Many souls released from Purgatory on Christmas, pray AND on a commercial flight, Mother Teresa spea

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posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:09 AM
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Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by colbe
 


Good job with the copy and paste, how about you deal with the actual quotes from the multiple Popes I posted.


A way to ignore those verses, many verses, You just copied and pasted. So silly. Purgatory is a teaching of the Church to be believed. You don't. So sad, you can change. Try to be nice again, okay?


I can go down that entire list and 'debunk' if you will the relationship to Purgatory. Here's a few at random.
1 Corinthians 15:29-30
Paul does not state the practice is good, he does not encourage it, he only acknowledges it happens and states what good would it do if there was no Ressurection. Now the more likely meaning of this verse is affirming that the people are baptized into Christ's death. This lines up perfectly with 1Cor 14:14-17, whereas Purgatory does not.

Matthew 5:25-26
Nothing at all to do with Purgatory. I have no idea why whatever website you pasted from linked this verse. Unless it's suggesting we can pay our own way out of sin. Do you believe that?
Matthew 12:32
Sin against the Holy Spirit. This verse says it will never be forgiven. So what does that have to do with Purgatory?

Seriously, rather than past 20 verses with nothing to do with the subject post a few that do please.




posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:14 AM
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Originally posted by colbe
Jesus wants you to become Roman Catholic and very soon.


No he does not, he does not want you to worship Mary or pray to her. He does not want priests to fiddle with children either. The church of Rome is not the only christian faith.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:16 AM
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Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by colbe
 


Pope John Paul II

the term purgatory does not indicate a place


Now if you don't care what the Pope says and you want to get around it by saying not all mysteries have been revealed that is fine, but the Pope speaks the Word of God in matters of Faith. Which means when he said that, it WAS all revealed. The Pope explicitly states it is NOT a place. He did not say not a place on Earth, or it's some other realm, he specificially states it is NOT a place, anywhere, at all, ever, it's a condition of being.

How much clearer can he get than saying it is not a place? Why is it that the Pope is wrong and you are right?

ETA: Just because you keep asking, I was never Catholic, and am not Protestant. I follow the Bible, nothing more nothing less. The Pope is a man, I follow no men in regards to spirituality, I have but One Father.
edit on 24-12-2012 by OccamsRazor04 because: (no reason given)


Well, you are your own authority, that makes it easy. Still, you're saying in the underlined, the Bible is your authority? By whose authority was the Canon decided?

You're protesting a Catholic teaching while you ignore the fact the Bible is a Catholic book. So, the Church
is right on some things but wrong on others, that's pretty confusing. And it's you who gets to decide when She is wrong? Pope John Paul II said Purgatory exists. You're denial of Purgatory doesn't matter.

Jesus wants you to become Roman Catholic and very soon.


The Bible is not a Catholic book. They did not write it. I leave you with this verse. Not all churches who followed God at one point still do.


1Ti 4:1 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

1Ti 4:2 Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron.

1Ti 4:3 They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.

1Ti 4:4 For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving,

1Ti 4:5 because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.

1Ti 4:6 If you point these things out to the brothers, you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, brought up in the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed.

1Ti 4:7 Have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives' tales; rather, train yourself to be godly.


Purgatory, Godless myth my friend. Seek God, not the Roman Catholic Church.
edit on 24-12-2012 by OccamsRazor04 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:17 AM
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Originally posted by colbe
Here is a help in brief...

