Evolution was an Islamic Theory Before Darwin was Even Born

The title is no mislead.

Yes I was doing some research for my college class, about evolution, the theory of giants.....
And me being who I am, A big believer/student of science and of God. I stumbled upon some pretty interesting information about evolution, then I did some youtube search. Found most of it in this video :



Adam and eve in Islam:

-Eve from Adam's rib: Most of the ideas that contradict evolution among Muslims are from the myths of other religions which were imported to Islam and attributed falsely to the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Our father Adam (peace be upon him) was preferred or chosen over other people of his time as Allah stated clearly in Quran 3:33-34, just like Allah chose any prophet after him also Quran stated in these verses that all were "offspring", Adam was included and Allah is never short of words.

-Creation of Adam in Heaven: There is no such thing in the Quran, Adam was reworded to stay in Heaven with his wife AFTER he won the contest against the angels (the naming of creatures) as Quran stated clearly in 2:35 and 7:19. When Adam disobeyed Allah and ate from the tree him and his wife were sent back to Earth.

-Why Adam disobeyed Allah? Because Allah didn't promise Adam to be immortal in Heaven, Adam was growing older and Satan promised him that if he ate from the immortality tree then he will not grow older. Quran: 20:120 and 7:20

-Creation of Adam from dust: We are all created from dust, just like our father Adam. Quran 18:37, Quran 30:20, Quran 35:11, Quran 40:67. -Adam was created suddenly: Just This verse is enough to refute such claim and there are many others Quran 7:11: And We created you (humans, in plural form), then fashioned you (made you in the image you are, also addressing humans in plural form), then said to the angels: Prostrate to Adam!

-How can Adam be our father if there were many humans?: The children of the smart man that Allah chose were the most fit to survive to our days (survival of the fittest), there are many other human species which we found their fossils only and they didn't make it to our time.

-How Adam children got married? If Adam and Eve were the only humans then the only answer is that brothers married their sisters, do you accept such answer? Of course there were other humans and Adam children married them.

-Allah is NOT a wizard, He does NOT pull new stars and new galaxies from a magic hat and certainly He doesn't do that for new species. Allah created and planned this universe on scientific laws; evolution is just one of them. Evolution means way more ingenious creator than a wizard who had to come to Earth and pull species one after another because he couldn't plan that from the beginning and you know very well that Allah is the best planner, evolution was part of the plan from the beginning of creation of this universe.

Please no Religion debates outside of evolution,science. I don't want someone bringing some half Quranic verse that he got from an "anti-islam" website telling me it proves some bull# evil about islam (I'm tired of that ) . All these "attacks" are answered tens of millions of times all over the internet. some islamic website have them all in a huge list and answering all of them. All you have to do is research it and read the the explanations from the SOURCE.

Interesting, but not surprising. The Arabs gave us Algebra and kept science alive during the dark ages.

What is it you wish to discuss or are you just sharing interesting information? It would be interesting (and I did not watch the video - text oriented here) to see where the Arab theory and Darwins theory are similiar and different. There's a paper right there.

Darwin observed nature. That is all. It's not a magic ritual he performed under the influence of supernatural control.

He just wrote down what he saw. I'm sure many great minds from history have though about, and pondered things beyond the accepted norm, and fallen by the wayside for being before their time.

Again and again and again.. Islamic science are second to none, Muslims are not the barbaric animals those satanic Zionist controlled media of the west wants us to believe.

S&F.

Ps.

Astrolabe is one of the thousands of examples of the Islamic science. Also check for the Omar khayam, Ibn Sina etc. (both are Iranian) etc…. not to mention Rumi.

I'll give the video a watch later, out of the interest of how they have put evolution and religion together


Thanks for sharing.

reply to post by 0SolidSnake0


Here is the little inside info on muslims, though ATS probably already knows this little Gem

Muslims in Middle East were no different from any other group of people on the Planet Earth

Just like Romans, just like British, just like Spanish, muslims too had their
empires that failed, their religion and way of life.

But then When United States and Russia started to use other countries as pawns
in their game of cold war. CIA went into Afghanistan and spent serious money
and Psy-Ops to create Jihadists called Mujaheddin back then in the 1970s

THIS MAN with his CIA buddies



Even went as far as changing books for schoolchildren turning them into religious
fanatics, and sending them like dogs against Soviet Tanks. And by the way Soviets
entered Afghanistan after their learned CIA was there big time. Not that Soviets needed
a big reason to respond.

And of course taking Palestine and calling it new country Israel didn't help the
matter, nor did it help when Israel started expanding little by little for decades.

There

You take muslims

Put them in a meat grinder

And you won't like what comes out

Aye me too,unfortunately I can't watch the vid right now which is a pity as this sounds intrigueing and I've never heard this before.

As one of those who's looked into evolution and learnt,read about it a fair bit over the years it's the only sensible,plausible theory this smart arsed p
rimate thinks comes anywhere close.

As I've argued,good naturedly,with a few people on this site evolution fits so nicely.In fact,you can tell it's the truth because at it's core it's beautiful in it's simplicity.

