Millions of Americans have children and own guns.....and are not buying in.

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posted on Dec, 19 2012 @ 09:08 PM
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Originally posted by riverwild
Could it be the games that triggerd the outrage?

Connecticut school massacre: Adam Lanza 'spent hours playing Call Of Duty’
The Connecticut school massacre gunman Adam Lanza spent hours playing violent video games such as Call Of Duty in a windowless bunker, according to an interview with a plumber who worked at the family home.

www.telegraph.co.uk...



But there are no kids in that game. The only link that could be suggested is the shooting part and the shooting part is up againt data that shown zero link when you look at the numbers that play shooter games.




posted on Dec, 19 2012 @ 09:10 PM
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reply to post by Donkey_Dean
 


And there you have it!

2nd line



posted on Dec, 19 2012 @ 09:13 PM
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Originally posted by kingmonkey


You equate freedom with a tool of oppression, seems like a strange concept.

Am I not free if I cannot own a gun?


I am all boned up on rhetoric.

Anyway we see gun ownership as a tool against oppression. And no if you cant own a gun you are subjugated to some measure.



posted on Dec, 19 2012 @ 09:13 PM
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Originally posted by SpeachM1litant
reply to post by litterbaux
 


You are right. It is too late to implement gun control in the United States. There are too many gun already in circulation, your society is already too perverted and corrupt, violence is ingrained into your culture since birth, the government and millions of Americans are sick people and gun culture is too embedded into your society. This debate has come way too late. There is nothing anyone can do about it.


It takes courage to be free, and far greater courage to allow others to be free.
Government regulation of the manufacture, sale, and possession of firearms.
There have been attempts through regulation and legal battles to vindicate the rights of Gun owners.

In some states, the state education departments have enacted
Regulations on sugary and fatty foods sold in school lunch lines and vending machines,
What personal areas of life the attitude that “government knows best” will intrude next: “If They can do this in day care centers,middle and high schools why shouldn’t it be mandated in the home?”

.....Background checks for gun owners.....

Soft drinks sold at middle and high schools have also been regulated.

.....Magazine capacity limits,Bullet bans.....

There have also been proposals to include indications of obesity on a child's report card,children on public assistance who have high body mass index scores would be forced to undergo screening annually with an eye to making them lose weight, under measures being considered by the legislature.
.....Gun show restrictions,Instant records check.....
Some of the legal issues of obesity relate to insurance access,
Risk management and obesity-related discrimination.
....Gun storage requirements.....
Obesity discrimination has been claimed against certain transportation industries because of seating and ticketing rules and accomodations.
.....Bans on auto-loading firearms.....
....Buy-back programs.....
.....Trade-in programs.....
.....Licensing machine guns.....
.....Licensing silencers.....

Help others defend their natural human rights, even when none of yours are at risk.
It's just a matter of time before government turns its focus on you.
It's then you'll need others to return the favor and support the rights that you hold dear.



posted on Dec, 19 2012 @ 09:21 PM
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Originally posted by MissingRonnieR
This is inside the Beltway at its best. Gallup today reflects the Nations view that this is more about Mental Illness, Violence in Culture and Protecting Schools from crazies than about guns.

Democrats miss the point that most Americans have made the decision that we must protect ourselves as D.C. is more concerned with the "rights" of the criminals.


Democrats today represent those that were schooled to disregard the bill of rights. The reason they lean into facts with such vigor is that they have been brainwashed to see facts as lies, or somehting that is in their way.....and they are "winners".

Remember a comment made by one of the nations top five dems....."we can read it later" on the passing of the health care bill.

edit on 19-12-2012 by Logarock because: n



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 12:14 PM
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Originally posted by Donkey_Dean

Originally posted by kingmonkey
reply to post by Donkey_Dean
 


You're obviously a passionate citizen which I can appreciate.

A lot of what you say makes a good amount of sense and has certainly enlightened me somewhat.

As an outsider looking in however, I guess I'll never fully understand the American psyche.