Look at all these verses and if you are a Sola Scriptura believer, you can't ignore them.

~~~ ~~~ ~~~

Purgatory

Catholic Note:
Purgatory refers to a temporary state of purification for those who have died in the STATE OF GRACE but still need to get rid of any lingering imperfections (venial sins, earthly attachments, self-will, etc.) before entering the perfection of heaven.

Purgatory has NOTHING to do with ones justification or salvation. Those in purgatory are justified; they are saved. Purgatory has to do with ones HOLINESS and the burning away of remaining self-love. Revelation 21:27

It's true that the word "purgatory" doesn't appear in the Bible (neither do the words "Trinity", "Incarnation" or even "Bible"). However, what's important is not the word, but the doctrine. And the doctrine of the final purification of the elect, apart from heaven or hell, is clearly taught in both the Old Testament and the New Testament."

2 Samuel 12:13-14 - David, though forgiven, is still punished for sin
2 Maccabees 12:39-46 - Next day, they came to find Judas (since the necessity was by now urgent) to have the bodies of the fallen taken up and laid to rest among their relatives in their ancestral tombs. But when they found on each of the dead men, under their tunics, objects dedicated to the idols of Jamnia, which the Law prohibits to Jews, it became clear to everyone that this was why these men had lost their lives. All then blessed the ways of the Lord, the upright judge who brings hidden things to light, and gave themselves to prayer, begging that the sin committed might be completely forgiven. Next, the valiant Judas urged the soldiers to keep themselves free from all sin, having seen with their own eyes the effects of the sin of those who had fallen; after this he took a collection from them individually, amounting to nearly two thousand drachmas, and sent it to Jerusalem to have a sacrifice for sin offered, an action altogether fine and noble, prompted by his belief in the resurrection. For had he not expected the fallen to rise again, it would have been superfluous and foolish to pray for the dead, whereas if he had in view the splendid recompense reserved for those who make a pious end, the thought was holy and devout. Hence, he had this expiatory sacrifice offered for the dead, so that they might be released from their sin.

Side note: Though this book was rejected by the Protestant reformers and therefore is NOT in Protestant Bibles, one can not ignore the historical reality of this event and the reality of the words which were said.

Matthew 5:25-26 - "you will be thrown into prison and not be released until you have paid the last penny."
Matthew 5:48 - be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect (perfection is to be strived for on earth)
Matthew 12:32 - sin against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, in this age, or the next
Matthew 12:36 - you will have to account for every idle word on judgment day
1 Corinthians 3:10-16 - "if someone's work is burned ... the person will be saved, but only as through fire"
1 Corinthians 15:29-30 - Paul mentions people baptizing for the dead
2 Timothy 1:16-18 - St. Paul prays - asks that God have mercy on his dead friend, Onesiphorus.
Hebrews 12:14 - strive for that holiness without which one cannot see God
Hebrews 12:29 - For our God is a consuming fire
James 1:14-15 - when sin reaches maturity it reaches death
James 3:2 - we all fall short in many respects
1 Peter 3:18-20 to 4:6 - Jesus preached to the spirits in prison.
1 John 5:16-17 - Distinction made between deadly sins and one that are not deadly.
Revelation 21:27 - Nothing unclean will be allowed to enter into heaven.
See also: - Leviticus 26:41, 43; Isaiah 4:4, Isaiah 6:5-7, Isaiah 33:11-14, Micah 7 8-9:, Zechariah 9:11, Malachi 3:2-4, Matthew 18:34ff, Luke 12:58ff, Luke 16:19-31, 2 Corinthians 5:10, 2 Corinthians 7:1, Ephesians 4:8-10, Philippians 2:10-11, 1 Peter 4:6, Revelation 5:3, 13



Occams,

You said you follow the authority of the Bible and nothing else, that sounds pretty Sola Scriptura (Bible Alone) to me,
Sola Scriptura is a Protestant heresy originating from Martin Luther's mind not God.

Refute the BIBLE VERSES above then. Please explain the meaning of each one, OT too.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:21 AM
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reply to post by colbe
 


I already picked 3 at random and did so in a reply above. You copied and pasted verses that have NOTHING to do with Purgatory. Very few could be used for a weak case of Purgatory, but you would have to ignore much more likely meanings. I don't have time right now to debunk 20 off topic verses.

ETA: And I don't have to, your Pope has done the job for me by PUBLICLY stating Purgatory is NOT a place, there are NO souls there, and it's a state of existence on EARTH, part of the purification process.
edit on 24-12-2012 by OccamsRazor04 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:24 AM
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Originally posted by colbeYou said you follow the authority of the Bible and nothing else, that sounds pretty Sola Scriptura (Bible Alone) to me,
Sola Scriptura is a Protestant heresy originating from Martin Luther's mind not God.


It's only heretical if you are the RCC wanting complete control over people. Explain how those in remote areas living alone with no access to other people would learn and follow about God if it was simply their family and their Bible.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:26 AM
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Originally posted by OccamsRazor04

Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by colbe
 


Good job with the copy and paste, how about you deal with the actual quotes from the multiple Popes I posted.


A way to ignore those verses, many verses, You just copied and pasted. So silly. Purgatory is a teaching of the Church to be believed. You don't. So sad, you can change. Try to be nice again, okay?


I can go down that entire list and 'debunk' if you will the relationship to Purgatory. Here's a few at random.
1 Corinthians 15:29-30
Paul does not state the practice is good, he does not encourage it, he only acknowledges it happens and states what good would it do if there was no Ressurection. Now the more likely meaning of this verse is affirming that the people are baptized into Christ's death. This lines up perfectly with 1Cor 14:14-17, whereas Purgatory does not.

Matthew 5:25-26
