Is There Such a Thing as a Positive Illuminati?

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posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 03:56 PM
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We all know that the Illuminati is basically a negative force. They are the ones who wish to promote the current slave system we know as reality.

Does anyone know of a positive equivalent who are fighting these people behind the scenes? Are there equally powerful forces which ward off the negative the Illuminati wishes to spread. I do not wish to go into much detail, but I feel that I have been aided by such forces lately which have allowed me to endeavor freely in my artistic path.




posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 03:57 PM
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Originally posted by Jdawg9909
We all know that the Illuminati is basically a negative force.


If you are refering to the Bavarian Illuminati they were anti-Vatican and anti-monarchy so I would have considered them a positive force.

Just my opinion.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 03:58 PM
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If there isn't, we should start one. Who's with me?



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:01 PM
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Depends on what you think the illuminati is.

Ive heard things ranging across the board. From they are the evil controlling the current system, to they are trying to actually fight the current system of old world bankers/Vatican, Supposedly trying to implement a meritocracy.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:02 PM
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reply to post by Jdawg9909
 


That is a great question OP!!!!

As I see it how can we tell? Look at the term New World Order being thrown around.......

As I see it, the NWO is being touted by the same Old World Order which seems to have been quite succesfull in enslaving all of us.

Could the names been stolen and use for nefarious purposes to create confusion???

I certainly do not know the answer, but you definately bring up what I would call a pretty good conspiracy and another aspect of confusing us to the point that we no longer can distinguish what is good and what is bad.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:12 PM
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Sorry for the one liner but I couldnt resist.

In mathematics we know that a negative and a positive gives us a negative.
So no Illuminati is a positive


peace



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:27 PM
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Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

If you are refering to the Bavarian Illuminati they were anti-Vatican and anti-monarchy so I would have considered them a positive force.

Just my opinion.


so was hitler.

edit on 17-12-2012 by randomname because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by Jdawg9909

We all know that the Illuminati is basically a negative force.


I wouldn't say that.



Are there equally powerful forces which ward off the negative the Illuminati wishes to spread.


there's en.wikipedia.org... which believes like you.. that the Illuminati are 100% completely evil... however some consider them the Uncredited Anonymous Benefactors of Humanity.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:40 PM
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No organisation can be considered + or - it has more to do with the actions of the members of that organisation, for example there are some biker groups who do amazing work for their community which bucks the perception of biker groups and there are some religious organisations that are so full of hate that they have no positive impact.

The bigger questions are the ones we should be asking ourselves, do I create harmony or discord, do I advocate compassion or anger, do I have a positive or negative impact on those around me etc.

So to answer your question yes it is possible as long as the group as a whole can answer those same questions in a positive manner.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by randomname
so was hitler.


Hitler and the Vatican had a working understanding, He did not do anything to seriously curtail the Vatican's jurisdiction and neither did the Vatican greatly impede his designs.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:47 PM
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here are descriptions of two different groups that are called by the generic moniker
'illuminati'




The Bavarian Illuminati is probably the most misunderstood secret society in modern history. Adam Weishaupt (1748-1811) founded this "new" secret society in the 1700s, but it was indeed not new at all; it's been around for thousands of years but under different names. During Weishaupt's lifetime, however, this organization was revealed in public. The Bavarian Illuminati in an earlier form created the Knights Templar and Freemasonry to safeguard ancient esoteric knowledge from coming into the hands of the Power Elite and was set up as an opposition to the powers-that-be.





The Illuminati (not to be confused with the Bavarian Illuminati) is a very secretive group of occult practitioners who have been around for thousands and thousands of years and are using the Jewish Cabala as one of their guidelines to oppress the rest of the population. It is not a boys' club or a group of adults trying to get some excitement in life; this is something much bigger and much more sinister. It is an extremely well structured organization consisting of people in very High Places. Those people are the Super Wealthy, who stand above the law. Many of them don't even appear on the list of the wealthiest people in the world - they are that secret. What is driving them is power, money and control over life and death of others and themselves.


this is from this pdf.
WesPenre
from this website
Illuminati News



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:47 PM
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reply to post by Jdawg9909
 


jesus H. christ!


an Illuminati/enlightened/initiated person

is a person whose conscious AND subconscious has merged into SUPERCONSCIOUSNESS

that's all it is, they are refered to as illuminated/enlightened because of the light that emanates like a halo from them.

