It�s The Economy, Stupid, And It�s Good!

I know its from a iased site, but the numbers dont lie, we are not in as bad of shape as ol Skerry would have you believe. I am in Industry and I can see that things are actually growing to fast in some areas, that is what worries me, not depression. You cant really equate teh late 20's with what exists now.



It�s The Economy, Stupid, And It�s Good!


Lacking any real issues to run on, the Democrat Party and its candidate have been telling anyone who will listen that the United States is staring a new Depression in the eye. They cite the rising per barrel cost of oil, rising health care costs, and the �failure� of the Bush administration to create jobs, despite the fact that the government doesn�t create jobs; private industry and businesses, large and small, do that.

The 2003 edition of the Economic Freedom of the World Report ranked the United States third behind the city-states of Hong Kong and Singapore, noted Gerseman, who put things in perspective when it comes to labor market regulations. He cited the fact that Germany ranked 80th among the 80 countries examined. Italy came in 76th and France was 4lst. �Cowboy capitalism� works. The Socialism that controls the economies of Europe does not.


Senator John F. Kerry keeps saying �I have a plan�, but even a kindergartner could look at his economic plan and know that it would require dramatically raising taxes on everyone and everything to accommodate the socialist planning that would put the government in charge of the health system and impose other measures that would reverse all the gains made since 2001.


www.bushcountry.org...

Awesome news! And day after day the dollar keeps on plunging. But no one ever talks about that. Just the jobs, our kids have Mc Donald�s and Wal-Mart anyway, always plenty of jobs there.

Do you ever catch the news Ed? You know that box in your den that shows country music videos and Hogan's Heros? Turn the channel sometime.

There's a recession coming. And, no, you can't blame Clinton.

Want to know what Bush's base thinks?

Rich Americans losing confidence

Report finds rising oil prices and concerns about housing bubble erode sentiment of wealthy.
October 25, 2004: 7:49 AM EDT

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Wealthy Americans are becoming increasingly worried about the country's economic outlook, and their reluctance to spend and invest is hurting growth, according to a survey released Monday.

As oil prices boil to new records and Iraq continues to appear unstable, McDonald Financial Group's Affluent Consumer Confidence Index slid to 48 in the third quarter from 61 in the July poll.

More alarming, 42 percent of the people surveyed said the economy was headed in the wrong direction, almost double the number who thought so just three months ago.

So using your own arguments of "trickle down protectionism" and please help the starving rich I know you know so well, they think Bush sucks donkey turds in record numbers.

Allow the analysts to paint in purty...

With the presidential election only a week away, the results weaken President Bush's claim that Americans are better off now than they were four years ago.

And regarding It's the economy Stupid!

You're damn right it is...

"We think the findings of this survey are particularly significant on the eve of the presidential election as the affluent are known to vote in strong numbers," said David Legeay, senior vice president at McDonald Financial.

But that's just Bush's base of "haves and have-more's" losing faith in Bush-o-nomics. Guess what? It sucks all over.

Other sentiment surveys that target middle-class Americans have deteriorated steadily as the year progressed. The University of Michigan's mid-month reading of consumer sentiment for October fell to 87.5 from September's 94.2.

In the McDonald poll, 70 percent said a spike in energy costs posed a real threat for U.S. businesses, even as crude prices flirted with new record highs above $55 a barrel.

Fears that real estate prices had risen too far too fast persisted, with 54 percent saying they thought the country was facing a housing bubble.

But that's just one article from today. Look up the coming recession for yourself. Or keep waiting forever for Grandpa's Business Minute on Hee Haw.

Originally posted by edsinger
They cite the rising per barrel cost of oil, rising health care costs, and the �failure� of the Bush administration to create jobs, despite the fact that the government doesn�t create jobs; private industry and businesses, large and small, do that.

Well Du-h.

It is the job of the govt to create conditions under which there is employment. If it fails to do so, it must be help accountable, and I hope it would be.

Yeah, go ahead and blame it on small businesses.

Bush is a failure. Down with that guy.

Lets see , no one read it...yup!


No doubt much will be made of the working poor in America, pitting them against �the rich�, but Robert Rector, a senior research fellow at The Heritage Foundation, recently reported that �Overall, the typical American defined (by the Census Bureau) as poor has a car, air conditioning, a refrigerator, a stove, a clothes washer and dryer and a microwave. He has two color televisions, cable or satellite TV reception, a VCR or DVD player, and a stereo. He can obtain medical care. His home is in good repair and not overcrowded. By his own report, his family isn�t hungry, and he had enough money in the last year (2003) to meet his family�s essential needs.� What is considered �poor� in America is considered opulent by most of the world.

The recession, which began in March 2001 ended eight months later in November, making it the mildest as well as the shortest in the last 30 years.