Nothing at all to do with Purgatory. I have no idea why whatever website you pasted from linked this verse. Unless it's suggesting we can pay our own way out of sin. Do you believe that?
Matthew 12:32
Sin against the Holy Spirit. This verse says it will never be forgiven. So what does that have to do with Purgatory?

Seriously, rather than past 20 verses with nothing to do with the subject post a few that do please.


Your personal explanations above aren't convincing, they sound incomplete,

Sorry, the teaching on Purgatory is not from a link, I don't decide either, God gave the Church the authority to compile the Bible, He gave the Church the same authority to interpret Scripture, otherwise with men's pride, you could come up with a different meaning to every verse in the Gospel.

The fruit of deciding the meaning Scripture (private interpretation of Scripture) which is heresy are division
and error. God the Holy Spirit has not directed people to disagree over Scripture so much so, they start
their own Church.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:29 AM
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Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04

Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by colbe
 


Good job with the copy and paste, how about you deal with the actual quotes from the multiple Popes I posted.


A way to ignore those verses, many verses, You just copied and pasted. So silly. Purgatory is a teaching of the Church to be believed. You don't. So sad, you can change. Try to be nice again, okay?


I can go down that entire list and 'debunk' if you will the relationship to Purgatory. Here's a few at random.
1 Corinthians 15:29-30
Paul does not state the practice is good, he does not encourage it, he only acknowledges it happens and states what good would it do if there was no Ressurection. Now the more likely meaning of this verse is affirming that the people are baptized into Christ's death. This lines up perfectly with 1Cor 14:14-17, whereas Purgatory does not.

Matthew 5:25-26
Nothing at all to do with Purgatory. I have no idea why whatever website you pasted from linked this verse. Unless it's suggesting we can pay our own way out of sin. Do you believe that?
Matthew 12:32
Sin against the Holy Spirit. This verse says it will never be forgiven. So what does that have to do with Purgatory?

Seriously, rather than past 20 verses with nothing to do with the subject post a few that do please.


Your personal explanations above aren't convincing, they sound incomplete,

Sorry, the teaching on Purgatory is not from a link, I don't decide either, God gave the Church the authority to compile the Bible, He gave the Church the same authority to interpret Scripture, otherwise with men's pride, you could come up with a different meaning to every verse in the Gospel.

The fruit of deciding the meaning Scripture (private interpretation of Scripture) which is heresy are division
and error. God the Holy Spirit has not directed people to disagree over Scripture so much so, they start
their own Church.


Then do not believe me, believe the multiple popes who have publicly stated Purgatory is NOT a place. It does not exist as a place, there are no souls there, it's part of the EARTHLY purification process. Go debunk them if you like.

If you refuse to listen to the 'infallible' leader of your Faith then I will not waste my time. I have proven via your own spiritual leader Purgatory has no souls in it. Believe what you want. I am sorry you are so rooted in lies that your ears refuse to open for truth.
edit on 24-12-2012 by OccamsRazor04 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:33 AM
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reply to post by colbe
 


so they are released from purgatory tommorrow and catching a commercial flight somewhere?
what the heck does a commercial flight do with this? Have you got names of any of them and do you have their flight schedule?




posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:33 AM
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Originally posted by OccamsRazor04

Originally posted by colbeYou said you follow the authority of the Bible and nothing else, that sounds pretty Sola Scriptura (Bible Alone) to me,
Sola Scriptura is a Protestant heresy originating from Martin Luther's mind not God.


It's only heretical if you are the RCC wanting complete control over people. Explain how those in remote areas living alone with no access to other people would learn and follow about God if it was simply their family and their their BibleBible.


The old "control" objection doesn't work, you're not Roman Catholic and those born Roman Catholic don't always
remain Catholic.

You went back to something that belongs...originated from the Church, the Bible. You can't run from the faith
or ignore Christianity before 1517. The soon "awakening", God is going to personally show all of us the true
faith. Non-Christians too. From my heart, accept the Real Presence and you will be fine.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:35 AM
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Originally posted by Thurisaz
reply to post by colbe
 


so they are released from purgatory tommorrow and catching a commercial flight somewhere?
what the heck does a commercial flight do with this? Have you got names of any of them and do you have their flight schedule?



No, a person on a commercial flight sat next to Mother Teresa and she spoke to him of Purgatory.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:40 AM
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reply to post by colbe
 


May G_D continue to bless you brother, I look forward to seeing in heaven.
Praise The Lord Jesus Christ, may our prayers for those in purgatory and those of us here on Earth, be heard by G-D The Father Almighty, His only begotten son, Our Lord Jesus Christ, and The Holy Ghost. And a special prayer for you Steven, I know that your torment is great.
Merry Christmas



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:40 AM
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Howard Storm is not Catholic but after his NDE, he now believes in Purgatory.

~ ~ ~

...This is true in the case of Reverend Storm -- who himself acknowledges that some of his views have shifted since he became an active Christian ( including a few expressed in a book which was written before his faith was fully formed). These episodes are told through the filter of a person's framework.

But he is a man who exudes love (the single most important element of Christianity); many believe his experience was real; and he says he now believes not only in heaven and hell but also a state in-between where souls are "purged."

