Martial Law/Nazi style policing beginning in 2013?!

Originally posted by AdamsMurmur

Martial Law/Nazi style policing beginning in 2013?!

Oh all the sensationalism and jumping to conclusions.

Paragould, AR, isn't exactly a safe town:

With a crime rate of 70 per one thousand residents, Paragould has one of the highest crime rates in America compared to all communities of all sizes - from the smallest towns to the very largest cities. One's chance of becoming a victim of either violent or property crime here is one in 14. Within Arkansas, more than 97% of the communities have a lower crime rate than Paragould.

From our analysis, we discovered that violent crime in Paragould occurs at a rate higher than in most communities of all population sizes in America. The chance that a person will become a victim of a violent crime in Paragould; such as armed robbery, aggravated assault, rape or murder; is 1 in 304. This equates to a rate of 3 per one thousand inhabitants.

Read the rest here.

Or should they just allow all that to keep happening?

Your serious...you would use statistics to support this blatant disregard for the rights of citizens. In the early 1930's Germany was in one of the worst situations it had been in, in centuries. Crime was up, poverty was up. The Nazi Party promised a rebound. They promised security. And that is exactly what Germany got. Until, their country lay in ruin and citizens asked themselves, "How did it come to this?" How many freedoms will we sacrifice for our security, before we look back and realize the monster we created. A gilded cage is still is still a cage, and safety at the expense of risking everything others have fought and died for is ludicrous. As an American, if you are an American, you should be ashamed of yourself for supporting this. Play the devils advocate if you must, but remember if you live to see the day that we are engulfed by our insecurities, and we are more afraid of our government than all else, that you and your statistics nursed its rise to absolute authority.

-LFD

reply to post by AdamsMurmur


Do you actually believe that groups of armed men roaming the streets at night will somehow get rid of the criminals? No, it may temporarily lower the rate of crime, but the criminals just stopped going out at night. The people didnt change. The situation is still just as dire.

How come no one is asking WHY the crime is so high and what they can do to counter those reasons? Not just patrolling and locking people up into for-profit prison systems.

There are real reasons behind these high crime rates; most likely poverty, drug addiction, a sense of abandonment, fear, anger....why arent we trying to get at the root of these issues?

I hate to sound like a cliche but where is the LOVE?

reply to post by JayinAR


As I mentioned in my first reply to this thread - I personally dont think locking all these meth addicts up will somehow fix the problem. Boots in the streets does not necessarily equate to safety in our homes. Rather it just makes more money for the prison system and spreads more fear.

Those people are addicted to an evil substance and need HELP not punishment... let me find a quote I heard recently that I think is appropriate:

Why is the drug czar of this country - Well, lets go back. Why do we have a drug czar in this country(A)? (B)Why is he a cop? Why isn’t he a guy in recovery, who’s had alcohol and/or drug addiction and overcome it? And why doesn't he help people with the same problem with compassion rather than condemnation? Why do we put people who are on drugs in jail? They’re sick. They’re not criminals. Sick people don’t get healed in jail. - Bill Hicks

Sweeping the dirt under the rug does not make it go away ...

reply to post by henryleo


When a person's drug addiction has taken them to the point of burglarizing peoples homes, damn right its time to sweep the dirt away.
I agree that drug addiction needs to be dealt with, but what they are seeing in Paragould is more along the lines of home invasion.

Originally posted by Mayson
Man, those darn Nazis/"commies". For all I know this is a good idea, but all people have to do is find some similarity between something and something the Nazis did and all bets are off.

On the surface I don't have a problem with it. I'm likely not doing anything illegal so what do I care if the cops check me out?

Whenever I've dealt with the cops they've always been helpful and respectful. Cops are people just like I you and I, they're not some faceless monsters. I'm not sure why people seem to be scared of them so much. I know there are some bad apples, but don't let them spoil the whole bunch.

Ya know, it's the same with gun owners or any other group really. Despite the actions of some bad eggs, they're really just like you.

Would you abuse this power too?

They may be good people, it doesn't change the fact that it is unconstitutional.

Originally posted by Starcrossd

"This fear is what's given us the reason to do this. Once I have stats and people saying they're scared, we can do this," he said. "It allows us to do what we're fixing to do."

That line really blows me away. People letting fear rule them= crazy regime laws. Oh boy.

I've heard it said fear is the seed of all evil. There is so much of it in these times. I think it's mostly those who fear the looming death of that 1950's Esq reality that's so tragically blind to the modern world; like a lot of my family. They really are starting to realize it, what they don't realize is their paranoia may very well give birth to something far worse. It's a witch hunt.

Originally posted by Doomcake

I've heard it said fear is the seed of all evil....

I believe that evil feeds off of fear. Fear doesn't spawn it.
A decent and good person who encounters them, will empathize with and console the fearful.
An evil person feels empowered by the same. And when they can't readily find it, they create it.

maybe its time a big group of us went to paragould once this starts and have a walk about? maybe refuse to show our papers? unless you want a bloody war, civil disobedience is our only option right now. lets go!

reply to post by W0mbat


"Don't worry we're going to do it to everybody."