Prior to September 11, 2001, President Bush, in office just nine months, was concentrating on getting the economy moving. On September 12th, his focus shifted to the task of protecting America from its enemies in the Islamic Jihad. Even with that burden and the nearly one trillion dollars the attack sucked out of the economy, by this year, the US was on track to enjoy a healthy, growing economy. Probably no other nation on earth could have survived such a devastating attack.

As Washington Times columnist, Donald Lambro, pointed out on Oct 24, �This is an economy fully in recovery�This economy added a net 1.8 million jobs in the last 12 months. Its low 5.4 percent unemployment rate is significantly lower than the 5.8 percent average of the 1990s. The annualized quarterly economic growth rates of the past year are much stronger than the 3.3 percent average growth rates of the 1970s, 80s or 90s.�]/b]


So now try again, it depends on ones perspective, notice the trillion dollar hit and we are STILL growing. Can you explain this?

Originally posted by edsinger
Lets see , no one read it...yup!

Before I read anything, I check the source. Maybe that's wrong, but if I can't trust the author, why read it?

Alan Caruba is the founder of The National Anxiety Center, a clearinghouse for information about media-driven scare campaigns designed to influence public opinion and policy. A veteran public relations counselor and professional writer, Caruba has emerged as a conservative voice through his weekly column, "Warning Signs", posted on the Center's Internet site (www.anxietycenter.com) and widely excerpted on leading sites including this one.

What is the National Anxiety Center?

The National Anxiety Center was founded in 1990 by Alan Caruba, a veteran business and science writer, as well as Public Relations Counselor. The original purpose was to debunk the many claims made by environmental and consumer organizations that were engaged in deliberately false, media-driven scare campaigns.

It was apparent that decades of having been told the Earth was doomed due to global warming or an Ice Age, that the nation�s forests were disappearing, that there was no place to put the garbage, that virtually every species was endangered, that drilling for oil or natural gas, or mining coal and other minerals was a danger, an entire generation of Americans had fallen prey to these lies.

And they are lies! The entire environmental movement is based on lies and deception, repeated every day. The movement has infiltrated our nation�s schools and churches.

Etc.

Hardly a reputable source. IMHO.

Originally posted by edsinger
So now try again, it depends on ones perspective, notice the trillion dollar hit and we are STILL growing. Can you explain this?

I believe I can. You see, borrowing money usually does not produce immediate problems. You can use it to pay workers to manufacture, say, cruise missiles with which you can productively pound some Middle Eastern Countries. The money the worker takes home is then spent on things like TV, which can then be used to productively watch the Superbowl. You register growth! After all is said and done, you discover that the interest payment is due and in the meantime you borrowed even more to cover basic necessities.

I kept encountering news, both local and national, about cuts and shortages in educational programs. That's just one example. Teachers buying classroom material with their own money. Starting this year, this ceases to be tax-exempt money, by the way (they buy it simply because the school district doesn't have enough, and the federal grants went).

The economy could still grow somewhat, but that's dead heat, as a lot fo resources needed elsewhere will be wasted just servicing the astronomical debt this administration has amassed. So growth will have much lesser effect on people's lives.




[edit on 25-10-2004 by Aelita]

I think it's pretty good that the economy is going down.

Honestly, we need some harder times to get things back under control. We can't keep pushing up and up with little restraints.

What will fuel that growth when we are busting at the seems to find sources to use.

Look the debt is not that bad, I dont care what anyone says, in a 11 trillion dollar economy, as long as growth is steady and spending growth is capped, the budget will be balanced........it will take time I agree, 911 wasnt easy, # the airlines still havent recovered.

Yawn, not this again. OK for you Bush folks out there the economy is not THAT good OK. It may be getting better but we are still in danger of economic stagnation like we saw in the 80s(but if you invested in the right companies in the 80s particularly after the crash of 87 and held throughout the 90s you would be laughing right now)

For you Kerry folks out there Recession is a possibility but it is waning IMO.
The higher Oil prices go(and really they aren't that high yet still have a ways to go to reach the Price shock levels of the 70s) at the rate that it is going I see a general shift happening. Demand is going to start to slip for Oil when it reachs mid-60s. Where are people going to turn to, well Ethonol/Gasoline blends are already getting more popular right now. As is BioDiesel. And lets not forget Wind, Solar, Tidal, Geothermal and Hydrogen. We are about to hit the next leg up in this 50 year boom cycle we just hit a speed bump on the way but whoever is in office the economy is just gonna keep getting better and better(barring Nuclear war that is).