After his horrifying brush with death the concept of purgation was explained to him by a priest, says Reverend Storm, and "just rang so clear to me in my experience."

He says that when he "died" he was taken through a "foggy" region strikingly similar to what has been described in mystical literature [see An Unpublished Manuscript on Purgatory] -- and also similar to descriptions by modern visionaries who have told of a great "gray" area between hell and heaven.

Although a devout Protestant, Storm says that he considers Catholicism "the Mother Church" and is even interested in the Catholic apparition site of Medjugorje. He says God doesn't want division and that the main reason why he was on the road to hell was lack of love, pride, and disbelief...


www.freerepublic.com...



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:41 AM
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Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by Thurisaz
reply to post by colbe
 


so they are released from purgatory tommorrow and catching a commercial flight somewhere?
what the heck does a commercial flight do with this? Have you got names of any of them and do you have their flight schedule?



No, a person on a commercial flight sat next to Mother Teresa and she spoke to him of Purgatory.


oh well that makes more sense then... how long ago?



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:42 AM
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Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04

Originally posted by colbeYou said you follow the authority of the Bible and nothing else, that sounds pretty Sola Scriptura (Bible Alone) to me,
Sola Scriptura is a Protestant heresy originating from Martin Luther's mind not God.


It's only heretical if you are the RCC wanting complete control over people. Explain how those in remote areas living alone with no access to other people would learn and follow about God if it was simply their family and their their BibleBible.


The old "control" objection doesn't work, you're not Roman Catholic and those born Roman Catholic don't always
remain Catholic.

You went back to something that belongs...originated from the Church, the Bible. You can't run from the faith
or ignore Christianity before 1517. The soon "awakening", God is going to personally show all of us the true
faith. Non-Christians too. From my heart, accept the Real Presence and you will be fine.


How about, we deal with the Pope emphatically stating Purgatory is not a place. The only one running is you. I dealt with the origins of the RCC.

1Ti 4:1 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

1Ti 4:2 Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron.

1Ti 4:3 They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.

1Ti 4:4 For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving,

1Ti 4:5 because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.

1Ti 4:6 If you point these things out to the brothers, you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, brought up in the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed.

1Ti 4:7 Have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives' tales; rather, train yourself to be godly.


Purgatory as a place is a godless myth. The Pope says so too even.

There are numerous Catholic beliefs that are easilly destroyed, I would rather stick with Purgatory, as it's part of the OP.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:48 AM
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Originally posted by Violater1
reply to post by colbe
 


May G_D continue to bless you brother, I look forward to seeing in heaven.
Praise The Lord Jesus Christ, may our prayers for those in purgatory and those of us here on Earth, be heard by G-D The Father Almighty, His only begotten son, Our Lord Jesus Christ, and The Holy Ghost. And a special prayer for you Steven, I know that your torment is great.
Merry Christmas


Violator1, love your nativity painting and you too and everyone commenting. Purgatory is true, to those who
disbelieve.

Doesn't it make sense? God's justice demands reparation for even the smallest sins. I humiliated a sibling
once by bouncing a ball off their head from a second story window in front of their friend. I should have to
atone for this here or over the veil. Yes?


colbe



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:51 AM
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Originally posted by colbe
Purgatory is true, to those who
disbelieve.

Doesn't it make sense? God's justice demands reparation for even the smallest sins. I humiliated a sibling
once by bouncing a ball off their head from a second story window in front of their friend. I should have to
atone for this here or over the veil. Yes?


colbe


You don't believe in Catholocism any more than I do. The Pope has declared that Purgatory does not exist as a place, yet you maintain it does because it makes sense to you.

How do you expect others to follow Catholocism when you yourself refuse to?

Oddly enough, you're a heretic.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:53 AM
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Originally posted by colbe
God gave the Church the authority to compile the Bible, He gave the Church the same authority to interpret Scripture,


The "Church" is NOT just the church of Rome....



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 04:53 AM
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Originally posted by Thurisaz

Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by Thurisaz
reply to post by colbe
 


so they are released from purgatory tommorrow and catching a commercial flight somewhere?
what the heck does a commercial flight do with this? Have you got names of any of them and do you have their flight schedule?



No, a person on a commercial flight sat next to Mother Teresa and she spoke to him of Purgatory.


oh well that makes more sense then... how long ago?


Sorry, the thread title is a bit confusing but I wanted to fit in the wonderful story about Mother Teresa, it
was included in the original article. Check www.spiritdaily.com... article was reposted yesterday...from their archives. I am not sure on the year.



posted on Dec, 24 2012 @ 05:00 AM
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reply to post by colbe
 


It was 1996. And Mother Teresa, if that story is true, is a heretic as well since the Pope has declared there are no souls in Purgatory.





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