Thanks for the response.


Underneath the corruption and war mongering we are a moral society. I imagine not unlike yours. We most certainly have problems as our media purports to be the voice of the American people and our elected offices go the persons willing to spend the most money etc.. We hardly have a perfect system of government and foreign and or special interest can and do control policy etc..

The real America does not have a voice, when we vote for a president it a choice between two persons who have been pre selected by corrupt systems. We do however maintain a balance of power by purchasing and keeping all the arms we can get a hold of! It is a silent trust, and it most certainly does keep tyranny in check.

I know that sounds like some more American dribble, but if Hitler had come to power here I like to think we would have taken him out pretty quickly! It would likley take a Hitler to awaken this Giant..
edit on 19-12-2012 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)


Hitler had the backing of the German people at the time, but I take your point.

I don't think I'll change my opinion about gun ownership in the US but your posts have certainly made me look at it from a different perspective.

I guess corruption is rife in most governments and to be honest, the whole US election process seems almost farcical at times. It does seem that the bulk of American ATS users are unhappy with their government and their vote at election time comes down to a choice between the lesser of two evils.

This may be sacrilege to suggest, apologies if so, but would you be better off splitting up the Union? Does Washington adequately look after the interests of your own State?



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by kingmonkey

Originally posted by Donkey_Dean

Originally posted by kingmonkey
reply to post by Donkey_Dean
 


You're obviously a passionate citizen which I can appreciate.

A lot of what you say makes a good amount of sense and has certainly enlightened me somewhat.

As an outsider looking in however, I guess I'll never fully understand the American psyche.

Thanks for the response.


Underneath the corruption and war mongering we are a moral society. I imagine not unlike yours. We most certainly have problems as our media purports to be the voice of the American people and our elected offices go the persons willing to spend the most money etc.. We hardly have a perfect system of government and foreign and or special interest can and do control policy etc..

The real America does not have a voice, when we vote for a president it a choice between two persons who have been pre selected by corrupt systems. We do however maintain a balance of power by purchasing and keeping all the arms we can get a hold of! It is a silent trust, and it most certainly does keep tyranny in check.

I know that sounds like some more American dribble, but if Hitler had come to power here I like to think we would have taken him out pretty quickly! It would likley take a Hitler to awaken this Giant..
edit on 19-12-2012 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)




This may be sacrilege to suggest, apologies if so, but would you be better off splitting up the Union? Does Washington adequately look after the interests of your own State?


No splitting the union wouldnt work. In fact you may be interested to know that one of the greatest supporters of our 2nd amendment was also a strong supporter of our union. He held that if our union was disolved our lot would be worse that Europes lot. This guy was James Madison the 4th POTUS. We can in fact give him most of the thanks for the Union and the 2nd amendment.

In fact madison felt that the 2nd was an important part of keeping the union by keeping states strong in the face of an out of control federal central power even though he was a supporter of central power. People of his day hated central power so much that what he did to get the states to ratify the constitution was a miracle.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by MissingRonnieR
This is inside the Beltway at its best. Gallup today reflects the Nations view that this is more about Mental Illness, Violence in Culture and Protecting Schools from crazies than about guns.

Democrats miss the point that most Americans have made the decision that we must protect ourselves as D.C. is more concerned with the "rights" of the criminals.


Democrats today represent those that were schooled to disregard the bill of rights. The reason they lean into facts with such vigor is that they have been brainwashed to see facts as lies, or somehting that is in their way.....and they are "winners".

Remember a comment made by one of the nations top five dems....."we can read it later" on the passing of the health care bill.

edit on 19-12-2012 by Logarock because: n


Would you please stop trying to make this a partisan issue? I am independent yet I side most times with Democrats lately. You are not doing anybody a favor by trying to turn this into a left VS right issue because it is not. One of the main reasons the presidential candidate the right was pushing did not earn my vote is that his campaign was based off the same premise that we needed to elect him to hear what his plans were. Both sides use that tactic and to try to make this partisan only clouds the issue at best.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 02:39 PM
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Originally posted by Grimpachi

Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by MissingRonnieR
This is inside the Beltway at its best. Gallup today reflects the Nations view that this is more about Mental Illness, Violence in Culture and Protecting Schools from crazies than about guns.

