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Every country in the world has the same problems, you are never going to get rid of those. The problem i am talking about is mass shootings happening almost every month, i don't care what you say Sweeden doesn't have a problem like that. Yes it could happen, but it doesn't because you have sensible gun laws. Also, having licensed firearms doesn't stop petty crime, it just allows the ones doing the crimes to get their weapons easier.
Originally posted by Gauss
You must be joking. Sweden has one of the highest rates of armed robbery against money transports in the world. We have a growing problem with organized crime. We have biker gangs like Hell's Angels and Bandidos (mainly the former) pushing people for money, assaulting them, harrassing them and otherwise threatening innocent people. And let's not even get into our judges and witnesses threatened by these people when they are to testify against them.
And yes, licensed firearms would deter these jackasses from pulling that sort of crap.
Really, you have stats that backs up your opinion that America would be safer if they didn't take guns from the streets, but actually put even more guns on the streets! I would like to see those stats, because there are also stats out there that prove when you remove guns from the streets, there will be less deaths from guns in the long run.
First of all, I'm a proponent of a law similar to those in Sweden when it comes to storing weapons, so I'm not even going to dignify the first part with an answer. And as for the second part, it's been proven in statistics. You should look it up. But then again, those statistics have been shown in these kinds of discussions a thousand times, and if you really was open to change your opinion, you would have known this already.
My points still stand about the mugger with his gun to your head, will your training get you out of that situation too? I don't think so, but keep pretending.
Thanks. Flattery will get you everywhere. But one does not have to be a superhuman badass like me to keep a criminal with a knife away. One only has to take Krav Maga classes. A lot of the people in these classes are women half my size learning to defend themselves - against criminals. Guns are part of the curriculum, incidentally.
Well i don't tell her she should have carried a gun, that's for sure!
Really? REALLY? What do you think a woman who has been raped has to say about gun control? What do you think a man who survives a public shooting in a gun-free zone has to say about gun control? Huh?! You should try to talk to them about gun control and see how they react. You're the one who is trying to take away their right to defend themselves, NOT ME, so don't you pull that crap on me!
Ok, so for the sake of the argument if i agree that owning a gun for defense could be a good idea, as long as it's a hand gun. Can you give me a good reason to want to own a Semi-auto rifle? (the main part of my argument)
You have made your points, and they have all been - if you'll excuse the pun - pointless. I have shot each one of them down, as have my comrades in arms (again, do excuse the pun) here on your posts to them, but somehow you seem to miss this every time we do it. Selective blindness or something, I don't know.
Same as above.
You haven't proved anything, you've just spouted your ignorant opinion on issues you have proven to know nothing about.edit on 19-12-2012 by Gauss because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by liverlad
1) Guard dogs are also proven to be a good deterrent for house bugaars, guns just increase the chance of you getting shot while trying to chase them out. Also, not all petty criminals carry guns, or they wouldn't if the country you lived in had tougher gun laws, which is a fact.
2) I will ask you the same question as the other lad, how did Americas gun laws help protect all the victims on the killing sprees over the years? Armed civillians couldn't stop it, as it all happens too quick for anyone to react. So that argument is flawed.
3) That's just your paranoia kicking in again, but even if this did happen to you and he had a knife at your throat, you would have a cut thoat the instance you went for your gun.
4) Same as above, that's a fear based on paranoia.
Ok, so for the sake of the argument if I agree that owning a gun for defense could be a good idea, as long as it's a hand gun. Can you give me a good reason to want to own a Semi-auto rifle? (the main part of my argument)
Originally posted by liverlad
Every country in the world has the same problems, you are never going to get rid of those. The problem i am talking about is mass shootings happening almost every month, i don't care what you say Sweeden doesn't have a problem like that. Yes it could happen, but it doesn't because you have sensible gun laws. Also, having licensed firearms doesn't stop petty crime, it just allows the ones doing the crimes to get their weapons easier.
The statistics have been posted by Lightcraft. Read 'em and weep.
Really, you have stats that backs up your opinion that America would be safer if they didn't take guns from the streets, but actually put even more guns on the streets! I would like to see those stats, because there are also stats out there that prove when you remove guns from the streets, there will be less deaths from guns in the long run.
I will ignore your pretending comment and apologize. I typed wrong. This particular discussion was originally about a knife to the throat, not a gun. I have edited accordingly.
My points still stand about the mugger with his gun to your head, will your training get you out of that situation too? I don't think so, but keep pretending.
Well i don't tell her she should have carried a gun, that's for sure!
Ok, so for the sake of the argument if i agree that owning a gun for defense could be a good idea, as long as it's a hand gun. Can you give me a good reason to want to own a Semi-auto rifle? (the main part of my argument)
Originally posted by liverlad
]Every country in the world has the same problems, you are never going to get rid of those. The problem i am talking about is mass shootings happening almost every month, i don't care what you say Sweeden doesn't have a problem like that. Yes it could happen, but it doesn't because you have sensible gun laws. Also, having licensed firearms doesn't stop petty crime, it just allows the ones doing the crimes to get their weapons easier.
Really, you have stats that backs up your opinion that America would be safer if they didn't take guns from the streets, but actually put even more guns on the streets! I would like to see those stats, because there are also stats out there that prove when you remove guns from the streets, there will be less deaths from guns in the long run.
