-holes.

He did not. Great story, but, fiction.




posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 12:12 PM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by FaceLikeTheSun
 



Your entire second paragraph needs to be addressed here. First off, your theology and your definition of God is off. Ever heard the phrase "God is good all the time"? God by definition is good. But you say, how could God be good and order the murder of a nation, wives and kids etc? Here's a link that get's into the details...


Which is why he created the king of evil, right? He created "Satan". Obviously, evil can only come from pure good.



God sees the big picture. He understands that things have to be done that don't make sense at the time for a greater purpose. Ever have a situation in your life that devastated you at the time but later came to realize that it was the best thing that could happen to you? Much of the OT narrative is along these lines...and interestingly enough, the Israelites ALWAYS failed to fulfill what God told them to do. In fact, I would have done the same. I can relate to you and the Israelites who disobeyed God because at the time, it would make no sense.


Yes, but this only makes sense if "God" is omniscient and NOT omnipotent. Otherwise, he could undo it all and reset it with the necessary parameters to avoid all chaos and suffering in a split second.

So why doesn't he? Why does he unleash these evils on the world when he demands that we do the exact opposite?


"Which is why he created the king of evil, right? He created "Satan". Obviously, evil can only come from pure good.
"


God did not create evil. He created creatures who have free will up to a certain point. As beings who can experience love in the fullest sense cannot do so without the existence or potential of evil. Satan falls into this category. Satan was actually the highest angelic being created by God. But when God created humanity for the angelic beings to serve, Satan didn't like that. Thus, he chose not just to reject God but to pride himself in being "like" God.

"Yes, but this only makes sense if "God" is omniscient and NOT omnipotent. Otherwise, he could undo it all and reset it with the necessary parameters to avoid all chaos and suffering in a split second.

So why doesn't he? Why does he unleash these evils on the world when he demands that we do the exact opposite?"


Again, false premise here. God doesn't unleash evil. Does God allow it? Yes. But He's not the one unleashing it (read the book of Job). Ultimately, His will is done. I'm sure you've heard "thy will be done." And since God is defined as the ultimate good, no matter what the circumstances, God's ultimate plan for good is always going to come out of it.

In a vacuum, events seem tragic and evil. But ultimately, this is why even you who might not believe in God has an inherent disposition to God because God is righteous and just. Justice is a huge part of this. And why the suffering? Because a redeemed humanity is better. Again, I use the example of children. If you gave children everything they wanted all the time, what would come of them? And how many times have you heard of stories where people have something tragic happen and it's that tragedy that brings about tremendous good for others in the future?

I'll leave you with the ant and the mural analogy.

Imagine the most perfect mural. (Hypothetical but it's just an illustration) It's got amazing colors, shapes, lines and all the things that make this mural beautiful.

Now imagine you're an ant walking across the mural. What does the ant see? A hill, a valley, landscapes that don't make sense etc. We are the ants. We don't see the whole picture. We only see what's right in front of us.
edit on 29-12-2012 by FaceLikeTheSun because: (no reason given)
edit on 29-12-2012 by FaceLikeTheSun because: spelling



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by cantyousee
 


The time came when I had to find out why I believed. The Christian faith hangs or falls on one premise and one premise only. The ressurection. If Jesus of nazareth didn't raise from the dead then it is all a bunch of crap and I don't need Christianity. On the other hand, if he rose from the dead then everyone had better take a scond look at this individual. Did he or didn't he?

That is the crux of the matter.

I've NEVER believed he did. And the Bible tales are all hearsay...and there is ample evidence that he was part of the "mystic" school; there is NO REASON to believe that he wasn't simply "seeming dead"...and because he was so hastily brought off the cross and his legs not broken (it normally takes 3 days to die on the cross) he could have been attended to by his "healing" support circle.

A "resurrected from the dead" person will not be eating or drinking or showing off his hand-holes.

He did not. Great story, but, fiction.

This is why God unleashed the power of freedom of choice. There had to be a way to define and seperate the believers from the non believers. God wants a world at peace with prosperity for all. There can be no peace while there is controversy. I hope you reconsider and come to God. Like him, that is my wish. But in the event that you don't, remember that in the world to come there could have been a place for you. Just because God is all merciful and patient doesn't mean he is gonna allow the controversy to last forever. Even as I write this the world as you know it is coming to an end. Satan is about to unleash his last spurt of evil. Like the death throws of a wild animal. Then the real Christ will come and my words will be vindicated. I implore you to look at the evidense and reconsider your position. But if not, we want rid of all who think like of you. There is no place for you in the world to come. Come and receive him today while it is still possible.