Democrats miss the point that most Americans have made the decision that we must protect ourselves as D.C. is more concerned with the "rights" of the criminals.


Democrats today represent those that were schooled to disregard the bill of rights. The reason they lean into facts with such vigor is that they have been brainwashed to see facts as lies, or somehting that is in their way.....and they are "winners".

Remember a comment made by one of the nations top five dems....."we can read it later" on the passing of the health care bill.

edit on 19-12-2012 by Logarock because: n


Would you please stop trying to make this a partisan issue? I am independent yet I side most times with Democrats lately. You are not doing anybody a favor by trying to turn this into a left VS right issue because it is not. One of the main reasons the presidential candidate the right was pushing did not earn my vote is that his campaign was based off the same premise that we needed to elect him to hear what his plans were. Both sides use that tactic and to try to make this partisan only clouds the issue at best.


I am an independent myself. The reason I say things like the above is to simply point out the mentality of the anti gun gang.

But really you didnt vote for Mitt for the reason you stated but you vote Obama whos biggest supporter was the one that made the comment...."we can read it later"?



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 03:33 PM
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reply to post by Logarock
 


I said it was one of the main reasons I didn’t vote for him. We had two choices and I voted mostly on issues. Mitt didn’t represent the things I believe in and his inability to outline a plan with any substantial details was a major concern. I am involved with renewable energy and Mitt planned to cut all funding which would have set America back many years. I simply disagree with what little information he revealed about his plans on many issues. I did not feel he had the best interest of the nation in mind.

On the issue of the shooting and gun control I think if you truly wish to be heard you would be better served if you didn’t try to make this a partisan issue. Try to keep in mind the left outweighs the right in the election and by trying to demonize a demographic will only make them band together. I am not left or right but when you use language meant to divide like saying all democrats are against something you will only strengthen the resolve of those who actually are that way. Democrats do not all believe in the same thing many are gun owners. That kind of talk does not help the situation, it is my opinion that kind of talk will be self-defeating in the end.

Use facts and knowledge to make your points because the partisan talk even makes me wat to distance myself from the conversation which I am pro gun.
edit on 20-12-2012 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 04:00 PM
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reply to post by Grimpachi
 


Oh Lord! I am being lectured to by a person about being partisan that probably voted thus because of hopes thats some green money will start flowing into his Alternative Energy account. Which reminds me that I need to toss some wood into the stove.
edit on 20-12-2012 by Logarock because: n



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 04:02 PM
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Originally posted by Logarock
I have five children. If my children were to be victims like those in the school shooting I would certainly feel the same way as the parents of those children.

Having said that it wouldnt move me one bit to change my 2nd amendment convictions. I and others, many others, are not going to allow the emotions of this event to shape a revision in our views. Knowing that millions have died over the ages fighting for freedom we cant let slip away from us these freedoms and these rights.

Further more I plan to pass down this understanding to my children as many others will do. I salute all who love freedom and the light of truth on this issue.



Of course not. I'm not the type to blame an inanimate object for the actions of a bad person. If someone runs down my kid with his car, I don't blame the car, I blame the person.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 04:07 PM
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Originally posted by NavyDoc

Originally posted by Logarock
I have five children. If my children were to be victims like those in the school shooting I would certainly feel the same way as the parents of those children.

Having said that it wouldnt move me one bit to change my 2nd amendment convictions. I and others, many others, are not going to allow the emotions of this event to shape a revision in our views. Knowing that millions have died over the ages fighting for freedom we cant let slip away from us these freedoms and these rights.

Further more I plan to pass down this understanding to my children as many others will do. I salute all who love freedom and the light of truth on this issue.