So hearing that evolution may have been first suggested by Islam is surprising yet not a shock.

If it wasn't for Islam keeping the flame of Greek and Egvptian knowledge alight after the fall of Rome and Europe's descent in to the Dark Ages.Ok modern archeology/history is discovering that the Dark Ages probably weren't the complete and utter collapse of European society previously thought nevertheless there was little room for science and enlightenment from 500 ad to late 14th century and the recovery after the Black Death.

Not only did Islam keep classical learning alive but greatly advanced medicine,astronomy,biology,egineering and much more in their own right.

If it wasnt for Islam where would the knowledge come from that lit the spark and fed the Renaissance.

So hearing the tenent of this thread isnt a great leap of imagination.In fact,I've no idea what Islam believes about evolution,in the past and certainly not at present.

Originally posted by amkia
Again and again and again.. Islamic science are second to none,

Do tell.

Pity all that god crap gets in the way, eh?

Chances are somebody thought about the ideas before Mohammed as well. People observing nature and theorizing about it goes way back. That doesn't somehow discredit Darwin's work or mean he stole it. Darwin gave it scientific validity. Evolution is obvious, but it's been shunned by religion for a long time, especially in the west.

Originally posted by 0SolidSnake0
Yes I was doing some research for my college class, about evolution, the theory of giants.....
And me being who I am, A big believer/student of science and of God. I stumbled upon some pretty interesting information about evolution, then I did some youtube search. Found most of it in this video :

Plato. Laws. Book X.

Go take a peek. Written 4 centuries before Christ.

Originally posted by FyreByrd
The Arabs gave us Algebra and kept science alive during the dark ages.

Algebra was created by the Babylonians, when they were the world's superpower, not by the Arabs.

And the term "Dark Ages" refer to a period of history about which, until recently, very little was known, and thus "dark".

Originally posted by Leahn


Plato. Laws. Book X.

Go take a peek. Written 4 centuries before Christ.

Algebra was created by the Babylonians, when they were the world's superpower, not by the Arabs.

And the term "Dark Ages" refer to a period of history about which, until recently, very little was known, and thus "dark".

I did take a deep peek on that don't worry. Never evolution is mentioned and described as good as Ibn khaldun and other muslims after him described it. Plato and Aristole tried to explain the relationship between living beings, They came up with the great chain of being, in fact Plato and Aristole believed in spontaneous generation of life . In Darwin's time scientists and thinkers , referred to evolution as a theory by muslims.

Yes, The origins of algebra's PRINCIPALS can be traced back to ancient Babylonian mathematicians roughly four thousand years ago, But they did not Create/INtroduce algebra. Also you can trace it back to other ancient civ like the Egyptians and the mayans, but most of it was lost. Math from their time was revived, Restudied by muslims such as Al-Khawarizmi (known as Algoritmi), his name is where the word algorithm came from . And Jābir ibn Hayyān (known as Geber) , where the word Algebra came from . Both contributed a lot to it, which is why they are called "Algebra" and "algorithm". Also the digits we use today in the west are Arabic numerals. And al-Khwārizmī introduced the "zero" modernly used.

Originally posted by FyreByrd
Interesting, but not surprising. The Arabs gave us Algebra and kept science alive during the dark ages.

What is it you wish to discuss or are you just sharing interesting information? It would be interesting (and I did not watch the video - text oriented here) to see where the Arab theory and Darwins theory are similiar and different. There's a paper right there.

not so much the "Arabs" surely, but the Persians?!

Originally posted by fastbob72
Aye me too,unfortunately I can't watch the vid right now which is a pity as this sounds intrigueing and I've never heard this before.

As one of those who's looked into evolution and learnt,read about it a fair bit over the years it's the only sensible,plausible theory this smart arsed p
rimate thinks comes anywhere close.

As I've argued,good naturedly,with a few people on this site evolution fits so nicely.In fact,you can tell it's the truth because at it's core it's beautiful in it's simplicity.

So hearing that evolution may have been first suggested by Islam is surprising yet not a shock.

If it wasn't for Islam keeping the flame of Greek and Egvptian knowledge alight after the fall of Rome and Europe's descent in to the Dark Ages.Ok modern archeology/history is discovering that the Dark Ages probably weren't the complete and utter collapse of European society previously thought nevertheless there was little room for science and enlightenment from 500 ad to late 14th century and the recovery after the Black Death.

Not only did Islam keep classical learning alive but greatly advanced medicine,astronomy,biology,egineering and much more in their own right.

If it wasnt for Islam where would the knowledge come from that lit the spark and fed the Renaissance.

So hearing the tenent of this thread isnt a great leap of imagination.In fact,I've no idea what Islam believes about evolution,in the past and certainly not at present.