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 03:50 PM
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reply to post by celticdog
 


As a transgender myself, I think it depends on how one interprets the Bible and sees it. As a Hermeticist, it's traditional to have some kind of relationship with the Bible so I study it often and enjoy doing it and find a great deal of knowledge, wisdom and understanding that can be discovered within its many layers (as can be found in any Holy Book). I'm fully aware of what the Bible says but how one looks at those particular verses and their relevency is up to them, it's between one and their God in the end, in my opinion. I'm sure that dosn't rest well with people who like to busy themselves with others rather than work out their own Salvation.

I think the real problem is people who use the Bible to mask their own personal discomfort, repulsion or whatever at such people as myself and this can be seen on all fronts and not just with folks like myself. People use religion all the time as a cover for the unwholesome and impious things that dwell in their heart of which they project out like weapons to do so much damage to people.

You know, they say, Adam was once both male and female before God split Adam into two halves.


edit on 29-12-2012 by Arles Morningside because: Ahaha, i'm such a terriable typist. Added some things and fixed some things.



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 04:21 PM
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Originally posted by Arles Morningside
reply to post by celticdog
 


As a transgender myself, I think it depends on how one interprets the Bible and sees it. As a Hermeticist, it's traditional to have some kind of relationship with the Bible so I study it often and enjoy doing it and find a great deal of knowledge, wisdom and understanding that can be discovered within its many layers (as can be found in any Holy Book).

I think the real problem is people who use the Bible to mask their own personal discomfort, repulsion or whatever at such people as myself and this can be seen on all fronts and not just with folks like myself. People use religion all the time as a cover for the the unwholesome and impious things that dwell in their heart of which they project out like weapons to do so much damage to people.

You know, they say, Adam was once both male and female before God split Adam into two halves.


First off, I don't presume to know anything about your proclaimed condition. I couldn't begin to imagine the moral dilema that you must have faced, when entering your quest for spiritual knowledge. I do know that we ALL have our own "crosses" to bear, when it comes to denying ourselves. Whereupon, the slightest acquiescing, might reveal just a glimpse, of what the Christ had to brave and conquer, every second of His life.

What I would like to understand, though, is who "they" are. And, how they, discard the Scripture when it describes God's attempt to quell Adam's loneliness with this animal or that one, prior to His creation of Eve? And how they got, ovaries, uterus, and other female reproductive organs, from, "rib"?



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by ddanielChristians use lines of scriptire to deny love to an entire subset of people (gays). Our 'Christian' nation, capable of relieving the suffering of so many fellow humans, instead uses its energy to wage war and create division. Our very society is structured in a way that encourages greed and deception!

But this is all fine. After all, we are helpless until Jesus comes back.


ahhhh .. religion... that 'protective veil' used by oh-so many as a means to 'ward off' that which they either cannot understand, accept or explain in life.


there is/was a member of the boards who once said,
'Jesus taught us the way, but instead of following In His Way, We Followed Him.


it struck a chord of sort with me at the time, and has always since come to mind in these type discussions.

I, too, think "He, They, It" would be aghast at what their little petri dish has since 'cultured' to and become..



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 05:00 PM
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Originally posted by 12m8keall2c

Originally posted by ddanielChristians use lines of scriptire to deny love to an entire subset of people (gays). Our 'Christian' nation, capable of relieving the suffering of so many fellow humans, instead uses its energy to wage war and create division. Our very society is structured in a way that encourages greed and deception!

But this is all fine. After all, we are helpless until Jesus comes back.


ahhhh .. religion... that 'protective veil' used by oh-so many as a means to 'ward off' that which they either cannot understand, accept or explain in life.


there is/was a member of the boards who once said,
'Jesus taught us the way, but instead of following In His Way, We Followed Him.


it struck a chord of sort with me at the time, and has always since come to mind in these type discussions.

I, too, think "He, They, It" would be aghast at what their little petri dish has since 'cultured' to and become..