My points still stand about the mugger with his gun to your head, will your training get you out of that situation too? I don't think so, but keep pretending.
Well i don't tell her she should have carried a gun, that's for sure!
Ok, so for the sake of the argument if i agree that owning a gun for defense could be a good idea, as long as it's a hand gun. Can you give me a good reason to want to own a Semi-auto rifle? (the main part of my argument)
Same as above.
Originally posted by tabov
Sad country the US has turned into. Neither side is 100% correct, but the "distribute more guns" mentality is definitely the wrong way to go.
I, an american, have chosen to live outside the US, I just couldn't bear discuss everyday with extreme far left/right mentalities and positions you see on display right now in the US, it's either religious, economic, politics, overseas policies, war, everything, just makes me sick.
You can keep the country to yourselves. No tolerance at all, BOTH SIDES. You can high-five each other all you want, America is going down, and the divide is clearly coming from within. Keep your guns, you'll need them.
I, as an american, can say, I'm glad to be out. YUCK.
Originally posted by liverlad
That's my point, many people only feel the need to own one because they live in fear, and why do you think that is? My guess is because America has terrible gun laws.
Originally posted by LightCraft
The big fear here is being powerless to prevent bad things happening to good people.
Originally posted by Darkphoenix77
Originally posted by liverlad
That's my point, many people only feel the need to own one because they live in fear, and why do you think that is? My guess is because America has terrible gun laws.
Originally posted by LightCraft
The big fear here is being powerless to prevent bad things happening to good people.
I think the big fear here is that the world has terrible people tbh.
Pandora has already been released from the box, that ship has already set sail. Unless you have a time machine (if so please share), nobody can go backwards in time to prevent Europe from the advances in cannon and gun technology or better yet go back to when gunpowder was invented by the chinese.
Banning all guns simply put would never work, just as a ban on nuclear technology at this point will not work.
Not being from the United States any foreigner voicing thier opinion on rewriting our founding document to allow the government to ban the use of civilians to own firearms is as ludicrous as trying to get all nations of the world to dismantle all their nuclear arsenals all at the same time with no country trying to pull the wool over the rest of the worlds eyes. Simply put, it just is not going to ever in a million different dimensional realities ever happen. The world is full of bad people, that my friend is a fact of life and no argument to the contrary will ever change that fact.
I do not personally own a gun but know other people close to me that do. That being said I would never presume I had the right to enforce my choice on anybody else. I would rather have the choice to be able to own a firearm over the lack of choice to make that decision for myself. These are dangerous times we live in and in this country not you, me, the government, or the tooth fairy have the right to take others rights away from them, end of story. Making more strict regulations on firearms will do absolutely nothing constructive, and I daresay would be the exact opposite and be detrimental to our society as a whole. People have the inalienable right to if the need arises defend themselves from all the filth that currently resides in the world we live in. This will not ever change as long as evil exists in the world and not to be pessimistic, but I don't see evil going anywhere anytime soon. Instead of harping on the banning of guns people should be talking about getting a bit more strict with bad parenting, the lack of easily obtainable mental health services in this country, and the stigma that is attached to those with mental health issues. Until we as a world populace address these issues, we will be hard pressed to see any significant improvement in relation to these tragedies happening.
This is just my $0.02, your mileage may vary.
edit on 19-12-2012 by Darkphoenix77 because: punctuationedit on 19-12-2012 by Darkphoenix77 because: again punctuation
Originally posted by dampnickers
reply to post by LightCraft
www.wnd.com...
A whole 25 years that have been murder free in "Guntown" USA.
I hate guns, but when it comes to it, this town has had no murders in 25 years.
Originally posted by ProfessorChaos
Awesome thread! The biggest threats to the safety of American citizens are the Media and ill-informed, reactionary people.
The obvious logic behind maintaining the 2nd Amendment is lost on people who are too frightened to think for, and protect themselves.
Having to resort to arguments like "Ban the car" "Ban Knives" etc. etc. in order to get the point across only highlights the idiocy of those that propose the banning of guns and the nullification of the 2nd Amendment.
Instead of getting rid of guns, why aren't we talking about getting rid of CRIMINALS?! Making guns illegal to own will NEVER stop a criminal from obtaining one, it will only leave more law-abiding people open to being violated both by criminals and the government.
As for all of these supposedly "gun-friendly" politicians who are warming up to the idea of a ban, I say we remove them from office and remind them that ultimately, it is NOT up to them, but to us (THE PEOPLE).
Originally posted by six67seven
reply to post by LightCraft
Sorry LightCraft, but I can only star your posts once
We are the militia, always have been. I am confident, when we are called to action, our numbers will be 10 times that of the U.S. active duty military... and given that a majority of the military will be fighting WITH us -- I think we'll be just fine.
The 2nd amendment is are part of us, plain and simple.
Originally posted by torqpoc
Originally posted by six67seven
reply to post by LightCraft
Sorry LightCraft, but I can only star your posts once
We are the militia, always have been. I am confident, when we are called to action, our numbers will be 10 times that of the U.S. active duty military... and given that a majority of the military will be fighting WITH us -- I think we'll be just fine.
The 2nd amendment is are part of us, plain and simple.
A nation of paranoid deluded people, governed by a murderous and lying government, itching to pull out their semi and fully automatic weapons to defend the mighty US of A.
Comical doesn't even come close to the reality of this situation.
Flame on!
T