I have read these eulogies of Islam before- I don't think it was ILSAM per se that somehow encouraged thought, some people may have been Muslims but it was not the Islamic religion ITSELF that somehow encouraged this free thinking mind

This sort of thought is a relatively modern invention to try and elevate Islam by western relativists and some Muslims

reply to post by Leahn



what this guy/woman said, right here, right now

Originally posted by Credenceskynyrd


I have read these eulogies of Islam before- I don't think it was ILSAM per se that somehow encouraged thought, some people may have been Muslims but it was not the Islamic religion ITSELF that somehow encouraged this free thinking mind

This sort of thought is a relatively modern invention to try and elevate Islam by western relativists and some Muslims

mmm.. Not true.
Islam, and the Quran did encourage these scientific studies. Yes it was Islam ITSELF. Study the golden age of Islam. Study about Al-Andalus where thinkers and scientists used to come from all over the world to study in it. The streets in it were fully lit while the rest of the world was in darkness. Study how the movements that it did in europe which later inspired and was followed by "The Renaissance" . A lot of the science and studies they made was lost and destroyed. When they were kicked out of europe by the Christians, who also destroyed all the trade routes. And a lot of the books/information were lost/destroyed when the crusades burned and looted the libraries .

Over the centuries following the First Crusade, many new ideas and inventions came back to Europe From the muslim worlds. Turks and Arabs and Persians. from with returning crusaders: the mangonel catapult, gunpowder, concentric castles, round towers, pointed arches, chess, better medical knowledge, alchemy, lateen sails, navigation instruments (the magnetic compass and astrolabe), windmills, wheel barrows, improved mathematical knowledge (the zero and algebra) and new musical instruments (the harp, shawm and lute). In contrast, the Muslims had little to learn from the west.

Also new products imported to Europe from the Middle East included: carpets, silk, cotton, spices (especially cinnamon, pepper and nutmeg), citrus fruits (oranges, lemons etc.), sugar and sweets (nougat and Turkish delight).
New domestic animals introduced into Europe as a result of contact with the Middle East include: donkeys, carrier pigeons and faster horses.

Anyone who studied History of that time in western universities know about all of this.



If you think that places like Afghanistan and Pakistan represent Islam. Then you know nothing of it. I always say don't mix culture with religion. Why they act the way they do I don't know. Check out Afghanistan during the 70's when islam was 99.6% of the population

I think islam needs some of that evolution...maybe try start with not killing there own muslims...then take it from there. Maybe you will evolve..like all false religions

Originally posted by rabzdguy
I think islam needs some of that evolution...maybe try start with not killing there own muslims...then take it from there. Maybe you will evolve..like all false religions

I always expect people like this.
Yes a lot of muslims and non-muslims definitely need some of this "evolution"

And so do You

reply to post by 0SolidSnake0


That Ibn Khaldun quote looks like Aristotle’s Great chain
en.wikipedia.org...
or
www.cod.edu...

and its wrong anyway – well as far as ToE is concerned

This second incorrect notion carries over into our thinking about species and evolution. The problem isn't helped by the fact that biologists often discuss certain features as being "lower" or "higher," or "primitive" or "advanced." The correct uses of these terms should imply nothing further than "older" and "younger" — i. e., earlier vs. later evolutionary appearance. There is no proper implication of "better" vs. "worse," or "more adapted" vs. "less adapted," or "simple" vs. "complex." They certainly don't mean "successful" vs. "unsuccessful." Bacteria are arguably the most successful form of life on Earth.
Our very best evidence indicates that, in reality, all species on this world have equal lengths of evolutionary history. The differences are the result chance differences in the pathways evolutionary movement takes. Evolution is ultimately about diversity, not about progress.

The modern sponge is just as evolved as modern man

Originally posted by racasan
reply to post by 0SolidSnake0

 

That Ibn Khaldun quote looks like Aristotle’s Great chain
en.wikipedia.org...
or
www.cod.edu...

and its wrong anyway – well as far as ToE is concerned

Yes, it is wrong.

No Ibn khaldun's "quote" doesn't look like a bit like Aristoles" great chain of being. I already addressed that in a previous post:
Plato and his student 's great chain of being has nothing to do with evolution. The genetic change and evolving of living being. Aristole and his teacher believed in what we already debunked. And you said it s wrong , spontaneous generation of life, Which has nothing to do with evolution.

reply to post by 0SolidSnake0


en.wikipedia.org...

One should then take a look at the world of creation. It started out from the minerals and progressed, in an ingenious, gradual manner, to plants and animals. The last stage of minerals is connected with the first stage of plants, such as herbs and seedless plants. The last stage of plants, such as palms and vines, is connected with the first stage of animals, such as snails and shellfish which have only the power of touch. The word 'connection' with regard to these created things means that the last stage of each group is fully prepared to become the first stage of the newest group.
The animal world then widens, its species become numerous, and, in a gradual process of creation, it finally leads to man, who is able to think and reflect. The higher stage of man is reached from the world of monkeys, in which both sagacity and perception are found, but which has not reached the stage of actual reflection and thinking. At this point we come to the first stage of man. This is as far as our (physical) observation extends.

from Muqaddimah

It talks about stages – starts out with minerals next stage is plants (no mention of micro organisms) and so on to the final stage man, which is why I think it’s just a repeat of Aristotle’s Great chain and why it’s not ToE – ToE doesn’t do stages