This is one of the best quotes I've seen in a long time. You just summarized my thread in a sentence... Thank you!



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 06:10 PM
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Originally posted by ddaniel

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
there is/was a member of the boards who once said,
'Jesus taught us the way, but instead of following In His Way, We Followed Him.



This is one of the best quotes I've seen in a long time. You just summarized my thread in a sentence... Thank you!


I wholeheartedly agree. This is precisely the simple and concise summation I was hoping to find in this discussion. You have my thanks, 12m8keall2c.

But there's still a problem that can be readily pointed out by anyone who is familiar with the gospels. When Thomas was asking Jesus about where he was going and how they were supposed to follow him, Jesus replied. "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

So, there's still some room for confusion there. Jesus is the way to get to the Father, but is that connection meant for everyone or just his disciples? I think it's rather presumptuous to assume we can become part of that inner circle just for the asking. It's like walking up to an old shaman and expecting him or her to reveal all the secrets of their underworld. There's no way in hell he or she would volunteer that information.

That's how I see it, anyway. I could be completely wrong about this. I just feel that information pertaining to spiritual development, religious tradition, and enlightenment should be treated with the utmost respect and reverence; from the scientific method to paganism.



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 06:40 PM
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reply to post by temporalchameleon
 


Just a quick thing on your comment. Jesus says, "...no one..." That's an inclusive word that's describing all of humanity. Not just His disciples.



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 06:45 PM
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reply to post by GoOfYFoOt
 


I never had any moral issues with my garment with which I wear and it's unique gender expression.

As for Adam, it's been long descussed in Jewish (note Midrash and Kabbalah writtings) and Christian circles as well as in Gnostic and Hermetic (particularily in Alchemy) circles and in other circles.

Edit to add: This is a good simple start :
www.myjewishlearning.com...
(scroll down to 'And God Made Humans').



edit on 29-12-2012 by Arles Morningside because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 07:41 PM
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Originally posted by temporalchameleon

That’s a nice thing to say, but you’ll never be taken seriously by the vast majority of Churchians once you actually start forming your own“inspired” ideas about the scriptures and what they mean… unless you can convince some nitwits that you’re a prophet/prophetess. (Looking at you, Joseph Smith and Ellen G. White.)


Galatians 1:
6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— 7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.

Jospeh Smith and Ellen G. White both preached a different gospel than Paul.
Jospeh Smith even claimed to recieve his from an "angel of light"

2 Corinthians 11
And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15 It is not surprising, then, if his servants also masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.

Their views of scripture don't even stand up to the scrutiny of scripture, being easily proven as lies.
Ellen must have never opened the book of Hebrews, where the first chapter is spent disproving the claim that Jesus could have been merely a high ranking angel.
Smith doesn't even get his ideas from the bible, but had to create his own book to justify his views, and those views conflict with what is in the bible.




I’ve never met Jesus, but if he’s the kind of person who requires that I irrevocably submit to him and his will, than I want nothing to do with such a person. If you were in his position, would you enjoy leading a mass of people constantly looking to you for direction? Wouldn’t you rather those people, whom you saved, be truly free and able to think for themselves?


He loves us and it's for our benefit that he guides us.
He is the shepherd and we are the sheep.
Sheep are hopelessly lost and vulnerable without the guidance of the shepherd.
If He allows the sheep to be led by wolves, they will be led to their destruction.

If you think you are anything but a sheep with wolves waiting to devour you then you are in deception.

We are children who need our Father to guide us into what is right, so we don't hurt ourselves and hurt each other.




Woah! Don’t hurl those scriptural projectiles at me! I want to hear what you have to say about this, not Jesus.


What God has to say to you through His word is more valuable to you than anything I would have to say.
I only do my best to convey His truth.

Paul said in one of his letters to a church that he had resolved to know nothing but Christ and Him crucified when he went to them. For all his incredible knowledge and learning, he knew it was all worthless and meaningless compared with his ability to share the simple truth of the gospel with people - For the gospel is the answer to all their questions, the solution to all their problems, and in it they will find their purpose.
edit on 29-12-2012 by Rise27 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 08:44 PM
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Originally posted by wildtimes

The time came when I had to find out why I believed. The Christian faith hangs or falls on one premise and one premise only. The ressurection. If Jesus of nazareth didn't raise from the dead then it is all a bunch of crap and I don't need Christianity. On the other hand, if he rose from the dead then everyone had better take a scond look at this individual. Did he or didn't he?