That's what we are worrid about! Christ, this is out of hand. People should go to this town and protest.

I mean, they are going to have soldiers with semi/full auto rifles stopping everyone that walks by and saying "Can I see your i.d. (papers?)" in a search for what? Anyone they can arrest? And when people/teens run because they don't want to be confronted?

This is out of hands guys, we need to be calling this out and protesting.

I posted this a few months back... www.whitehouse.gov...

This executive order makes all this legal, and it was passed during Hurricane Sandy.

Such partnerships are critical to U.S. success at home and abroad, and we will support them through enhanced opportunities for engagement, coordination, transparency, and information sharing." This approach recognizes that, given the complexities and range of challenges, we must institutionalize an all-of-Nation effort to address the evolving threats to the United States.

reply to post by W0mbat


True or not. I would happily rot in jail to protest this action. One item from the half article you posted particularly incensed me:


"They may not be doing anything but walking their dog," he said. "But they're going to have to prove it."


That is not how policing works. The burden of proof is on the accuser. You could expect me to be one of the first of very many people to sue the city as a result of this nonsense.

Far more scary than the article itself is the comments section. Many people are willing to give up their freedom for the security of reducing crime. In this scenario, I would rather have a vigilante force patrolling the streets.

reply to post by AdamsMurmur

Originally posted by AdamsMurmur

Martial Law/Nazi style policing beginning in 2013?!

Oh all the sensationalism and jumping to conclusions.

Paragould, AR, isn't exactly a safe town:

With a crime rate of 70 per one thousand residents, Paragould has one of the highest crime rates in America compared to all communities of all sizes - from the smallest towns to the very largest cities. One's chance of becoming a victim of either violent or property crime here is one in 14. Within Arkansas, more than 97% of the communities have a lower crime rate than Paragould.

From our analysis, we discovered that violent crime in Paragould occurs at a rate higher than in most communities of all population sizes in America. The chance that a person will become a victim of a violent crime in Paragould; such as armed robbery, aggravated assault, rape or murder; is 1 in 304. This equates to a rate of 3 per one thousand inhabitants.

Read the rest here.

Or should they just allow all that to keep happening?

Oh my goodness!!!! Three people out of every thousand are victims of violent crime. So, the rationale of the city is to suspend the rights of remaining 97% all in the name of security and being tough on crime?

Laughable. Truly Laughable.

There is no sugar coating this chain of events. The response by the city is to unleash its Iron Grip on every living person in town. Much to the benefit of certain profitable industries to be sure. This is worse than laughable. It is truly pathetic. Their police department apparently is in need of new management. Direly. Sadly, Inept public officials always choose the most profitable and easily implemented strategy to combat problems. The police could bring the crime problem to virtually nothing with a strong, strategic leader at the helm.

Unfortunately, corruption abounds. The elected officials have their best interests at heart.

reply to post by W0mbat


You should all email him and let him know how you feel. It is not hard to find that mayors email online.

Originally posted by AdamsMurmur

Martial Law/Nazi style policing beginning in 2013?!

Oh all the sensationalism and jumping to conclusions.

Paragould, AR, isn't exactly a safe town:

With a crime rate of 70 per one thousand residents, Paragould has one of the highest crime rates in America compared to all communities of all sizes - from the smallest towns to the very largest cities. One's chance of becoming a victim of either violent or property crime here is one in 14. Within Arkansas, more than 97% of the communities have a lower crime rate than Paragould.

From our analysis, we discovered that violent crime in Paragould occurs at a rate higher than in most communities of all population sizes in America. The chance that a person will become a victim of a violent crime in Paragould; such as armed robbery, aggravated assault, rape or murder; is 1 in 304. This equates to a rate of 3 per one thousand inhabitants.

Read the rest here.

Or should they just allow all that to keep happening?

Oh right, 7 out of 100 people (7%, I know that may be hard for you) people commit a crime and .29% (there's a decimal there, in case you missed it) people are victimized in a really bad way... So we should go in and victimize everyone else. Even though the vast majority of the community are average non-crime-commiting folks. Yep, I totally understand how you think this is justice. In no way, shape, or form can your logic be interpreted as backwards, just plain unapologetically wrong, or possibly racist. In no way!

We should just do this in every unsafe neighborhood. Actually, the minority of people commit crimes all over the place - suburbs, city, country, whatever! We should just force everyone to have an identification and give the police the power to detain them without a reason! All of our problems solved!

While we're at it why don't we just go door to door to make sure no one is harboring illegal immigrants? Or better yet, everyone who has commited a crime can just be forced to wear a special badge for identification! And to make sure they don't take the badge off, why not tattoo it on them against their will? Or maybe just indefinitely detain them without a reason?

Originally posted by AdamsMurmur

Martial Law/Nazi style policing beginning in 2013?!

Oh all the sensationalism and jumping to conclusions.