If anyone has any doubts just read Quantum Investing along with How Stock Markets Crash and they should give you a general idea of what is happening right now.(and more importantly the WHY)

well flame away

Dude a gallon milk is four dollars right now, and your telling me the economy is fine? My wife and I spend more money on groceries and power than we do on our mortgage. It took Bush a grand total of four years to go from the first real surplus to the largest deficit in history, the tax cuts he pushes that supposedly boost this economy have been swallowed, as posted earlier in this thread, the rich aren't spending the killing they are making. Wages vs the GNP, Gross National Product always wins, and notice it doesn't say the Net National Product. No the economy is not fine, it is outsourced.

Originally posted by twitchy
Dude a gallon milk is four dollars right now, and your telling me the economy is fine? My wife and I spend more money on groceries and power than we do on our mortgage. It took Bush a grand total of four years to go from the first real surplus to the largest deficit in history, the tax cuts he pushes that supposedly boost this economy have been swallowed, as posted earlier in this thread, the rich aren't spending the killing they are making. Wages vs the GNP, Gross National Product always wins, and notice it doesn't say the Net National Product. No the economy is not fine, it is outsourced.

Well gas is $2.50, thinks are getting better quick, yes the dollar is falling and I do not think this is a bad idea, we need to get China to quit pegging the yuan to the dollar. As economies go, this one is definitly on the upswing.

Originally posted by edsinger
�Cowboy capitalism� works. The Socialism that controls the economies of Europe does not.

what you dont seem to understand, or just don't want to admit, is that YOUR COUNTRY IS NOT THE ONLY ONE THAT MATTERS. got that? For the largest economy in the world, of course cowboy capitalism works. Overall, it has a distinctly negative affect on the poorer nations of the world.

Originally posted by General Zapatawhat you dont seem to understand, or just don't want to admit, is that YOUR COUNTRY IS NOT THE ONLY ONE THAT MATTERS. got that? For the largest economy in the world, of course cowboy capitalism works. Overall, it has a distinctly negative affect on the poorer nations of the world.

Of course we are not the only one that matters, but when the US sneezes, Europe catch's a cold. Now maybe that will change but the US is 20+% of the world world economy and now that the US is growing out of the recession the others are picking up also.

Ed, you are about the most delusional person at ATS. Do you get your opinions directly from Bush or what?...

Delusional ??



Ok whatever....



psst......where do you think Dubya gets his ideas?

[edit on 5-12-2004 by edsinger]

Originally posted by edsinger Of course we are not the only one that matters, but when the US sneezes, Europe catch's a cold.

And viruses evolve. You really need to catch up on history, and pay attention to both the parallels to previous boom-bust cycles, and larger cycles of regional economic shifts. First: We are not similar to the '20's, we're similar (if not identical) to the 1940's just after the stock market crash inspired by the boom of electricity (we just had one inspired by the boom of digital technologies). Prior to the electricity boom, Europe was the world's strong center of industrialization, then the U.S. dominated the economy of consumerism brought on by cheap electricity. Today, a new economy is about to emerge brought on by cheap digital technologies and global networks. We (US) are not poised to take advantage of this boom as we were in the '40's, the pacific rim nations are. This next regional economic shift will see the power move from the U.S. to these pacific rim nations who are leapfrogging to a massively digital culture. History. Learn it... those who don't -- well...

Originally posted by Thorfinn Skullsplitter
Ed, you are about the most delusional person at ATS. Do you get your opinions directly from Bush or what?...

lmao! there is a secret republican 'what to think and say' mailing list, and ed is a long-time subscriber.

Originally posted by edsinger
Lets see , no one read it...yup!


No doubt much will be made of the working poor in America, pitting them against �the rich�, but Robert Rector, a senior research fellow at The Heritage Foundation, recently reported that �Overall, the typical American defined (by the Census Bureau) as poor has a car, air conditioning, a refrigerator, a stove, a clothes washer and dryer and a microwave. He has two color televisions, cable or satellite TV reception, a VCR or DVD player, and a stereo. He can obtain medical care. His home is in good repair and not overcrowded. By his own report, his family isn�t hungry, and he had enough money in the last year (2003) to meet his family�s essential needs.� What is considered �poor� in America is considered opulent by most of the world.

Gee these are the poor in America...???

'POOR'

and what do they have to do to keep all this stuff in working order...No...let me try and GUESS......Ehmmm...Hold 3 JOBS.!!.and lose their wife to some rapper coming round in his Hummer and watch his satelite TV and keep his couch warm ,right...
you can't be serious man...

Originally posted by Horus_Re
Gee these are the poor in America...???

'POOR'

and what do they have to do to keep all this stuff in working order...No...let me try and GUESS......Ehmmm...Hold 3 JOBS.!!.and lose their wife to some rapper coming round in his Hummer and watch his satelite TV and keep his couch warm ,right...
you can't be serious man...

No, not at all, just take a look around you. Yes there are really poor in this country but it is not near as bad as the left presents it.