That is the crux of the matter.

I've NEVER believed he did.


God still raises people from the dead in the name of Jesus.
Go google the miracles and accounts of it happening.

There are more reasons than just the scripture to believe it's true.
We still see the proof of it's truth today in the power of the Holy Spirit.
The things we read about in the book of Acts never stopped happening.



there is/was a member of the boards who once said,
'Jesus taught us the way, but instead of following In His Way, We Followed Him.



john 14
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also. 4 And you know the way to where I am going.”
5 Thomas said to him, “Lord, we do not know where you are going. How can we know the way?
6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you had known me, you would have known my Father also. From now on you do know him and have seen him.”

John 21:
And after saying this he said to him, “Follow me.”
...
21 When Peter saw him, he said to Jesus, “Lord, what about this man?” 22 Jesus said to him, “If it is my will that he remain until I come, what is that to you? You follow me!”


He Himself IS The Way.
You will find elsewhere in scripture that the only way you can actually follow in His ways is to follow Him, to abide in Him, to be led by His Spirit.
Never in scripture is there ever an implication that you can replicate Jesus's perfect life of obedience to God's will on your own. Righteousness, as we see in Romans 8 and John 15, is entirely dependant on a relationship with Jesus where He manifests His righteousness through us by the Holy Spirit.


Originally posted by ddaniel
This is one of the best quotes I've seen in a long time. You just summarized my thread in a sentence... Thank you!


I am somewhat dismayed at how some people are quick to applaud things which can be easily proven false by a couple scriptures.

In another thread I saw people rushed to applaud something about Constantine creating the bible, as though this was some great truth; when actually the entire premise of the original post could be shattered by showing simple proof that the gospel of John as we know it today existed at least over a century before Constantine.


Originally posted by temporalchameleon
Jesus is the way to get to the Father, but is that connection meant for everyone or just his disciples?


John 6
For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

Mark 16
And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.


I think it's rather presumptuous to assume we can become part of that inner circle just for the asking.It's like walking up to an old shaman and expecting him or her to reveal all the secrets of their underworld. There's no way in hell he or she would volunteer that information.

Your concept of God that is not true. He is generous, loving, and gives freely. We don't earn anything God gives us.
What Father wouldn't want to lavish His children in all the wisdom they care to seek, so that they can grow, do good, and avoid harm?
He always intended to give us these things, but we've got to ask and have faith.

James 1
5 If any of you lacks wisdom, you should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to you.

Matthew 7
7 “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 8 For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.
9 “Which of you, if your son asks for bread, will give him a stone? 10 Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake? 11 If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!

Matthew 10
Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, drive out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.

Luke 21
14 Settle it therefore in your minds not to meditate beforehand how to answer, 15 for I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which none of your adversaries will be able to withstand or contradict.

Proverbs 2
6 For the Lord gives wisdom;
from his mouth come knowledge and understanding;
7 he stores up sound wisdom for the upright;
he is a shield to those who walk in integrity
edit on 29-12-2012 by Rise27 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 09:14 PM
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Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by cantyousee
 


The time came when I had to find out why I believed. The Christian faith hangs or falls on one premise and one premise only. The ressurection. If Jesus of nazareth didn't raise from the dead then it is all a bunch of crap and I don't need Christianity. On the other hand, if he rose from the dead then everyone had better take a scond look at this individual. Did he or didn't he?

That is the crux of the matter.

I've NEVER believed he did. And the Bible tales are all hearsay...and there is ample evidence that he was part of the "mystic" school; there is NO REASON to believe that he wasn't simply "seeming dead"...and because he was so hastily brought off the cross and his legs not broken (it normally takes 3 days to die on the cross) he could have been attended to by his "healing" support circle.

A "resurrected from the dead" person will not be eating or drinking or showing off his hand-holes.

He did not. Great story, but, fiction.


^^EXACTLY!

I guess a resurrected god can work up quite an appetite after a crucifixion and resurrection! Now, if Jesus was a man who survived an ordeal, with the help of his friends and followers, I can respect that. I can even respect the fact that he was the victim of attempted assassination due to his unprecedented effect on the common people.