Paragould, AR, isn't exactly a safe town:

With a crime rate of 70 per one thousand residents, Paragould has one of the highest crime rates in America compared to all communities of all sizes - from the smallest towns to the very largest cities. One's chance of becoming a victim of either violent or property crime here is one in 14. Within Arkansas, more than 97% of the communities have a lower crime rate than Paragould.

From our analysis, we discovered that violent crime in Paragould occurs at a rate higher than in most communities of all population sizes in America. The chance that a person will become a victim of a violent crime in Paragould; such as armed robbery, aggravated assault, rape or murder; is 1 in 304. This equates to a rate of 3 per one thousand inhabitants.

Read the rest here.

Or should they just allow all that to keep happening?

So, it's OK to harass the 930 people not doing anything wrong in order to catch the 70 that are?

"Bleat, bleat!" That's the sound a sheep makes. You mimic it well.

/TOA

I read about this the other day and was disheartened by the possible implications to the free law abiding citizens.

Many states have 'stop & identify' laws which provide the LEO's with the right to request identification.

The states I am aware of are:
AL, AR, CO, DE, FL, GA, IL, KS, LA, MO, MT, NE, NH, NM, NV, NY, ND, RI, UT, VT, WI

Though it may have changed since I had looked into this last year.

I do know that our supreme court has ruled on an issue of identification in the case of Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada where it ruled to uphold states rights requiring citizens to comply with presenting identification to police when they have reasonable suspicion regarding criminal activity.

I also am aware that a few years back the DHS presented an outline to state and local LEO's for the identification of possible suspects who pose a threat to society under the guise of terrorism. This outline specified that people who cited the constitution, were CCW holders etc.

Furthermore, training for LEO's has gone from privately funded institutes to federally funded sessions provided by none other than our DHS, FEMA and the TSA. These sessions, provide officers with needed skills and abilities, yet also outline ways to identify possible 'extremists'.

I'm sure many have heard or read about this already, so I will not give the details, but surmise as I do, this issue is beginning to bother me more than a little. Some here are already connecting the dots and seeing what is transpiring across this country. The thread which describes a woman who survived the Nazi regime starts to make more and more sense.

We are being conditioned to believe this is the norm and how a society needs to be if it is to achieve peace.

Originally posted by W0mbat

"[Police are] going to be in SWAT gear and have AR-15s around their neck," Stovall said. "If you're out walking, we're going to stop you, ask why you're out walking, check for your ID."

......

"They may not be doing anything but walking their dog," he said. "But they're going to have to prove it."

People talk about the Forth Amendment, but I don't know if the Constitution protects us anymore.

The Constitution requires separation-of-powers and people of integrity in positions of authority for it to be effective. Narrowly focusing on the Forth Amendment issue only, note that NYPD is stopping and searching people with no cause and our corrupt judiciary has refused to stop it. Note also that elements of DHS (TSA) are molesting people in airports, train stations, bus stations and other locations and our corrupt judiciary and congress refuse to halt this crime against our persons.

If the Constitution is to be ignored, where do we find protection? Do we need to hire mercs to protect us from the "government" and their enforcers? Taking cues from another era, could it be that perhaps these "patrols" need to be surrounded by mob, striped and given a good coating of hot tar and feathers?

Originally posted by prysmatyk

Furthermore, training for LEO's has gone from privately funded institutes to federally funded sessions provided by none other than our DHS, FEMA and the TSA. These sessions, provide officers with needed skills and abilities, yet also outline ways to identify possible 'extremists'.

I watched a video last year on a traffic stop where the driver had educational material on the Constitution. The police were recorded talking like this driver was carrying illegal contraband. Just when you think they can't get dumbed-down any further.....

BTW, I took an application on a police "Captain" not long ago. This guy was making $10 an hour in a rural area dominated by prisons, detention faculties and the odd sawmill or two. The guy had behavioral problems and was really quite unprofessional. I have no doubt that eventually we'll be seeing this guy, and his miscreant peers, on the evening news .....

reply to post by Darkphoenix77


I think they made things like this legal, if not exactly constitutional.

I'm not sure why people always hold the constitution in such a high regard as if it is the paragon of what is right. Just because it's in the constitution, does not mean that it's the right thing to do. It's why we can change the constitution if we need to.

It's similar to a bit of a pet peeve that I have. I get angry when someone proves their argument with a quote from someone famous. Of course, Einstein, or Franklin, or Jefferson might have had some good ideas, but that doesn't mean they were always right. Some of the stuff they said might have been "retarded". It's the same with the constitution; just because it was right before, does not mean that some of it isn't retarded.

Why not ID? It helps to keep illegal immigration and the erosion of wages that goes with it in check and makes the job of the police to find fugitives easier. All you have to do is carry some ID and hold it under an officers nose. If you arent wanted for bank robbery or the like, you can continue on your way.

If you want to get outraged about something the us did (is doing?) that the Nazis did, I would start with human experimentation.

www.abovetopsecret.com...