our mason friends here either do not know this [though josh norton does]

or it's one of their "secrets"

do you understand now, why all the "Illuminati are evil" propaganda?

look at those who make that claim:

only people speaking out ignorance or from being their enemies/targets make such claims
edit on 17-12-2012 by DerepentLEstranger because: added comment



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:49 PM
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Originally posted by DerepentLEstranger
an Illuminati/enlightened/initiated person

is a person whose conscious AND subconscious has merged into SUPERCONSCIOUSNESS

that's all it is,

our mason friends here either do not know this [though josh norton does]

or it's one of their "secrets"


There is nothing in Masonry which refers to this nor it is a Masonic 'secret'.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:50 PM
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Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by randomname
so was hitler.


Hitler and the Vatican had a working understanding, He did not do anything to seriously curtail the Vatican's jurisdiction and neither did the Vatican greatly impede his designs.


true , also Hitler was Rothschild bloodline



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 04:52 PM
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This is not going to be a popular opinion (but then the truth is never popular), but how can there be a "positive" Illuminati if there is no "negative" Illuminati? The Illuminati doesn't exist as portrayed by conspiracy theorists - the Bavarian Illuminati was indeed real, but was more of a progressive thinking organization than anything else. For its time the Bavarian Illuminati's ideas were radical, but it was disbanded by the Bavarian government and has not existed for centuries.

The "Illuminati" as the term is commonly used today is a device to support thinking that seeks to simplify our chaotic, complex world into a simple reality of things being run by some malevolent behind the curtains evil. It may be more comforting to simplify the world into black and white, but its just not real.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 05:06 PM
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Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus


There is nothing in Masonry which refers to this nor it is a Masonic 'secret'.


wasn't accusing dear fellow

and i did say masons might not know this

as i said, i'm pretty sure josh does know this.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 05:10 PM
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Originally posted by DerepentLEstranger
and i did say masons might not know this


Definetly not as I said this is not something taught in Masonic ritual nor is it a part of Masonic dogma.


as i said, i'm pretty sure josh does know this.


I am not going to answer for him but I would be surprised if he said anything of the sort.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Jdawg9909
We all know that the Illuminati is basically a negative force.


If you are refering to the Bavarian Illuminati they were anti-Vatican and anti-monarchy so I would have considered them a positive force.

Just my opinion.


In fact, according to their founder, Weishaupt, their primary purpose was to 'perfect human nature'. He felt he had to remove the influence of corrupt governments and religious institutions and work to undermine them in secrecy to achieve his goals of perfecting man's character and morals. I think to some extent libertarians and some liberals would find his ideas interesting.

Unfortunately they are also profoundly unbiblical since it is impossible to perfect man, without God's Holy Spirit. Nevertheless Thomas Jefferson was a fan of Weishaupt, but felt that there was no need for secrecy and that he could have operated the Illuminati openly in the US.

Later the name took on a much more sinister connotation and modern day groups that adopt this name tend to be occultists or satanists.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 06:40 PM
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I'll have to go with the other posters who said "define Illuminati". There is a thread on ATS from a guy who claimed to be a member. He was kicked out for using a few ID's in his thread, but it was an interesting journey. People were very interested to get an inside look at the mystique.

My opinion is that we don't know what is good and bad and I certainly don't buy the idea that we are forced into being brainwashed. That itself is as close to deliberate brainwashing as it gets.

Other than that there are mechanism in place that keep the profits rolling in that serve various entities. If you hate the system you hate all of them, or maybe you love all the chattels of capitalism, but neither polarity is necessary.

From what I know the elites cannot be illuminated as such. They would have to be dark if their desires were nefarious, but I don't claim to know the hearts of the rich and powerful, nor do I assess them as especially bad. It seems to me that we all too often place our own morality onto others, which by rights should have no effect on them.

I have been saying for a long time that the are TPTB are those most aligned with nature, because they are the ones who understand the plan and see things happening with more wisdom, more love, more evolved etc.

I've never read / heard an account of the Illuminati that wasn't incredulous, and the people talking about them as though they are the enemy are always talking from outside the system, with the intent to destroy. It could be looked at as a catch cry for the disenfranchised that has no basis in truth whatsoever.



posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 06:41 PM
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reply to post by SevenThunders
 




Later the name took on a much more sinister connotation and modern day groups that adopt this name tend to be occultists or satanists.


Is this an opinion or do you have examples?





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