His teaching should be held in as much esteem as those of Buddha, whom he echoed, or of Confucious or Lao Tzu and other teachers who taught "The Way."

Unfortunately, the more scholars study the Bible the more we find out how it's been tampered with, added to and changed to meet the approval of the powers of the day. So much of what the Bible attributes to Jesus actually says is under question, making everything he is to have said, questionable. Not that some of it isn't inspirational and contains valuable insight, in itself.

If Jesus was resurrected, and was GOD incarnate, there was no sacrifice, just a puppet show.

In the end, I have to agree with you Wildtimes, it's a great allegorical story, but fiction.



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 09:53 PM
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reply to post by Arles Morningside
 


Good for you mate. Those scriptures in leviticus and romans are pretty black and white and you cant sugar coat them. I was taught it was bad like every other christian. I use to get angry when someone who was gay was around me and I thought they looked at me funny.I would think of punching some gay guy in the face if he did. I left my religion but still had those thoughts. The it hit me like a ton of bricks " what the hell am I do". Meditating and not reading the mind control book I got rid of those thoughts and the rest of the garbage that was put there. There is still remnants of it in me and there always will be. If I was still in my religion there was no way I could have hung out at a gay bar with some friends. Now it doesnt even fizz me and I have a laugh.Looking back it is such a caveman mentality. I am free and I am more spiritual now than ever. You can say I learned how to fish. I dont need someone giving me a fish.



posted on Dec, 29 2012 @ 11:08 PM
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"The natural man(Carnally Minded) does not accept the things of the spirit of God for they are foolishness to him. And he cannot understand them because they are spiritually appraised" (1 Corinthians 2:14)

Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near [me] with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men: Isaiah 29:13



posted on Dec, 30 2012 @ 12:35 AM
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reply to post by FaceLikeTheSun
 


How in the World are you getting from my statements that I am saying what you are asking me I am saying? I have never stated something as ridiculous as Numbers existed before the mind or what the hell is your point of asking me whether I think a Number is a tangible thing?

These questions are weird. I am fully aware that a Number is a word used as a representation to allow a quantitative count of something. Why you even ask or bring this up is beyond me as my posts have nothing to do with this.

What I have stated is that anything can be represented by Math. Also Multiversal Reality is by definition an Infinite System as a Universal Reality is Finite. Each Divergent Universal Reality is connected to a specific group. There are Infinite Numbers of Groups as well as Infinite Divergent Universal Realities within each Group. Humanity exists within one Multiversal Group of Alternate Divergent Universal Realities.

Within our Group there is a 100% Probability of the Existence of GOD as well as a 100% Probability of one of these Universal Realities not having the existence of GOD. This must be so in an Infinite System as all possibilities MUST exist.

How you are getting into a debate about Numbers is beyond me.

Split Infinity



posted on Dec, 30 2012 @ 01:44 AM
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reply to post by celticdog
 


In some areas of Judaism, there are interesting discussions about those particular mitzvot which may open one to consider that these mitzvot may not be so black and white. Very interesting stuff. All in all though, when it comes to scripture of any kind, it all really depends; for some it's black and white and closed, for others it is more open to discussion, you have the literalists and non-literalists, those who love the Bible but see it as falable, you have the diverse exoteric and esoteric traditions and so on and so forth. Very interesting stuff if you like getting into that and have the time to study all sorts of holy books and peer through the diverse angles of exploration.

I can understand in a sense those parts in mainstream Christianity which do have a more stricter way at looking at the Bible because my home town was a small town in Kansas where God and guns went hand in hand and diversity was not ok.



posted on Dec, 30 2012 @ 08:31 AM
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reply to post by Rise27
 


I am somewhat dismayed at how some people are quick to applaud things which can be easily proven false by a couple scriptures.

Rise27, sorry for your dismay....
but the reality is that "scriptures" are NOT PROOF of ANYTHING. The extant "scriptures" are not even proof of older scriptures that said the same thing...it is very well established that every "generation" of the "Bible," just like with cars.....is an "edited and translated" or "updated" (often poorly and with blatant "poetic license" or "personal bias" leading to revisions by the copier) version of something that came before.