Of course not. I'm not the type to blame an inanimate object for the actions of a bad person. If someone runs down my kid with his car, I don't blame the car, I blame the person.


If it were one of those green cars I may blame Obama.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 04:12 PM
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reply to post by Logarock
 


I salute you for that, I am very upset as an American and a gun owner when the government dares to come forward in the news and try to talk in my behave and try to tell what I as an American think and want

I want the clown monkeys in congress to stop using me like been "most Americans" and stop trying to pass laws in my behave that I don't want and I has not asked for

The diversion that the government is using with the massacre in Conn is obscene and the families of the victims should be outraged, the government doesn't care and they never will, they only using these horrendous crime to turn it into an opportunity as usual



edit on 20-12-2012 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 04:13 PM
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Originally posted by MrSpad
That is the worst possible idea ever. It is just as bad as banning guns. People are far more likely to shoot themselves or an innocent than they ever are a rogue gunman. Considering how many people die at home already because so many idiots have guns the last thing we want are those idiots trying to play hero. It is to bad we do not have a test to figure who responsible gun owners are and who the idiot/nut bag ones are. Until you can do that you are just adding more idiots and nut bags with guns and that never ends well.


More people carry guns than you think and you probably don't even notice. It is my understanding that one of the dead teachers or counselors at that school had a concealed carry permit, but, didn't bring their weapon because of the "gun free zone"law.

The problem with gun laws is the people who obey them are the ones that you don't have to worry about in the first place. The only thing laws are good for is to keep score after something happens to decide the amount of punishment to give to the perpetrator.

As far as drunk driving laws and statistics are concerned, that is a subject for another thread. Drunk driving isn't the problem that it is being made out to be, it is just a revenue generator for certain governments, businesses and organizations.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by Logarock
 


Listen you are being an arse now. I do not make any money off of alternative energy but I have done studies and support it. Your attitude is what is wrong with people in this nation. Go ahead be partisan all you want. Regardless of what you are registered you are acting extremely partisan. I can see now that trying to appeal to rationality is useless with you. I am telling you strait out though you are not doing us gun owners any favors with that mentality and seeing as how you seem like you’re going to play the left right game I will just leave you be. As I said before you aren’t doing us any favors.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 04:44 PM
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reply to post by Grimpachi
 


There. I gave you a star. Now leave me alone.


In this debate that is now and is coming folks that try to play nice guy are going to get run over.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 05:33 PM
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reply to post by Logarock
 


Great so it seems your idea is to polarize the issue into a democrat vs. republican when the democrats have the advantage and some support from the right. Just brilliant I am starting to wonder if you are playing for the other side otherwise I can confidently say your tactic is on par with shooting yourself in the foot. Thanks for nothing.

I will leave you to your own demise now. Have at it bub.



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 05:53 PM
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Scene - my farm last night 0035 hours....

15 year old daughter .410 shotgun in hand, headlamp on and her winter overalls enters our room.

Daughter: Dad, something has the geese all riled up I can hear them out my _ I'm going to go make sure it’s not coyotes.

Me: Ok, be careful.

Daughter: What load do you have in here the PDX still or the shot?

Me: I think shot...

Daughter: (skillfully ejects round and catches it mid air...) Yep, it’s the shot. I'll be back in a few.

Wife: (waking) What was that all about?

Me: Kid's going to check out the pond, might be coyotes.

Wife: Oh...Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Me: She'll wake us if there is an issue.... Zzzzzzzzzzzzz

Her confidence with firearms and self confidence in dealing with threats comes from a lifetime of associating with firearms in a safe environment and good training.

Our confidence in her to handle it properly and be safe comes from the same.

Bottom line is not everyone grows up in an environment of gun-fear.

Firearms are a tool, noting more nothing less.

Teaching kids to fear them is not the answer.

Teaching them to respect and use them for their intended purpose is.


edit on 20/12/2012 by Golf66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2012 @ 06:08 PM
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reply to post by Grimpachi
 


Yep just great.





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