In the case of scriptures, the ORIGINAL sources from which those copies of copies were made are long lost in the annals of man's violent history -- if they ever existed at all -- or are hidden away somewhere undiscovered as of yet.

Cross-referencing all of the ancient mythologies and comparing and contrasting them - and seeing that they have the same themes and ideas over and over again is PROOF ENOUGH that they all borrowed from other sources and each other. They are the immature musings and imaginings of early "thinkers" and "wisemen" at best, or by charlatans and snake-oil salesmen at worst. Con-artists are nothing new.

As for John's gospel being older than Constantine "by a hundred years (or whatever)" -- that doesn't mean squat either; John's gospel's earliest COPY is STILL 200 years AFTER the reported events....

Constantine called the "council" so that the bickering would stop among all of the various "sects" of "Christianity" that were up and going close to 350 years AFTER the reported events.

How can you seriously purport that "a couple scriptures" prove things "easily"? Really?

So, on Christmas morning, was the fact that there was a package in your home that was from "Santa" PROVE that there is a Santa? Answer: NO. Not even if it has a tag that says "From Santa". Not proof.



edit on 30-12-2012 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 30 2012 @ 08:50 AM
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reply to post by cantyousee
 


I hope you reconsider and come to God. Like him, that is my wish.

I'm quite cool with "God". I know what "God" ISN'T, from the source.


But in the event that you don't, remember that in the world to come there could have been a place for you.

Just because God is all merciful and patient doesn't mean he is gonna allow the controversy to last forever. Even as I write this the world as you know it is coming to an end. Satan is about to unleash his last spurt of evil. Like the death throws of a wild animal. Then the real Christ will come and my words will be vindicated. I implore you to look at the evidense and reconsider your position.

THERE IS NO EVIDENCE of any of that. There is only the violent and self-centered species of mankind that has raped and pillaged this, our home planet, ruthlessly, and destroyed other people.


But if not, we want rid of all who think like of you. There is no place for you in the world to come. Come and receive him today while it is still possible.


Wow.
You want "rid" of all who think "like of me"? I presume you mean "all who think like me." I'm a person who wants war to END, for everyone to SHARE, for greed to be EXTINCT, and for adults who believe in the above quoted "fantasies" to grow up and step up and do your part.

Consider yourself rid of me....notice how I'm not in your "church"? Notice how I'm not condemning you to hell and waiting on some invisible "hero" to show up and fix what ails us? How I'm not blaming an invisible "bad guy" for what PEOPLE DO TO EACH OTHER?

Yeah, I'm bad news.

Bad, bad news. Trouble with a capital T. A monster. A scary, lying con-man whose entire purpose in life is to threaten, warn, and scare others half to death and convince them they'll be tormented for eternity just for being human ----
Oh, wait!!
No....hold on...*thinking* ...OMG...that's a description of YOU!




edit on 30-12-2012 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 30 2012 @ 11:09 AM
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reply to post by SplitInfinity
 


you said:

"As far as numbers...we have devised a base Ten numerical system basically because we have 10 digits on our two hands and two feet. If we had say 12 we would be using a base 12 numerical system so YES...we have created the numbers to represent numerical quantities. "

I responded with:
"1+1=2 was true before we figured it out.Are you saying that only after we learned how to count our fingers was this equation true?"

I asked a question following your logic.

And on your multiverse proposition, you are equating God as being a finite entity. As I mentioned in a previous post, you are simply rendering words like infinite and eternal to the universe itself which warrants a pantheistic or monistic view of reality. That's all I am saying.

"Within our Group there is a 100% Probability of the Existence of GOD as well as a 100% Probability of one of these Universal Realities not having the existence of GOD. This must be so in an Infinite System as all possibilities MUST exist. "

This requires a re-definition of God. Again you are applying characteristics such as omnipresence, omnipotence, eternal, infinite etc and applying it to the universe itself. I don't understand why you don't see that. Replace "GOD" with goat and it would have the same proposition. Your statement can only be true if God was finite. This is the fallacy. God by definition is not finite.

So in other words, God being the Creator would have been the one who created the universe which has 100 percent probability of the existence of a given object, and another universe not having 100 percent probability of not having this object exist.
edit on 30-12-2012 by FaceLikeTheSun because: additional comments
edit on 30-12-2012 by FaceLikeTheSun because: spelling





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